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Panda (Classic) SEAT Marbella (Mk1 Panda replica).
- Thread starter pandamonius_maximus
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Re: SEAT Marbella (Mk1 Panda replica)
Hey,
I was looking at foriegn Marbella's and i found something interesting particulary with Dutch Marbella's. They do not seem to have a choke...They also have airbag on steering wheel and have some differences that of course, we wouldn't have known about since these are very late Marbellas.
I was also wondering. You marbella seems to have the choke in a different place. Mine is at the lower part of the console and above it is a plate of which other Marbella's (foreign ones) have a manual washer pump. (It is blanked out because mine is on the stalk.
It's funny how small differences can be found for such a car...
Hey,
I was looking at foriegn Marbella's and i found something interesting particulary with Dutch Marbella's. They do not seem to have a choke...They also have airbag on steering wheel and have some differences that of course, we wouldn't have known about since these are very late Marbellas.
I was also wondering. You marbella seems to have the choke in a different place. Mine is at the lower part of the console and above it is a plate of which other Marbella's (foreign ones) have a manual washer pump. (It is blanked out because mine is on the stalk.
It's funny how small differences can be found for such a car...
OP
OP
Re: SEAT Marbella (Mk1 Panda replica)
Well, it took long enough but finally got everything linked together and most of the electrics sorted....so turned the key and after months of no use started instantly first go!!! Still has the poor running problem I knew of before but I can start playing around now at least.
Here's a some pictures of the work:
Stripped the rubber carpets out making wiring much easier. Will tidy it all up but leave the carpet etc out for good now. Gear linkages took some work as I had not taken them off the Y10... and the marbella has a single rod set up
but used some spare mk1 4x4 ones which seem to be the same as the y10. Hurrah!! Got a temperature gauge which fits nicely next to the new switch panel and oil pressure gauge will be squeezed in somewhere I am sure!.....
Just a couple of questions though......
1) There are wires coming out of the expansion tank, are these important or can they be left off? I've never had an expansion tank with elecrics on it before, anyone any ideas what they are for? If they are to control the pressure I have no clue how I will wire them up. but if its juts a warning light then that should be ok. Will read more in the manual later but couldnt see anything at first glance....
2) There is a feature that has very little detail in the work shop manual and is found at the end of a pipe comoing out of the oil cooler take off sandwich plate. I beleive it is something that shuts off fuel maybe if the oil pressure gets too low but no idea how it would be wired. I have tried reading the wiring diagrams but I've been getting confused. If anyone has any ideas or info about this kind of thing I would greatly appreciate to hear them.
Otherwise, woooohoooo its running. I was literally jumping with joy earlier, hope no one was watching!
Cheers,
Si
Well, it took long enough but finally got everything linked together and most of the electrics sorted....so turned the key and after months of no use started instantly first go!!! Still has the poor running problem I knew of before but I can start playing around now at least.
Here's a some pictures of the work:
Stripped the rubber carpets out making wiring much easier. Will tidy it all up but leave the carpet etc out for good now. Gear linkages took some work as I had not taken them off the Y10... and the marbella has a single rod set up
but used some spare mk1 4x4 ones which seem to be the same as the y10. Hurrah!! Got a temperature gauge which fits nicely next to the new switch panel and oil pressure gauge will be squeezed in somewhere I am sure!.....
Just a couple of questions though......
1) There are wires coming out of the expansion tank, are these important or can they be left off? I've never had an expansion tank with elecrics on it before, anyone any ideas what they are for? If they are to control the pressure I have no clue how I will wire them up. but if its juts a warning light then that should be ok. Will read more in the manual later but couldnt see anything at first glance....
2) There is a feature that has very little detail in the work shop manual and is found at the end of a pipe comoing out of the oil cooler take off sandwich plate. I beleive it is something that shuts off fuel maybe if the oil pressure gets too low but no idea how it would be wired. I have tried reading the wiring diagrams but I've been getting confused. If anyone has any ideas or info about this kind of thing I would greatly appreciate to hear them.
Otherwise, woooohoooo its running. I was literally jumping with joy earlier, hope no one was watching!
Cheers,
Si
Re: SEAT Marbella (Mk1 Panda replica)
Nice one. Looks like a goer! I assume you didn't replace gaskets, pipes or anything when you installed the engine? Must be an air/boost leak somewhere causing the issues.
Forget about those wires coming from expansion bottle. They are connected to a switch to illuminate a bulb to say the coolant level is low on the car it came from.
