Seems no-one reads the manual any more.....

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Seems no-one reads the manual any more.....

If all car companies did away with the old dash & simply used a large tablet, the driver could have as much or as little info on display as he/she wishes.

From what I see on Top Gear, and reading various motoring magazines, I think this is beginning to happen... -- although, I think, at the moment, because this is new technology, there is a tendency, again, to try and cram too much functionality into one display. :(

Once you can replicate the Bluetooth-to-phone route, and edit what appears on the screen (but always being forced to include 'the important stuff'...), then maybe we'll be getting somewhere.... :confused:
 
Now I'm confused. Are you talking about "29) Catalytic converter warning" ?
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Ah, they've changed the image since the article first went online....

Edit: 29 does look like a BBQ though.
 
From what I see on Top Gear, and reading various motoring magazines, I think this is beginning to happen... -- although, I think, at the moment, because this is new technology, there is a tendency, again, to try and cram too much functionality into one display. :(

Once you can replicate the Bluetooth-to-phone route, and edit what appears on the screen (but always being forced to include 'the important stuff'...), then maybe we'll be getting somewhere.... :confused:

But I already have much of this on my cheapo ebay OBD plug & the torque app on my mobile. I can set it to display anything I like by dragging/dropping dials etc from one screen to another.

But that would require owners to get involved, understand the options and make choices. But we already know they do not read the manual, hence this thread. Is there hope?

And for those less techy, it would simply always show the factory option (just like the car radio or your telly). Also, since the interface would be graphic, anyone with a computer or smartphone would know how to change stuff around etc.

This stuff has been out there for a few years now, I'm amazed that manufacturers haven't jumped on it - chance to save loads of money and make their cars seem more futuristic.
 
our mini has a whacking great big huge speedometer in the middle of the dash
in the centre of that are most of the warning lights all fairly obvious nothing mystical
the fuel gauge is also there, a long with a 7 inch LCD screen which displays pretty much everything else including all computer functions, tyre pressures, service status dab radio etc. G-metre bhp and torque generated etc (lots of various dials and features)

there is also a USB port which with cable syncs with my iphone and allows the radio to control many of the music functions and the mini connected app bluetooth hands free with the center display showing incoming calls info phone signal etc

behind the steering wheel is the rev counter with a couple of lights for head lights fog lights etc and two small multi function lcd displays which repeat the speed outside temp odometer mpg and other trip computer functions as well as set cruise control speed and numerous other things that pop up as and when they are needed...

in all its quite the opposite to the suggestion above the car is extremely well equipped with plenty of configuration in the various displays, the phone brings more than a colour screen, it gives the car access to internet radio and streaming music sites facebook twitter and foursquare access, phone book and fully controllable phone services.
basically the car pulls info off the phone and uses the phones services rather than the phone accessing the cars obd info
This I think is a more likely direction for car manufactures to go, as it stands there are so many phone combinations that it would be difficult to ensure compatibility with every handset, especially once a car is 10 years old and the technology has moved on greatly
 
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I know what all of the warning lights on my Panda do without reading the manual. Although saying that there are only about 10 of them at most including the obvious ones like battery, handbrake, indicators etc....

The Mk2 Panda, of course, is also the apotheosis of pure, intuitive and aesthetic industrial design. :D
 
And how, if you are weak, do you free the nuts with a simple wheelbrace when they have been fitted with a power brace in the workshop?

No, just call out the AA.

Which isn't to say we shouldn't all check our levels and tyres regularly, and understand what the warning lights mean, or at least look at the handbook when one comes on.


Wheel brace on nut - 1 foot on the ground, 1 foot on brace, and then jump

I used to have todo just that, and when windy guns had done i could kill them
WAY over torqued....

i love having my breaker bar these days

Ziggy
 
Wheel brace on nut - 1 foot on the ground, 1 foot on brace, and then jump
Ziggy

Works with a reasonably good wheelbrace, but some manufacturers wheelbraces will twist and pull out of shape under this type of strain.

The trick is to hand the car wheelbrace to the guy who just did the nuts up and ask him to show you how to undo them with "this".

Or call the AA.
 
Just to add that the Speedgear auto gearbox warning on my Punto looks more like the boot open symbol. Seems to cause a lot of confusion, too.... :rolleyes:

Its actually a gearbox with selector knob coming out of it (think old school land Rover) :pHad that on the Bravo when it went funny the other week :(
 
Trouble is, the engine management light and he gearbox light are based on front in-line engine, rear wheel drive. Current engines and gearboxes don't look quite the same any more, although those who don't read the manual, never knew what an engine might look like anyway.
 
our mini has a whacking great big huge speedometer in the middle of the dash
in the centre of that are most of the warning lights all fairly obvious nothing mystical
the fuel gauge is also there, a long with a 7 inch LCD screen which displays pretty much everything else including all computer functions, tyre pressures, service status dab radio etc. G-metre bhp and torque generated etc (lots of various dials and features)

there is also a USB port which with cable syncs with my iphone and allows the radio to control many of the music functions and the mini connected app bluetooth hands free with the center display showing incoming calls info phone signal etc

behind the steering wheel is the rev counter with a couple of lights for head lights fog lights etc and two small multi function lcd displays which repeat the speed outside temp odometer mpg and other trip computer functions as well as set cruise control speed and numerous other things that pop up as and when they are needed...

