Technical Labour Costs Cam Belt

[Borntown]

It's that time to do the dreaded deed.
FIAT Pand 1.2 Active (2012 reg.) 65K miles, is coming up for a timing belt replacement so am shopping around for a garage to do the job. My usual garage claims that it takes 4 hours to do the work, but on further investigation I realise they've not done one on a Fiat Panda and theyre just quoting "worst case" price. I've looked at several YT videos and none of them seem to take more that 2 hours.
Can anyone give me a ball park? Oh yea, one bright spark claimed he would have to change the engine oil and filter to carry out the job!! Is this true? Watching the videos, none of the parts requiring replacement (Belt, tensioner and water pump) are anywhere near the engine oil!!

 

[koalar]

Why do I always have conflicting emotions about doing my own belt this sumer?
A lot of people in and outside this group have said its one of the easiest belts to do on a car but reading this i'm not so confident.
In the hell and brimstone corner weighing in with I've seen too many F..K ups use a main dealer or a good independant is jrk.
And in the piece of p..s corner weighing in at can be done by a complete moron in half an hour is koalar.

Guys this is only a light heated observation but now I'm back sat on the fence about doing the job.

Peoples experience
Depends how they do it
Depends how many they have already done
Depends if they have air con (easier)
Depends on having the correct tools
And so on

Some of the instructions on line are incorrect

There's three way to time these engine depending when it was built, some people use the wrong method

You can cut corners instead of removing the inner wheel arch you can undo three or so screws and peel it back

I have a good selection of 3/8 and 1/2 inch sockets and a selection of L bars and ratchets, access is tight but with the right size sockets and bars it's possible to get square on to every bolt

 

[koalar]

Anyone had experience with Conti belts? someone in work recently done an aux belt twice on a merc and said the conti felt better quality than the gates.

I used them, they work fine

Can't say if they are any better or worse quality wise though

 

[eddyweird]

Peoples experience
Depends how they do it
Depends how many they have already done
Depends if they have air con (easier)
Depends on having the correct tools
And so on

Some of the instructions on line are incorrect

There's three way to time these engine depending when it was built, some people use the wrong method

You can cut corners instead of removing the inner wheel arch you can undo three or so screws and peel it back

I have a good selection of 3/8 and 1/2 inch sockets and a selection of L bars and ratchets, access is tight but with the right size sockets and bars it's possible to get square on to every bolt

Hopefully it's not incorrect on this forum!
Plan is/was to use the advise you and so many others have given/contibuted over the years on doing this job.
Didn't feel the need to start a another thread near the time as I thought it was well and comprehensively covered, but it stills throw up debate.
And welcomed debate may I say especially for a virgin belt changer.

 

[eddyweird]

Sorry Borntown, hope your original question wasn't lost and you have your answer.

 

[Borntown]

If you're anywhere near Norwich, try Italicar. I used them them and they were excellent. Have done loads of Panda timing belt and water pump changes.

Hi, Is that the garage in Renson Close, Norwich? If so I have her booked in early March. They've quoted me £285 including water pump and coolant change which is a far cry from the £467.44 I was quoted from my own garage!!

 

[koalar]

Hi, Is that the garage in Renson Close, Norwich? If so I have her booked in early March. They've quoted me £285 including water pump and coolant change which is a far cry from the £467.44 I was quoted from my own garage!!

Inclusive or plus VAT

 

[Borntown]

Inclusive or plus VAT

Good question.. +VAT I would imagine.

 

[koalar]

Good question.. +VAT I would imagine.

If it's £342

Last year online fixed rate garages were asking just over the £300 on the 1.2 panda/500

So it would appear to me to be in the right ball park

And £285 would be excellent

Price does depend which part of the country you live in, cities where there's more competition are normally cheaper

 

[SPORTPACK50]

Hi, Is that the garage in Renson Close, Norwich? If so I have her booked in early March. They've quoted me £285 including water pump and coolant change which is a far cry from the £467.44 I was quoted from my own garage!!

