My air con is out of order this year, I am going to have it fixed, basically filled up only, next summer, but I want to ask about lack of heating when the temperatures are around zero degree Celsius. With air con working, this might not be an issue, but now it is manual simple heating and the air blowing into the cabit is just not hot enough and I can see the engine temperature gauge hardly ever reaches the mid position - unless I am in a traffic jam - so on a longer journey out of town, the engine usually doesn't reach the middle point in temperature and it seems that's why it doesn't heat the cabin enough. I think the temperature in the cabin is about 16 degrees at most. Where could be a problem?

As long as cooling system is fine (not losing coolant) then you could try blanking off some of the grille to reduce the cold air getting to the radiator. Never had to do it in a Panda, but used to work on Land Rovers.
There's some info on a thread here recently.

Some other alternatives are:
Block preheater (plugs into mains and heats engine block) - not silly money, but needs mains socket nearby - easy to fit in a Panda.

Eberspacher or Webasto type heater ( heat up block using fuel) - expensive but portable. Probably a nightmare to fit in a Panda - haven't tried.

Thermal underwear - cheap but not stylish. Keeps me warm though.

The little plug in heaters which don't seem to work very well. Well the ones I have tried don't.

Or fix the aircon sooner.

Oddly, if you get the aircon regassed it may help the engine get up to temperature quicker, as it loads the engine when on. If yours is Climate Control then it will demist the car much quicker too.

Sounds like the thermasat is stuck open. Easy to test. Switch the engine on from cold. Put you hand on the top hose. Should stay cold until the thermostat starts to open. Bet yours starts to warm instantly.

ruinin said:

I can see the engine temperature gauge hardly ever reaches the mid position - unless I am in a traffic jam - so on a longer journey out of town, the engine usually doesn't reach the middle point in temperature and it seems that's why it doesn't heat the cabin enough. I think the temperature in the cabin is about 16 degrees at most. Where could be a problem?

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Hi,
it does sound as if the thermostat is NOT moderating the coolant temp..

diesels tend to run a lot cooler than petrols..,so heat up slower..

but if it gets up to temp in traffic - then cools again,
blanking part of the rad could aid things in the shorter term..,

Charlie

varesecrazy said:

Hi,
it does sound as if the thermostat is NOT moderating the coolant temp..

diesels tend to run a lot cooler than petrols..,so heat up slower..

but if it gets up to temp in traffic - then cools again,
blanking part of the rad could aid things in the shorter term..,

Charlie

Click to expand...

I sometimes see cars with radiators covered with carton or such, so if I am too cold in the car, I will give it a try.

koalar said:

Sounds like the thermasat is stuck open. Easy to test. Switch the engine on from cold. Put you hand on the top hose. Should stay cold until the thermostat starts to open. Bet yours starts to warm instantly.

Click to expand...

How long should it stay cold? I will start the engine, then I have to get out of the car and go to the hose, this may take a few seconds. Does it matter? I will try this tomorrow morning. Thanks.

Basically the heating system is an air blending unit and can change from hot to cold instantly. If the flaps are sticking, and the amount of warm air and cold air are not correct, the temperature in the car will not reach the levels expected. It sounds as if there are some issues in the heater flap actuators / operating levers. I am sorry however that I do not know how to check other than looking under the dash and seeing if the levers and flaps move when you change the temperature. It is also possible that the digital control is malfunctioning. I would stat with the mechanical aspects first as these can be checked by eye.

ruinin said:

How long should it stay cold? I will start the engine, then I have to get out of the car and go to the hose, this may take a few seconds. Does it matter? I will try this tomorrow morning. Thanks.

Click to expand...

Plenty of time.

Should stay stone cold for a good few minutes.

Coolant should not start to flow to the radiator until the coolant in the engine block reaches the opening temperature of 87°C give or take 4°


When its stuck open or the rubber seal has perished the top hose will be warm within a minute or so

I have a related issue. Don't want to start another thread for it.

When I turn the heating on in my car (no air-con), the passenger side is much warmer than the driver side. I'm presuming that there is some kind of way of piping the warm air through. Would there possibly be a breakage or blockage in the pipe? I'd like warm feet again.

Wee Smurf said:

I have a related issue. Don't want to start another thread for it.

When I turn the heating on in my car (no air-con), the passenger side is much warmer than the driver side. I'm presuming that there is some kind of way of piping the warm air through. Would there possibly be a breakage or blockage in the pipe? I'd like warm feet again.

Click to expand...

