Technical Horrendously stuck bolt in sump, been working on it for 3 days, any ideas?

[varesecrazy]

I'll give it a try - I have some cobalt bits coming later too! Cheers

Not sure any body has said this...

To help fugure out The Centre of your broken stud

Refit a sump, and Punch Through that hole, (you mentioned a new replacement)

Better than guessing where it looks like it might be

As others have correctly pointed out, the sealant is like a tube of toothpaste in an Ad, you apply a tick bead all around, and the Bolts only really add Alignment, and mild tension

 

[jackwhoo]

Aye Jack, there's some "strange" deposits, I noticed them too. However the block is cast iron and the sump is steel so very unlikely you'd get a good weld between the two? Just thoughts bouncing around in this old head of mine.

Hi Jock,

Welding to cast iron can be difficult but looks like a previous person had a go.

The blobs really need to be filed down level with gasket surface

Best

Jack

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

Seems like a good moment to mention one of my favourite tools to deploy in these sorts of situation. The Vibroshock:



In use you need to apply only moderate force to the wrench handle and let the vibrations loosen off the fixing. Twist too hard and too early and you'll still snap the fixing, it's the vibrations which do the business. Ok, it's not the sort of thing you buy for just one job and you do need to be set up with a decent air compressor but I can tell you this is a wonderful tool. I work mostly on older cars and seized brake bleed nipples are a constant problem. This tool is absolutely "magic" at loosening them. There are a number of videos on you tube showing it being used if you want more. Although I mostly use it on brake hydraulics I've also used it to break the rear caliper hand brake cable brackets loose on a Jazz - steel bracket fixed to an ally caliper. and it's a breeze to break drum/disc retaining screws loose with it too. As long as the vibrations can be applied directly through the fixing to the frozen thread it works well, so bleed nipples, injector bolts, caliper retaining bolts and slider pins, etc. Where it doesn't work so well is on, say, a nut and bolt holding body panels together where there is little resistance to the vibrations.

 

[The Panda Nut]

If that were me i would drill both the sump and block and fit a new fixing adjacent. You could spend a lot of time and get no where if someone has welded that bolt so it wont come out. For me its that or a machine shop. But maybe this is a bit of a bodge.

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

A carbide drill is going to go through this but you may still be left with a hole with damaged threads which you've drilled slightly off centre so caused more problems. I'd be very tempted to just drill the whole thing out to the next size up and retap for the next bigger size fixing. What to do then? well, either drill the sump flange hole out to suit or, something we've not mentioned yet, fit a stepped stud, This sort of thing: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/25368863...Ys9cwEzbsPblqV6CYytkZN2lQmjXq5dwaAl4SEALw_wcB

 

[porta]

I have to say my dewalt HSS drill bits are the best I’ve ever used but the really small ones can shatter in tough materials. I’ve had to drill out a fair amount of wrecked bolts, especially from my ancient agri and plant stuff…best to go slow and easy starting off with a 3mm bit and working up.
If you have a ‘cranked’ or 90 degree cordless you will be able to get into tighter spots.

 

[vexorg]

Could have been a total bodge, of someone had filled the hole with weld then stuck the bolt head on.

 

[vexorg]

A carbide drill is going to go through this but you may still be left with a hole with damaged threads which you've drilled slightly off centre so caused more problems. I'd be very tempted to just drill the whole thing out to the next size up and retap for the next bigger size fixing. What to do then? well, either drill the sump flange hole out to suit or, something we've not mentioned yet, fit a stepped stud,

Helicoil would also work

 

[chris3234]

Wtf why are they like 10 of the same 2 posts

 

[varesecrazy]

Wtf why are they like 10 of the same 2 posts

Who?

 

[spleenharvester]

Thanks again everyone. Just had a call with a local helicoil specialist, he reckons not possible to do without pulling the engine because not enough space to maneuver a proper drill - but said a possible solution without replacing the bolt is to use Elring Dirko instead of RTV as it's thicker, and basically just to pray. Has anyone else used Dirko before?

 

[porta]

Thanks again everyone. Just had a call with a local helicoil specialist, he reckons not possible to do without pulling the engine because not enough space to maneuver a proper drill - but said a possible solution without replacing the bolt is to use Elring Dirko instead of RTV as it's thicker, and basically just to pray. Has anyone else used Dirko before?

No, I had to look it up and, it seems, that a lot of vehicle manufacturers use it on ‘first build’ and, if it’s anything like the stuff on my sump change, it’s bloody hard to scrape off. Not sure I’d trust it without ‘support’ from a bolt though!

 

[vexorg]

There are about 14 other bolts, and if held in place when setting it's more than likely it will hold without a bolt.

I personally cannot see why it cant be helicoiled, I suspect they are just being perfectionists and would want the block on a proper drill rather than hand drill.

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

Wtf why are they like 10 of the same 2 posts

?

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

There are about 14 other bolts, and if held in place when setting it's more than likely it will hold without a bolt.

I personally cannot see why it cant be helicoiled, I suspect they are just being perfectionists and would want the block on a proper drill rather than hand drill.

My personal preference would be for a time sert in this case due to it's thicker sidewall.

 

[vexorg]

There's very little torque on the bolt, any number of inserts would probably work.

 

[chris3234]

Must

?

Must havebeen some sort of bug as every new post was the same 2 for me these two was shown above 4-5 times each

 

[John202020]

There's very little torque on the bolt, any number of inserts would probably work.

Dare I suggest even a self tapper bolt would give enough hold?

 

[porta]

Dare I suggest even a self tapper bolt would give enough hold?

A fine thread, stainless Tek screw may well be a solution

 

[spleenharvester]

Cobalt bit can't do it either guys, glows red hot and just won't go through. Is carbide likely to be any better?

3mm DeWalt Extreme cobalt.