Don't know what the oil based thing is. If you could copy the wiring diagrams and key, I could tell you.
Nice one. Looks like a goer! I assume you didn't replace gaskets, pipes or anything when you installed the engine? Must be an air/boost leak somewhere causing the issues.
Forget about those wires coming from expansion bottle. They are connected to a switch to illuminate a bulb to say the coolant level is low on the car it came from.
Don't know what the oil based thing is. If you could copy the wiring diagrams and key, I could tell you.
OP
OP
Re: SEAT Marbella (Mk1 Panda replica)
Thanks Lewey, I will try to copy the diagrams and take a picture of the actual unit too. Trouble is I dont know what many electrical symbols mean, light and switch i recognise lol!! I'll probably get that up tomorrow, going to kick back tonight. Just spent my after work hours fixing the boost leak.....
And success we have BOOOOOOOOOOOOST!!! Still a bit hesitant under throttle but it pulls away now at least
basically the bits of the carb that were blanked off were not sealing properly (shoving a bolt in the end of a pipe basically lol!!) So all jubilee'd up and massive improvement....Love how quiet turbo's are, its got the exhaust on very losely at the moment (might be why its running lumpy tbh) and its still quieter than my other pandas!
Next steps:
1) Change engine capacity with DVLA (just to check though, if I leave the engine code as before is it likely to pass an emissions test based on a little 903????).
2) put some oil in the gearbox....just realised its still empty. Not been driving it though so should be ok.
3) Get a new back box made up that actually fits over the rear axle!!
4) fit strut brace, check all bolts are secure everywhere
5) General service, new cam belt and new carb seals if I can find them.
6) MOT.....bit nervous as usual tbh but the car should be sound I think.
7) PLAY TIME!!! :devil:
Overall one happy me.
Si
Thanks Lewey, I will try to copy the diagrams and take a picture of the actual unit too. Trouble is I dont know what many electrical symbols mean, light and switch i recognise lol!! I'll probably get that up tomorrow, going to kick back tonight. Just spent my after work hours fixing the boost leak.....
And success we have BOOOOOOOOOOOOST!!! Still a bit hesitant under throttle but it pulls away now at least
basically the bits of the carb that were blanked off were not sealing properly (shoving a bolt in the end of a pipe basically lol!!) So all jubilee'd up and massive improvement....Love how quiet turbo's are, its got the exhaust on very losely at the moment (might be why its running lumpy tbh) and its still quieter than my other pandas!
Next steps:
1) Change engine capacity with DVLA (just to check though, if I leave the engine code as before is it likely to pass an emissions test based on a little 903????).
2) put some oil in the gearbox....just realised its still empty. Not been driving it though so should be ok.
3) Get a new back box made up that actually fits over the rear axle!!
4) fit strut brace, check all bolts are secure everywhere
5) General service, new cam belt and new carb seals if I can find them.
6) MOT.....bit nervous as usual tbh but the car should be sound I think.
7) PLAY TIME!!! :devil:
Overall one happy me.
Si
Re: SEAT Marbella (Mk1 Panda replica)
You cannot affect the MOT emissions requirements by filling in anything on the V5. It's much harder than that! The 903cc (presume carb model) would have to adhere to the same emissions regs as the Y10 Turbo did. Basically <3.5% CO and nothing else! Very simple. If you don't pass that, you have a fairly bad fuelling problem that needs sorting anyway.
You cannot affect the MOT emissions requirements by filling in anything on the V5. It's much harder than that! The 903cc (presume carb model) would have to adhere to the same emissions regs as the Y10 Turbo did. Basically <3.5% CO and nothing else! Very simple. If you don't pass that, you have a fairly bad fuelling problem that needs sorting anyway.
OP
OP
Re: SEAT Marbella (Mk1 Panda replica)
Ok, got some pictures to share.... but first I decided to go for a very short drive to see how it goes....
My word is this car quick!!!! It compares to a rover 220 turbo quite easily. Running well enough now to go for the MOT so tomorrow I will be booking it in for the test. Cam belt change first though, I am paranoid (wish it was a timing chain).
Anyway, here is a picture of the device whatever it may do.... I am having trouble with the old scanner so will have to upload a wiring diagram when I get that working!
Any ideas? The thick black pipe goes to the oil cooler sandwich plate, and the wires who knows for the moment
Si
Ok, got some pictures to share.... but first I decided to go for a very short drive to see how it goes....
