so you're dumb enough to knowingly take plant fertilizer as a drug...

[ben]

Rubbish! No one dies from their first sip of Frosty Jacks in a park because it's been cut with poison.

But they would if their frosty jacks had been topped up with poison .....

This is a different kettle of fish entirely.

Drugs are only cut with rubbish to make more profits for the dealers who don't care about safety. If the drugs were legalised, there would be strict controls on their production so they would be 100% uncontaminated.

I don't know anyone who was killed after their first toke on a doobie either.

 

[volxstu]

Thats poison not the drug though So how is the "DRUG" to blame. How many people die from drinking Moonshine compared to cut drugs
Also i dont think there has been that many deaths from dodgy cut drugs.

 

[306maxi]

But they would if their frosty jacks had been topped up with poison .....

This is a different kettle of fish entirely.

Drugs are only cut with rubbish to make more profits for the dealers who don't care about safety. If the drugs were legalised, there would be strict controls on their production so they would be 100% uncontaminated.

I don't know anyone who was killed after their first toke on a doobie either.

Of course. But you take my point

Tbh I'm not the best person to speak on this as I've never tried drugs and I've not had a drink for over 5 years.

 

[soap_dodger]

I don't know anyone who was killed after their first toke on a doobie either.

I dunno, I nearly choked to death...

 

[alexbpl]

Instead of banning it, they should import a couple million tons and sell it in local Job Centres with tax added.

At the end of the day, the Earth is only staying the same size, so the less people the better!

 

[T14086]

I dunno, I nearly choked to death...

 

[Cian]

While meph is manky stuff, I guaran-fecking-tee you they were taking other stuff as well. It doesn't have the properties to kill you instantly, although I know someone who's on heart medication as a result of using it too heavily.

Leah Betts style scare story - most people never heard the truth about how she actually had taken E before, and panicked DUE TO PUBLIC INFORMATION FILMS and drank far too much water; she's just the picture of the girl that "died on her first E".

 

[soap_dodger]

Ssssh you, I was only used to smoking legal things at that time, so it came as quite a shock! lol

 

[T14086]

Personl opinion is all drugs that are used purely for recreation are for losers....

but they can be used to enhance a situation/need...to write (or play) music or litreature for example without the confines of normal everyday acceptence...the beatles 'yellow submarine' for example.

sitting indoors getting wrecked all day long day everyday is just a waste of ones valuable time of being alive.

 

[volxstu]

Apparently it was a heart attack which does suggest its closer to Caffein (C8H10N4O2) than MDMA (C11H15N2O) which has been freely available for a long time.
This also suggests that it was either cut with caffein or mixing drugs like Ecstacy which are mixed with caffein which stimulates the brain and turn the MDMA from a Hallucinogenic to a party in your brain buzz.

Also im sure that i heard they had been taking methadone which would suggest they had VitC. As soon as they felt too intense, snort half a sachet of that and they would have been right as rain within minutes.
Drugs dont kill people. Idiots do.

 

[Chas Uno]

Drugs dont kill people. Idiots do.

Actually it's the abuse of drugs, impure drugs and drug inter-reactions that kill people. That's why legal drugs have to be prescribed by medical professionals (i.e. GP's, Doctors, Nurse Prescribers) who generally know what drugs are suitable for a given patient and their condition, plus also in what combination they can be given to reduce the risks of drug interaction. Not only that, but many prescription medications can have potentially lethal side effects depending on the person taking it. Just read any leaflet for an everyday medication to see what side effects can happen with so called 'safe' and accepted drugs that we take for granted. Now multiply those risks many times for a recreational drug bought off the street, concocted in a backstreet room with no quality control and with questionable and impure properties. You may get lucky and get a 'pure' shot of your favourite substance so won't risk being poisoned by whatever a dodgy dealer chose to cut it with that day. Or maybe you weren't expecting it to be so pure and take your 'normal' dose only to find that because it's so pure you've taken a massive overdose. Maybe it will react with a prescription medication you're already taking, because the dealer who sold it to you hasn't a clue regarding drug compatibilities and can't warn you about this.

