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Have you got early PGT or UT pads on? There seem to be diffrent pad numbers for these callipers depending on the disc size.
General just done rear discs + bushes. Pics, Q's and notes
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General just done rear discs + bushes. Pics, Q's and notes
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Pretty sure they use at least all the outer portion of the disc. I reused my almost new bremb's from the front, that had a little lip of rust on the outside of the disc. The rear pads took this off when i first rotated them.
I'm not sure how much of the inner edge of the disc they use, but guessing its all of it.
Tonight I toook it for a spin....I haven't bled again yet, so took it a bit easy, but it all seems to work and no leaks
Handbrake cable is a proper mess, can see how to route it neatly, and the sheath seems a bit too short, so i may look at other cables.
All in all though, it looks like it's going to work out ok.
I'll report again once i have sorted out the teeting problems Then i'm off to rebuild the fronts
Kristian
I'm not sure how much of the inner edge of the disc they use, but guessing its all of it.
Tonight I toook it for a spin....I haven't bled again yet, so took it a bit easy, but it all seems to work and no leaks
Handbrake cable is a proper mess, can see how to route it neatly, and the sheath seems a bit too short, so i may look at other cables.
All in all though, it looks like it's going to work out ok.
I'll report again once i have sorted out the teeting problems
Then i'm off to rebuild the fronts Kristian
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First a pic for arc:
Secondly, a guide said to use the PGT handbrake cable...I thought it was worth a try if it would let me route it neater...no chance.
The sei cable is single piece (i found after i started), the PGT is dual piece and longer. It trvels right up to the handbrake! You may be able to fit an equliser plate and cut some of the body work out, but I'm not doing that.
So i cable tied it up as neat as I could, it'll have to do.
Also bled the rears :bang: no difference.....there is no air coming out, but the pedal travel is very long. Using the pressure bleeder it was pushing some fluid out from around the reservoir, so i may have a leak there, or maybe im expecting too much.
I really need to try a known good conversion and see how different it actually feels.
Bit gutted, not really happy with it the way it is. I will rebuild the fronts next week, and maybe have it bled by a garage, see if that helps.
kristian
//EDIT
how high do you fill your reservoirs? Mine is to the brim with the plunger in.
I remember on the skoda, pedal firmed up a lot as fluid went down. Maybe i should put less fluid in?
Secondly, a guide said to use the PGT handbrake cable...I thought it was worth a try if it would let me route it neater...no chance.
The sei cable is single piece (i found after i started), the PGT is dual piece and longer. It trvels right up to the handbrake! You may be able to fit an equliser plate and cut some of the body work out, but I'm not doing that.
So i cable tied it up as neat as I could, it'll have to do.
Also bled the rears :bang: no difference.....there is no air coming out, but the pedal travel is very long. Using the pressure bleeder it was pushing some fluid out from around the reservoir, so i may have a leak there, or maybe im expecting too much.
I really need to try a known good conversion and see how different it actually feels.
Bit gutted, not really happy with it the way it is. I will rebuild the fronts next week, and maybe have it bled by a garage, see if that helps.
kristian
//EDIT
how high do you fill your reservoirs? Mine is to the brim with the plunger in.
I remember on the skoda, pedal firmed up a lot as fluid went down. Maybe i should put less fluid in?
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do it the old skool way with a mate rather than with the devices, then youll know its been done properly
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did that first off as the pressure bleeder was broken...same result
Took it for a blast tonight thought, and seems to work ok despite longer travel. Not sure how MOT will see it though.
Kristian
Took it for a blast tonight thought, and seems to work ok despite longer travel. Not sure how MOT will see it though.
Kristian
Kristian,
If you want a hand, then come down and I'll sort out your hand brake using the Sei cable no problem,I found the Sei cable much easier than Cinq cable to fix handbrake as the late model Cinqs and Sei got a different cable set up, and you can try out the Sei and the Cinq to see the two slightly diff set ups.
Sei bigger newer styel GT calliper front, larger alloy calliper rear 240mm disc
Cinq older smaller style GT calliper front, older smaller steel calliper rear 227mm disc.
And of course you can look at my lovely Porsche Boxster S 4 piston monobloke Brembo and 310mm brake conversion that is being done to my grale, and see some serious braking power
If you want a hand, then come down and I'll sort out your hand brake using the Sei cable no problem,I found the Sei cable much easier than Cinq cable to fix handbrake as the late model Cinqs and Sei got a different cable set up, and you can try out the Sei and the Cinq to see the two slightly diff set ups.
Sei bigger newer styel GT calliper front, larger alloy calliper rear 240mm disc
Cinq older smaller style GT calliper front, older smaller steel calliper rear 227mm disc.
And of course you can look at my lovely Porsche Boxster S 4 piston monobloke Brembo and 310mm brake conversion that is being done to my grale, and see some serious braking power
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Exactly same setup as mine, so comparing the two will easily highlight any issues i have
I'm in Portsmouth till Sunday afternoon, with no interent, so not this weekend, but will drop you a PM soon to see you
You can have a go in my mine as well
Kristian
That's cool, I am working this weekend anyway, Coventry Airport can't remember if I told you that last time you were down, Nuneaton disused airfield is a Visual Reference Point (VRP) for aircraft flying at 3000ft & below Visual Flight Rules (VFR) ie flying with referance to the ground thought I'd tell you that seeing as you live there and probably notice lots of aircraft going up and own there between Birmingham,, Coventry and East Midlands airports lol totaly off track now!
Aaron.