Yes, that's the one. They know their Italian cars! Price should be inclusive of VAT...my quote was.

 

[Borntown]

Yes, that's the one. They know their Italian cars! Price should be inclusive of VAT...my quote was.

yes you're right, it's not +VAT as he's just informed me they're not VAT registered.
Oh Happy Days!!

 

[Blackie27]

I did mine on my 2009 Panda. I bought the timing lock kit from AliExpress for £4.80. It took me
longer than most due to my disability. I also did a full service at the same time and it took me
6 hours.
I was extra cautious, as it was my first time carrying out a cambelt change. But all went well and
the water pump and belt cost me £34.

 

[DTanner]

@Borntown, a garage quoting £350 for a belt change with water pump sounds like a really good deal to me. Might be worth checking that the parts selected are good brands.

@eddyweird I have changed my timing belt / water pump three times so far. The first time I changed it was my first time ever changing anything more complicated than a headlight bulb. Looking back I realise I knew very little about what I was doing but managed to navigate through it.

On this forum you will find a demographic skewed towards having a preference to take a hands-on approach to car maintenance / repair over taking it to a garage (people like me and maybe you too). However, this is not the best approach for everyone. It depends on many extraneous factors, for example: it is our only family car (for the last 15 years) so each time I work on it I have a narrow window to get it back up and running quickly. I am not an expert so I spend a lot of time reading posts and reviewing videos to figure out and plan my approach in advance and have all the tools and parts ready. Then when I take it on it will invariably take me way longer than others who have more experience. The time commitment and background headspace it required for me was pretty heavy.

I am often in situations where the weather is closing in, I am on the driveway, light is dropping and I am getting tired and frustrated but need to keep pushing on. There will always be things that arise that you may not be prepared for. For me it was things like having all the right sockets and driver only to get to a point where I hit a bolt that required a low profile driver and socket (there was not enough space to fit mine). Each snag ate a chunk of time and were difficult to foresee in advance.

What you should weight up is how much you are willing to balance a £300-400 outlay to a garage (where you can flush all thoughts of this out of your head) against the enjoyment, learning, pride, time, potential pressure, effort and costs (you still pay for parts) to do it yourself. I remember saying to my wife “Why would I pay the garage to have all the fun!”, but it was stressful at times for me.

This post is not to try and dissuade you, just to ask you to consider how these constraints balance for you. It is an open and honest post to someone that seems to be in the same place I was with my first belt change. I would still do it again (if I were to go back in time) but your situation may be different to mine.

 

[Borntown]

Situation Update.
Took Panda to Italicars of Norwich yesterday and although it was ready the same day, I could only retrieve it this morning.
Total cost £285 all in.
Big Shout out to ItaliCars. Well impressed with the garage and crew. Friendly, knowledgeable and approachable and does what it says on the tin.

 

[The Panda Nut]

I may have a chat to them about service and MOT on my 4x4. I cancelled my dealer booking. The more I thought about them not wanting to do what I want rather than what they want the less I liked it. Saying they wanted to a diagnosis before changing the rear diff oil really brassed me off and they just lost a longstanding customer who used to recommend them regularly. Not being bothered to get to know customers who have given them many years of repeat business aint a very sensible business plan in my view as I am not likely ever to go back again.

 

[Borntown]

I may have a chat to them about service and MOT on my 4x4. I cancelled my dealer booking. The more I thought about them not wanting to do what I want rather than what they want the less I liked it. Saying they wanted to a diagnosis before changing the rear diff oil really brassed me off and they just lost a longstanding customer who used to recommend them regularly. Not being bothered to get to know customers who have given them many years of repeat business aint a very sensible business plan in my view as I am not likely ever to go back again.

Unfortunately what with labour and other overheads, dealerships are forced to keep their focus firmly on the Balance Sheet. So the management passes down the organisation a list of boxes that technicians/receptionists/etc need to tick, but thend result is that the customer just becomes a number and not someone that needs to be nurtured and advised sensibly.