a you say both on 1 & 4 the gasket shows signs of damage, but is that enough ? I don't know, I was looking for something more than that, thought hat was only water jacket sealing, nothing appears between cylinders going out

ballboy said:

can't see any damage on underneath of head gasket, photos of thermostat show muck in the holes of the case, (re they bypass holes ?) in the rocker box side I found what looks like broken rubber off valve stem seal, really don't see why I got those compression readings as nothing looks that bad,

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Presumably you do have a good battery and can turn the engine over at a reasonable rate?

varesecrazy said:

did it "overheat" / go HOT.. or just die at the side of the road..??,

the 8V engines are easy for a Head Gasket change, bolts are re-useable,
so it's a £10 / £15 job,

I've never skimmed one yet,and always holds fine for the years I keep the cars :worship:

TBH do the timing.. as I've no reason to suspect anything other than poor timing will lead to a "backfire"

the 8V's will run acceptable @4 teeth out of time..,
but not run at 7..!!,
been there done that

Charlie - Oxford

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why everyone recommends skimming after engine overheats?

ballboy said:

a you say both on 1 & 4 the gasket shows signs of damage, but is that enough ? I don't know, I was looking for something more than that, thought hat was only water jacket sealing, nothing appears between cylinders going out

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? If the cylinders blow in and out of the water jacket then compression is going to be bad. You are not forced to get gases passing directly between cylinders if the head fails

just looking again at the gasket, you're right it is rusty, also with gasket off the block all show signs of rusty marks, I was looking at the cylinder metal seals and think they are ok, but now looks like head gasket was gone, but anyone else's view please,

ballboy said:

just looking again at the gasket, you're right it is rusty, also with gasket off the block all show signs of rusty marks, I was looking at the cylinder metal seals and think they are ok, but now looks like head gasket was gone, but anyone else's view please,

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YES, looks like a fair bit of rust/ water tracking,
not got access to my old HG pics - for comparison,

:idea: look at he Cinquecento HG GUIDE for reference,

https://www.fiatforum.com/cinquecento-seicento-guides/136702-cylinder-head-gasket-remove-refit.html

Charlie

looking at the head, it will need skimmimg, there is corrosion around a couple of water holes, and raised areas around 2 of the cylinders, I don't know anyone locally who skims/recons heads so it looks like ebay at £160, as lad needs car next week, not sure what to do, buy a secondhand car, or fix this and get him insurance on my car so he can get to work next week,

ballboy said:

looking at the head, it will need skimmimg, there is corrosion around a couple of water holes, and raised areas around 2 of the cylinders, I don't know anyone locally who skims/recons heads so it looks like ebay at £160, as lad needs car next week, not sure what to do, buy a secondhand car, or fix this and get him insurance on my car so he can get to work next week,

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At the end of the day it is not your responsibility to get him to work. You have busted your balls already in the cold and wet. How long will another cheap car last if this was one is ruined?? It has to be asked, he is sufficiently responsible to be driving your car!

Dress the areas as best you can and rebuild, the gasket goes on as-is NO gasket goo required - CLEAN + dry is a MUST though..!!
repair the cooling system,
and keep a careful eye on levels.

my method of torqueing..;

I've a click-stop wrench and do the LOW figure ( 60?) quoted with gasket,
+ 90' + 90' (etc..)

THEN,
I get an angular deflection ( old style) torque wrench,
and go around in the same "cross" pattern noting the torque indicated when it starts to "give",
after doing all the bolts to a "creep" I then go around again to the Max figure I've just seen / felt - You'll be amazed how slack some will seem - then once done ALL the bolts are guaranteed down to the same torque..!!

as I say ,
the Quoted figure is almost "screwdriver tight" so plenty of scope for inaccuracy

and then the 90' steps are awkward.. my method helps ensure conformity with the uniform pulling down of the head.

ballboy said:

right took the head off,
photos attached, can't see any damage that would cause the compression problems, the is damage to cyl 1, but it looks old, not taken head gasket off to look underneath, but cyls look clean, and no movement side to side,

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Do a leak down test on the valves.
make sure all 4 plugs are in..and cover the valves with petrol.


and watch and see if the petrol disappears.. if it does valves will need repair..
if not clean the head up ..a gentle skim with a Stanley blade to take off goo and oil,,
and just put a gasket on.

some people use water.

couple of problems lead me to think head needs working on, some large bits of broken rubber stem seals, can't see any oil inside inlet/outlet ports, but it got on the plugs somehow, (2nd compression test) . there are defined ridges on the cylinder head around the pistons & piston sealing ring on the gasket

ballboy said:

couple of problems lead me to think head needs working on, some large bits of broken rubber stem seals, can't see any oil inside inlet/outlet ports, but it got on the plugs somehow, (2nd compression test) . there are defined ridges on the cylinder head around the pistons & piston sealing ring on the gasket

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can't help on the Ridges.., that's YOUR Call..,

gasket seals water AND OIL Channels.. state of gasket could force water and OIL into cylinder at failure..,

do a leakdown test as described ( suggested) over the last few pages

Charlie

Like I say, think its a re-con/skimmed head need, I would not be confident that this head was any good as it is, so would always be waiting for phone call saying we have broken down

A set of valve seals is around £12 or less. There are DIY methods to remove the valves and replace them. To get the spring off you can use a socket with a magnet inside to catch and hold the retainers

If the head only has a few high spots rather than large areas of low spots you can sand down the small amount of high spot using sand paper ideally glued to a small block - just a small hand block would do it.

If you get the car going again the next buyer can then drive it away which is a big plus for a buyer. Worth a punt?

Anyway it could be a project to keep the mind active

the water inlet at the end of the inlet manifold has melted as well

ballboy said:

the water inlet at the end of the inlet manifold has melted as well

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Sorry - think you mean "rad-Weld Chamber" :yuck:

see why we are reluctant help in such instances..it's never "just" a simple gasket swap when it's been so badly treated..rant over..!!

ballboy said:

the water inlet at the end of the inlet manifold has melted as well

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That is the water outlet to return water to the pump via the pipe that has the o-ring leak. Difficult for me to see what is going on there but the o-ring? seems to have melted and the housing has split open?

From my point of view it seems the engine has got so hot you would need to check all the seals including water pump and really have no idea if they were good or bad unless replaced. All that anti leak crud inside the water channels is probably going to create problems for the heater and radiator down the track too.

And of course a new head is not going to solve these problems.

Game over i am thinking.

yes think you are right, costs are mounting up on what parts need replacing, or may need replacing

ballboy said:

the water inlet at the end of the inlet manifold has melted as well

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check if intake manifold melted too