My word is this car quick!!!! It compares to a rover 220 turbo quite easily. Running well enough now to go for the MOT so tomorrow I will be booking it in for the test. Cam belt change first though, I am paranoid (wish it was a timing chain
). Anyway, here is a picture of the device whatever it may do.... I am having trouble with the old scanner so will have to upload a wiring diagram when I get that working!
Any ideas? The thick black pipe goes to the oil cooler sandwich plate, and the wires who knows for the moment
Si
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Re: SEAT Marbella (Mk1 Panda replica)
looks vaguely like an oil pressure gauge sender, possibly temp sender aswell if there's extra wires. Isn't that often what a sandwich plate is for, retro fit to give a feed for extra dials?
looks vaguely like an oil pressure gauge sender, possibly temp sender aswell if there's extra wires. Isn't that often what a sandwich plate is for, retro fit to give a feed for extra dials?
OP
OP
Re: SEAT Marbella (Mk1 Panda replica)
The sandwich plate is for the oil cooler pipe take off, but my bad as I misled people here. The pipe that comes out the unit above comes out of the block next to the oil filter, just above the oil pressure/temperature sender unit. I'll try to get a message to the lancia owners group and see what they think.
Other news:
Not so good, had the MOT booked for last saturday. Thought it was running well enough but I was so wrong! The MOT centre would be a 5 minute drive away normally. And it took me 10 minutes to get half way before all the electrics died. The AA established the problem very quickly as a bad earth, but even after that I couldnt get it to run right so was towed home.
Not very happy, bad start to the bank holiday weekend but I guess the problem did seem a bit too easy to solve. I am replacing gaskets on the carb, as soon as they arrive. accelerator pump to be replaced too. Will give the carb a good clean out too. After that, I have no clue how to make it run so I will give the car to a tuning shop and bite the bullet at the cost.
Oh well, at least its just final tweaks now. Got to keep my chin up
Si
The sandwich plate is for the oil cooler pipe take off, but my bad as I misled people here. The pipe that comes out the unit above comes out of the block next to the oil filter, just above the oil pressure/temperature sender unit. I'll try to get a message to the lancia owners group and see what they think.
Other news:
Not so good, had the MOT booked for last saturday. Thought it was running well enough but I was so wrong! The MOT centre would be a 5 minute drive away normally. And it took me 10 minutes to get half way before all the electrics died. The AA established the problem very quickly as a bad earth, but even after that I couldnt get it to run right so was towed home.
Not very happy, bad start to the bank holiday weekend but I guess the problem did seem a bit too easy to solve. I am replacing gaskets on the carb, as soon as they arrive. accelerator pump to be replaced too. Will give the carb a good clean out too. After that, I have no clue how to make it run so I will give the car to a tuning shop and bite the bullet at the cost.
Oh well, at least its just final tweaks now. Got to keep my chin up
Si
Re: SEAT Marbella (Mk1 Panda replica)
Unlucky with the MOT
still reckon that part looks like a pressure gauge sender. Doesn't say 'veglia' anywhere does it?
Unlucky with the MOT
still reckon that part looks like a pressure gauge sender. Doesn't say 'veglia' anywhere does it?
Re: SEAT Marbella (Mk1 Panda replica)
Unlucky Si, still you've had a little drive and know what you've got to come.
I'm with Andrew on that part by the way. If you had a fan on the oil cooler I'd suggest it may be a switch for that, but I'm guessing you haven't got one.
Unlucky Si, still you've had a little drive and know what you've got to come
.I'm with Andrew on that part by the way. If you had a fan on the oil cooler I'd suggest it may be a switch for that, but I'm guessing you haven't got one.
Last edited:
OP
OP
Re: SEAT Marbella (Mk1 Panda replica)
yeah, I am gutted tbh but as you say I have had a taster. Unfortunately thats like smelling a sunday roast dinner and then having to wait for who knows how long to eat it!
I looked all over it and couldnt find veglia written on it but cant remember the lancia having an oil pressure gauge which is why I am sceptical. Either way though I dont think it needs it to run for the moment, and now have bigger issues to solve.
Some more clues to the non running puzzle:
1) She fires up ok but once running is almost impossible to keep going and splutters a lot.
2) The fuel filter doesnt fill up completely, which makes me think there isnt enough fuel pressure. This adds up and links with 1) as it only has enough to run initially then starves of fuel.