The ACTUAL AIR is only heated the same..,
chances are there is better airflow to the left - as ....by design..that's the "drivers side"

not uncommon for the LHS of windscreen to clear 1st either..

Charlie

Make 100% sure the cooling circuit is full and has no air locks. If the level is low you will F the engine.

If coolant does not get up to temperature at a reasonable rate change the thermostat. Its an easy job and will cost about £10 for parts.

How old is the coolant? If unsure drain flush and refit with long life stuff.

Blanking off the radiator wont help but it will risk overheating in traffic. It was done in the serious bad winters gone by (1947 1963) but its doubtful how much benefit the drivers got. I drove through he similarly cold 1981 winter seeing -16C in Derby (-25C was recorded in Shropshire). The car had a normal thermostat and worked fine (Austin Mini 1000).

During the cold winter approx 1990 the Montego 2.0 Turbo needed at least 5 miles to get fully warm. Traffic jams where it was ticking over needed even longer. Heavy diesel engine running very efficiently took a long time to get fully hot.

Uk residents are lucky with their temperate climate.
Other members may not see temps above ZERO for a while..

Do you have a pollenfilter? Have you tried blowing compressed air into the tube that seem blocked? (I dont know if this would work, but thats what i would do if i had a clogged vent... I dont know if it would break anything, but i cant see how)

Another for the thermostat.

When driving along an open road the cooling effect is greater than when stuck in slow moving traffic. A bad 'stat will show this by giving a cooler reading until traffic is hit, when the dial will show a temperature rise. If the dial fluctuates under these circumstances, then - as long as the fluid level is normal - the 'stat is the first suspect.

Not only will the cabin heating be poor, you will also use more fuel and have a less efficient engine. For the cost of a 'stat and the small amount of labour and difficulty involved, it's well worth changing.

Update after a year. This time the situation is pretty simple. The heating works fine and heats up the cabin quite quickly. Until the engine reaches its normal temperature. Then for some strange reason, the heating stops working and only cold air comes out of the vents. Any ideas what's wrong? I tried to turn air con on and off but it doesn't seem to have any effect on this problem.

ruinin said:

Update after a year. This time the situation is pretty simple. The heating works fine and heats up the cabin quite quickly. Until the engine reaches its normal temperature. Then for some strange reason, the heating stops working and only cold air comes out of the vents. Any ideas what's wrong? I tried to turn air con on and off but it doesn't seem to have any effect on this problem.

Click to expand...

Have you checked the hoses to see if the thermostat is working correctly?

The only thing else is a sensor in the climate circuit..


Do you have climate..? Or just aircon??

I have manual air conditioning. I cannot set the temperature just turn the knob from cold to hot.

To be honest, I have no idea how to check hoses to see if the thermostat is working correctly. I can ask my mechanic to do that. So it seems I will have to pay for a new thermostat or a new sensor, right? Plus labour.

ruinin said:

I have manual air conditioning. I cannot set the temperature just turn the knob from cold to hot.

To be honest, I have no idea how to check hoses to see if the thermostat is working correctly. I can ask my mechanic to do that. So it seems I will have to pay for a new thermostat or a new sensor, right? Plus labour.

Click to expand...

Ok..simpler system at least.

Familiarise yourself with engine layout. Location of hose to and from thermostat housing..one will run to the radiator.

Carefully see how they warm with a cold start of the engine.

Hose to rad should stay relatively COLD for 3 to 6 mins then get suddenly pretty HOT as the thermostat open.. sending HOT engine coolant to the rad to aid cooling.

If you get no sudden change in temp. Suspect the thermostat isnt doing its job.

Beware of moving parts with a running engine.. and the cooling fan starting without warning..(fan shouldnt run with a cold to warm engine..but be prepared)

Let us know what you find..


1st things 1st.. is the coolant level correct and holding??

If the engine temperature gauge on the dash is not reaching full temperature this indicated a problem with the thermostat being stuck open and cooling the engine too much.

If this isn't the case, I think you can rule it out.

Thermostat, as has been said last year on this thread, should stay at a rock steady temperature once warmed up. If it fluctuates between open road driving and heavy traffic, then the 'stat is faulty and should be replaced.

A bad 'stat does not necessarily stay open when it should be closed or vice versa. It can fluctuate at random. Always change the 'stat when you get fluctuating temperature readings.

As for blanking off the grille inlets (below the bumper on the Panda), most UK cars are grossly overcooled because the same spec cars are also sold to hot countries. My Panda diesel has had the lower grille completely blanked since I bought it - summer and winter. The heater works better in cold weather and the engine warms up faster, and no ill effects over the last 80k miles.