Good luck to those that still choose to ignore the warnings. It's your life and your choice.

 

[volxstu]

Actually it's the abuse of drugs, impure drugs and drug inter-reactions that kill people. That's why legal drugs have to be prescribed by medical professionals (i.e. GP's, Doctors, Nurse Prescribers) who generally know what drugs are suitable for a given patient and their condition, plus also in what combination they can be given to reduce the risks of drug interaction. Not only that, but many prescription medications can have potentially lethal side effects depending on the person taking it. Just read any leaflet for an everyday medication to see what side effects can happen with so called 'safe' and accepted drugs that we take for granted. Now multiply those risks many times for a recreational drug bought off the street, concocted in a backstreet room with no quality control and with questionable and impure properties. You may get lucky and get a 'pure' shot of your favourite substance so won't risk being poisoned by whatever a dodgy dealer chose to cut it with that day. Or maybe you weren't expecting it to be so pure and take your 'normal' dose only to find that because it's so pure you've taken a massive overdose. Maybe it will react with a prescription medication you're already taking, because the dealer who sold it to you hasn't a clue regarding drug compatibilities and can't warn you about this.

Good luck to those that still choose to ignore the warnings. It's your life and your choice.

So in short "Drugs dont kill people. Idiots do"

Idiots die because they buy these drugs with impurities and then take copious amounts of it before they let a test hit take affect. If it feels dodgy you tend to know something is wrong. This theory is even more effective when you dont do them on your own. If you are with others then you will increase the chances of somebody detecting the impurities. Different people are affected at different rates so if it go's pair shaped somebody will be straight enough to sort it out.
That is just one small part of harm reduction there are hundreds of things that you can do. Small things that take no thought and easy to adhere too.

I believe I only took potentially deadly drugs once. A friend and i bought a load of pills, we new there was something wrong after we dropped the first few but in our inexperience we carried on dropping. I got some base because they were making me tired which shouldnt happen. I kept popping and so did my mate but i didnt realise he wasnt taking the base. After about the 15th he just go's blank. He was conscious but totally unresponsive. So i get us picked up get him some Orange Juice chuck in some vit c and speed and 20 mins later he is no longer telling my friends mother that she knows she wants his babies and went back out to cause havoc for the rest of new years eve.
We found out the next day that some girl died from them pills.

 

[bludvl_x19]

That is just one small part of harm reduction there are hundreds of things that you can do. Small things that take no thought and easy to adhere too.

Yeah, don't take drugs, easy as pie

 

[volxstu]

That is obviously a fair point. I dont do them myself anymore bar the odd slip up. I always get people who are close to me asking if i regret it. I will always say hell no. It has infinite positive effect on my life. I didnt murder anybody, i didnt steal anything i just LMFAO and had a bloody good time.

You get people free climbing sky scrapers or surfing 50ft waves for their buzz. Nobody looks down on them like scum and their chances of survival are less than your weekend pill muncher.

 

[Chas Uno]

So in short "Drugs dont kill people. Idiots do"

If you mean "idiots" as in those that choose to deal recreational drugs of dubious ingredients then yes, that's one part of the "idiots" that kill. However, you forget that many legal drugs that are prescribed can still have the potential to kill a patient and have potentially toxic effects. Have you heard of the drug Warfarin? It's a blood 'thinning' (anti-coagulant) drug given to many people at risk of thrombosis. It's also used as rat poison as at higher doses it causes uncontrollable internal bleeding. This is a drug that has therapeutic effects at one dosage and lethal effects at another. Give the wrong dose to a patient and the end result can be death.

And suppose a doctor prescribes a drug that is known to have adverse affects on a patient with renal impairment, but without knowing that the patient has stage three renal failure, and that patient then dies as a result of taking this medication. Who's the idiot in this case? The patient for taking it as prescribed or the doctor who prescribed it? What was it that killed the patient? The doctor or the drug?