in all its quite the opposite to the suggestion above the car is extremely well equipped with plenty of configuration in the various displays, the phone brings more than a colour screen, it gives the car access to internet radio and streaming music sites facebook twitter and foursquare access, phone book and fully controllable phone services.
basically the car pulls info off the phone and uses the phones services rather than the phone accessing the cars obd info
This I think is a more likely direction for car manufactures to go, as it stands there are so many phone combinations that it would be difficult to ensure compatibility with every handset, especially once a car is 10 years old and the technology has moved on greatly

The point of the thread, however, is most drivers not understanding what all those lights mean.

And could you clarify "as it stands there are so many phone combinations that it would be difficult to ensure compatibility with every handset".

Also, why would a car need to pull info off a phone/access the internet?
 
It doesn't need to be anywhere as complicated as that, all it needs is a decent sized LCD or TFT screen that would display what the fault was in plain English and a generic warning light. As cars get more complex a warning light for everything is always going to be harder and harder to understand. Especially when 60-75% of people have no interest in their car as long as it moves when required.
 
The point of the thread, however, is most drivers not understanding what all those lights mean.

ok to clarify, the mini has multiple displays which repeat warning info in several places so you can't miss the errors and most warnings tell you the problem in plain english so very few actual warning lights.

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so behind the steering wheel, small rev gauge which is easy to see and not easily obscured by the steering wheel, very few warning lights and two LCD screens that self configure, one of them always displays the vehicle speed when in motion, in the bottom display in the pic you'll see a little warning triangle to tell you there is a warning which is currently being displayed on the main screen.

the centre display screen
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again very few actual warning lights and for the most part everything is repeated on screen in plain text, most things can be checked and monitored through the various menu screens, huge speedo just incase the one behind the wheel isn't enough, fuel gauge etc

basically you don't need to know exactly what the lights mean because its all in plain text as well on one of the screens and if you don't know you can easily find out through the menus

And could you clarify "as it stands there are so many phone and tablet combinations that it would be difficult to ensure compatibility with every handset".

So what i mean by this is, if i have a brand new car and a new phone at some point in the future that car will get older and people will be using newer phones. so a 10 year old car will not necessarily be compatible with the older car, iPhones/iPads don't support huge amounts of bluetooth services to avoid hacking, android phones support more but are more vulnerable to aps which could compromise the phone and then the safety of the car.

point being many companies have proven that cars are not secure enough to hacks and attacks and shown via OBD ports and even through codes hidden in Music CD's the on board systems can be hacked and manipulated braking just one wheel for instance by the ABS system or completely immobilizing the car etc

there are also still plenty of people who don't use smart phones or tablets and replacing the various screens etc with a phone or tablet is obviously dependent on all people having access to the technology (you suggested something about using tablets in stead of the current method of displaying info) which goes back to what happens if years down the road the tablet fails or is broken but is old technology difficult expensive to replace increased security risk of a removable device. devices change size and shape from one generation to the next which means mounting problems as tablets are updated, also the need to lock out functions while driving can't really have people playing angry birds at 70mph, this is something you can't currently do


Also, why would a car need to pull info off a phone/access the internet?

the car uses the phone as it's internet connection so facebook data is pulled from the facebook app, twitter from the twitter app etc that way the car doesn't need to store the log in details for the various apps the phone keeps everything secure, also means if you plug your phone it it will access your info from your phone without needing to enter loads of log in info

so as an example through mini connected i can go into the in car twitter app which logs in via the phone's stored log in info. see what other people are posting to twitter and then select to post a tweet, most of which are predefined bits of info that take info from the cars systems such as "its 23degrees C and i'm driving in my mini" or "driving in my mini and we have 3.2 gallons of fuel left"

with the sat nav system installed in the car (which i've not got) you can google some where like lego land windsor (for example) then when you plug the phone in there is an in car app which lets you sync that info to the sat nav and put directions to what you've googled on to the car's sat nav.

all of the above is done by cable connection so the phone is always on charge while in the car. this also ensures that there is a permanent connection.
the bluetooth is used only for voice calls and syncing contact/calender info as you would with your home computer, (non essential stuff) and most phone features are then posted to the big display screen so you don't have to worry about mounting your phone (although you can get an arm rest phone dock)

The point I was making is that this seems to be the way in car systems are going using smart phones already in the mini BMW and Rolls Royce, the Fiat 500L has also got a big touch screen system which interacts with more than just your MP3 player I think all future fiats are going to this kind of technology.

More simple information displays to feed back info, on more advanced in car systems which are more integrated within the car and can access extra functions and features available via smart phones
I can't see tablets or smart phones actually replacing the in care dash
 

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Never quite understood the rationale behind having a dinner plate sized speedo then having a digital speed read out in front..of course if you go for an integrated sat nav the central speedo is deleted however you then get a second analog speedo fitted next to the rev counter, well if you get done for speeding you can't say you weren't warned.
 
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