3) Plenty of fuel in the tank (check the obvious first)
4) Fuel sender inlet outlet pipe have a very small ID, perhaps this is causing too much of a restriction
5) Replaced manifold gaskets where carb bolts down, and tightened up bolts (much tighter than they were before, I had to make a special bent spanner to do it however - probably why previous owners hadn't).
Thats all I can think of for now. I think I need to get a more powerful fuel pump perhaps or the fuel pressure regulator has failed. I will try the fuel pressure regulator first though as the fuel pump (solid state) should be ok. Unless someone knows different?
Thank you very much for your help so far guys, much appreciated. I am very confused atm :bang:
Cheers,
Si
yeah, I am gutted tbh but as you say I have had a taster. Unfortunately thats like smelling a sunday roast dinner and then having to wait for who knows how long to eat it!
I looked all over it and couldnt find veglia written on it but cant remember the lancia having an oil pressure gauge which is why I am sceptical. Either way though I dont think it needs it to run for the moment, and now have bigger issues to solve.
Some more clues to the non running puzzle:
1) She fires up ok but once running is almost impossible to keep going and splutters a lot.
2) The fuel filter doesnt fill up completely, which makes me think there isnt enough fuel pressure. This adds up and links with 1) as it only has enough to run initially then starves of fuel.
3) Plenty of fuel in the tank (check the obvious first
)4) Fuel sender inlet outlet pipe have a very small ID, perhaps this is causing too much of a restriction
5) Replaced manifold gaskets where carb bolts down, and tightened up bolts (much tighter than they were before, I had to make a special bent spanner to do it however - probably why previous owners hadn't).
Thats all I can think of for now. I think I need to get a more powerful fuel pump perhaps or the fuel pressure regulator has failed. I will try the fuel pressure regulator first though as the fuel pump (solid state) should be ok. Unless someone knows different?
Thank you very much for your help so far guys, much appreciated. I am very confused atm :bang:
Cheers,
Si
Re: SEAT Marbella (Mk1 Panda replica)
could be worth fiting a swirl pot too to hold fuel. does the pump prime ok or is it a mechanical one? might be worth going for one out of a small engined punto or a cento. likely to fit
could be worth fiting a swirl pot too to hold fuel. does the pump prime ok or is it a mechanical one? might be worth going for one out of a small engined punto or a cento. likely to fit
OP
OP
Re: SEAT Marbella (Mk1 Panda replica)
Fuel pump (a new solid state electric one) seems to operate ok, can see it pulsing through the filter in the engine bay. But the filter is mostly empty. Will try a few more things tomorrow so excuse me if I go quiet for a bit. I am just getting confused!
Not sure if a swirl pot is required, unless anyone knows different.
Fingers crossed! :slayer:
Si
Fuel pump (a new solid state electric one) seems to operate ok, can see it pulsing through the filter in the engine bay. But the filter is mostly empty. Will try a few more things tomorrow so excuse me if I go quiet for a bit. I am just getting confused!
Not sure if a swirl pot is required, unless anyone knows different.
Fingers crossed! :slayer:
Si
OP
OP
Re: SEAT Marbella (Mk1 Panda replica)
Well its reasonably good news, the fault seemed to be a dodgy positive battery cable and with a new one fitted its just a slightly bad setup carb which an overhaul should sort out.
MOT was today, and apart from an exhaust having no silencer and a faulty brake light switch (that had only just failed) it would have gone right through with a couple of advisories.
Booking her in for exhaust builders tomorrow (if theyre open) and doing the cam belt. Then its just tweaks i guess. Perhaps a trip to shakespeare county raceway is in order :devil:
Si
Well its reasonably good news, the fault seemed to be a dodgy positive battery cable and with a new one fitted its just a slightly bad setup carb which an overhaul should sort out.
MOT was today, and apart from an exhaust having no silencer and a faulty brake light switch (that had only just failed) it would have gone right through with a couple of advisories.
Booking her in for exhaust builders tomorrow (if theyre open) and doing the cam belt. Then its just tweaks i guess. Perhaps a trip to shakespeare county raceway is in order :devil:
Si
Re: SEAT Marbella (Mk1 Panda replica)
I saw you briefly outside the MOT station ,
Car looks very nice
was late for appointment so couldn't stop
You are going to the wrong test centre !
If you want someone sympathetic towards older/different cars go further on down the ind. estate road ,over speed bumps, follow it round the back
Scotfords [Nigel ]
Mot's -
Very good motor engineer
I'm working on my Starlet rally car there
I saw you briefly outside the MOT station ,
Car looks very nice
was late for appointment so couldn't stop
You are going to the wrong test centre !