Again, look at the fact that nearly ALL drugs, prescription or illegal, have potentially lethal and known side effects. Prescription drugs dispensed as prescribed are given in a controlled and risk assessed manner by a medical professional. An illegal slip/ tab/ pill bought off a backstreet dealer is not. Both drugs can kill in certain circumstances, but the illegal drug has far higher risks both for the drug itself and also the fact that the person taking it hasn't been assessed for suitability for taking this drug. Therefore if the illegal drug kills someone who takes it, then who is the idiot in that case and what killed them?

 

[volxstu]

Yes i mean the dealer, the, dr the nurse and the idiots who think they can smash a unknown drug without testing the water first.
Illicit drugs are branded just the same as legal ones. Im allergic to a particular brand of Penicillin so i dont take them. I have heard of and taken dodgy Heineken pills so if i was to do drugs again i certainly wouldnt take those ones. Peruvian Flake Cocaine is notoriously pure and uncut (although this is more difficult to identify than a pill with a picture on it). Jamaica Crack produces more smoke than most and is distinctively more yellow and i a good pure smoke.

What im trying to say is a Dr knows their field and still often f up. A drug user only has a few too choose from so dont have a lot of work to know their field. Just like you get the odd irresponsible Dr you will get the irresponsible recreational drug user.

Im not trying to imply you are wrong, what you are saying chas is true, just not as much as i think you believe. You seem to believe that people who do drugs arent allowed to be intelligent and Dr's arent allowed to be stupid. I can tell you now intelligence doesnt really vary that much on average between person to person.

 

[dave]

Y I have heard of and taken dodgy Heineken pills so if i was to do drugs again i certainly wouldnt take those ones.

i must be getting old, Heineken used to be a beer that would reach parts other beers couldn't

 

[volxstu]

Pills are named after things with a picture on them. Black Mitsubishi turbo's :yum: I would do them if they were ever made to old school standards (Its a safe bet that will never happen). Infact i think it was new breed Black Mitsi's that are responsible for my Avatar.

 

[dave]

Pills are named after things with a picture on them.

pills used to be a beer too

 

[Chas Uno]

What im trying to say is a Dr knows their field and still often f up. A drug user only has a few too choose from so dont have a lot of work to know their field. Just like you get the odd irresponsible Dr you will get the irresponsible recreational drug user.

Im not trying to imply you are wrong, what you are saying chas is true, just not as much as i think you believe. You seem to believe that people who do drugs arent allowed to be intelligent and Dr's arent allowed to be stupid. I can tell you now intelligence doesnt really vary that much on average between person to person.

The difference being is that a Doctor prescribes drugs of a known quantity, constitution and purity. They also had to endure six years of training to be in the professional position they're in. A drug dealer does not have any formal training and can not deal drugs knowing their full chemical make-up. Legal drugs are subjected to very high standards of quality and their therapeutic effects are scrutinised under the highest scientific levels via clinical trials before being licenced onto the market. Even then exceptions to the rule can occur (Thalidomide is a famous example) but in the majority of cases most legal prescription drugs are safe to take when prescribed correctly.

A junkie scoring dope on the backstreet IS an idiot though. They are taking a substance, into their body, that they cannot possibly know its true pharmacological constitution and they rely on the word of the dealer as to how genuine it is. Sure some experience may enable a seasoned junkie to 'tell' whether a substance is good/ pure or not, but they cannot possibly know its accurate concentration or purity. The legal drug Wafarin is Wafarin, you can tell that much by looking at it and tasting it. But do you know its strength? Because as I mentioned above, the correct dose will stop you from getting blood clots, the wrong dose however can kill you.

No Doctor or healthcare professional is infallible, but they are many, many times more skilled in being able to dispense drugs safely than any backstreet dope dealer can hope to be. If they are not then their six years of medical training must be a waste of time and anyone could do their job? And likewise, what's the point of having Pharmacists if the average person has enough intelligence to be able to tell how good a given drug may be?

As I have said, it's a person's choice whether they wish to take recreational drugs or not. And if anything it doesn't take any intelligence at all to take an unproven substance off a drug dealer, but it takes a lot more intelligence to turn round, question its purity and say "no"