If you want someone sympathetic towards older/different cars go further on down the ind. estate road ,over speed bumps, follow it round the back
Scotfords [Nigel ]
Mot's -
Very good motor engineer
I'm working on my Starlet rally car there
OP
OP
Re: SEAT Marbella (Mk1 Panda replica)
Hey,
Thanks for the compliments, she feels more like a car and less like a project now. Regarding the MOT station though, this guy is very good. Its Tony Porters new place, so you might even be referring to the place he had round the back where there were a bunch of old cars parked. He has been very sympathetic and tbh would have passed it with out a back box on if it hadnt been just a bit too loud. I have no problem as legally he would be in trouble if he passed it so I'm booking her in for a new exhaust and a free retest soon enough.
How you been anyway, been a while? Rally car sounds cool, will have to have a look sometime. Gona have to be quite fast to beat the SEAT now though
Cheers,
Si
Hey,
Thanks for the compliments, she feels more like a car and less like a project now. Regarding the MOT station though, this guy is very good. Its Tony Porters new place, so you might even be referring to the place he had round the back where there were a bunch of old cars parked. He has been very sympathetic and tbh would have passed it with out a back box on if it hadnt been just a bit too loud. I have no problem as legally he would be in trouble if he passed it so I'm booking her in for a new exhaust and a free retest soon enough.
How you been anyway, been a while? Rally car sounds cool, will have to have a look sometime. Gona have to be quite fast to beat the SEAT now though
Cheers,
Si
Re: SEAT Marbella (Mk1 Panda replica)
Seriously? Dodgy battery cable? Find this hard to believe, not that I don't trust your judgement that it seems better. My experience with the engine was it was very up and down in terms of performance even without changing anything. Symptoms would change with the weather.
I really hope it is "fixed" as a battery cable would be a funny solution and something I wouldn't have looked at!
Seriously? Dodgy battery cable? Find this hard to believe, not that I don't trust your judgement that it seems better. My experience with the engine was it was very up and down in terms of performance even without changing anything. Symptoms would change with the weather.
I really hope it is "fixed" as a battery cable would be a funny solution and something I wouldn't have looked at!
OP
OP
Re: SEAT Marbella (Mk1 Panda replica)
Well the running problem still remains there. It is now driveable though, I think this only fixed the strange starting then conking out problem. It still hesitates under throttle and missfires occassionally. I have some theories here though:
1) needs a service kit for the carb.
2) the exhaust (either the fact there is no back box on or that the diameter doesnt need to fit a babies head). New exhaust build will soon tell, assuming the place I go doesnt do the same!
3) Could be a leak in the manifold gasket, which I now have and will be fitting when the weather is good.
Other than these, I have little idea what it could be. I have sealed up all the carb fittings tighter than a nits arse and i'd be suprised if there is any boost leaks atall anymore. It goes like a rocket though, so boost isnt lacking!
Will post some pictures up when I get the new exhaust, and if I find out what is upsetting it of course. wouldnt blame the car if it just hated british weather tbh :bang:
Si
Well the running problem still remains there. It is now driveable though, I think this only fixed the strange starting then conking out problem. It still hesitates under throttle and missfires occassionally. I have some theories here though:
1) needs a service kit for the carb.
2) the exhaust (either the fact there is no back box on or that the diameter doesnt need to fit a babies head). New exhaust build will soon tell, assuming the place I go doesnt do the same!
3) Could be a leak in the manifold gasket, which I now have and will be fitting when the weather is good.
Other than these, I have little idea what it could be. I have sealed up all the carb fittings tighter than a nits arse and i'd be suprised if there is any boost leaks atall anymore. It goes like a rocket though, so boost isnt lacking!
Will post some pictures up when I get the new exhaust, and if I find out what is upsetting it of course.
wouldnt blame the car if it just hated british weather tbh :bang:Si
Re: SEAT Marbella (Mk1 Panda replica)
not mistaken ,
round the back . N . Scotford motor engineers
MOT's up to class 7
V.good , honest service at sensible prices
discount for Stroud and District Motor Club members
the place to go !
cheers
Carl
not mistaken ,
round the back . N . Scotford motor engineers
MOT's up to class 7
V.good , honest service at sensible prices
discount for Stroud and District Motor Club members
the place to go !
cheers
Carl