Aaron.
handbrake cable youll need a cento mreg 1995 one not a later r reg cinq or sei as the cable is about 30cm shorter then the older cinq ones
also when bleeding the rear calipes you need to taek the caliper off and jam a disc inbetween the pads to make the bleed nipple at the top or else youll get a pocket of air stuck as the bleed nipple are not at dead top.
my sei has about 2cm of travel on the pedal and can lock the car in a instant if i wanted it to.
also when bleeding the rear calipes you need to taek the caliper off and jam a disc inbetween the pads to make the bleed nipple at the top or else youll get a pocket of air stuck as the bleed nipple are not at dead top.
my sei has about 2cm of travel on the pedal and can lock the car in a instant if i wanted it to.
handbrake cable youll need a cento mreg 1995 one not a later r reg cinq or sei as the cable is about 30cm shorter then the older cinq ones
also when bleeding the rear calipes you need to taek the caliper off and jam a disc inbetween the pads to make the bleed nipple at the top or else youll get a pocket of air stuck as the bleed nipple are not at dead top.
my sei has about 2cm of travel on the pedal and can lock the car in a instant if i wanted it to.
I didn't change cable on a 51plate Sei, it worked perfect. Didn't have to do anything different than when I did it to my 1997 R reg Cinq or the 1996 P reg Cinq, all the same process and never changed any cables.
I also didn't remove the callipers to bleed them and have a much firmer peddle than I ever did before.
Though you are not alone in having issues.
I'm just getting together the bits for a rear disc setup & wondered if you ended up settling with a Seicento Mpi cable on your Mpi car?
I figure I'll get a spare cable to mod so if anything does go wrong on the day I try & fit them I'll have a fast way to get back to the original setup.
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yep, i have used the original mpi setup, and modding the handbrake cable is the last stage you'll have so i'd not worry about a spare. You can take it down the street nice and easy without a handbrake to make sure its all working before you commit.
The mpi cable isn't the most elegant way of doing it though....it could be a bit longer.
Gazzaman2K suggested a very early cinq cable is longer and a better fit.
Don't forget you hub nuts and possibly spacers ... i certainly needed them, but doesn't seem like everyone does.
Cheers,
Kristian
The mpi cable isn't the most elegant way of doing it though....it could be a bit longer.
Gazzaman2K suggested a very early cinq cable is longer and a better fit.
Don't forget you hub nuts and possibly spacers ... i certainly needed them, but doesn't seem like everyone does.
Cheers,
Kristian
In terms of spacers I think I'll be OK for the minute as I'm sticking to my 13" Wheels.
I take it you suggest a new nut simply 'cos the old one may be knacked, not for some other reason?
Also figured I'd get the spare handbrake cable 'cos then I've got it as a spare inbetween times, I'm not actually planning to fit the rear setup for quite a while yet - just want the bits together so when I get round to it I don't need to fuss.
I take it you suggest a new nut simply 'cos the old one may be knacked, not for some other reason?
Also figured I'd get the spare handbrake cable 'cos then I've got it as a spare inbetween times, I'm not actually planning to fit the rear setup for quite a while yet - just want the bits together so when I get round to it I don't need to fuss.
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Hub nuts should be a use once affair.....they are pre staked on the rears, once they are off once they don't lock on as tight. Some people thread lock them, but i was happier replacing them.....only about £7 a pair from the dealer, and nice heavy brass versions, unlike the factors i got.
I think you misunderstood with regards to the spacers. When i did it, the disc actually sat further in! Without 4mm spacers, the wheels that did fit with the drums, no longer went on! it altered the offset by about 4-4.5mm i'd guess.
This means that even if your wheels to fit on after, you may have reduced the rear track. A wider track up front can increase handling and turn in, but i wouldn't like to actively reduce the rear track.
Seems like some people haven't had this problem, but myself and GoBe have both noticed it.
Kristian
I think you misunderstood with regards to the spacers. When i did it, the disc actually sat further in! Without 4mm spacers, the wheels that did fit with the drums, no longer went on! it altered the offset by about 4-4.5mm i'd guess.
This means that even if your wheels to fit on after, you may have reduced the rear track. A wider track up front can increase handling and turn in, but i wouldn't like to actively reduce the rear track.
Seems like some people haven't had this problem, but myself and GoBe have both noticed it.
Kristian
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The rear hub nuts are torqued down to about 155lbft, with that kind of torque you'll do deform the thread on the nut it's self, which is how things are designed so you don't damage the thread on the stub axle. So not only will the torque setting be incorrect if you reuse the hub nut but also additional damage will have been caused and regardless of thread lock or not can you really trust the threads?
Think I understood what you'd said, but for some reason I'd not thought about the fact that a reduction at the back could be a bad thing
I knew I'd read that a wider front track was good, was thinking about the ratio between front & back, not about the impact of reducing the rear on its own!!!
So around a 4 or 5mm change is likely, something else to bear in mind.
I knew I'd read that a wider front track was good, was thinking about the ratio between front & back, not about the impact of reducing the rear on its own!!!
So around a 4 or 5mm change is likely, something else to bear in mind.
I have seen varying length rear flexi hose extensions mentioned (10cm, 15cm & even 30cm).
Kritip - can you remember the length you used 'cos it looks about right?
As for the fittings, all the different FIAT rear calipers I have ended up collecting so far (UT, Coupe, Punto HGT, Cinquecento, Seicento & 1 unknown variety!!!) have the same thread & depth on their fittings so if anyone is having the hoses made up for the Punto GT rears & they plan to connect to the existing hoses they should need:
A straightforward male fitting at one end (goes into existing flexi hose), & a right angled male fitting (at the caliper end).
Kritip - can you remember the length you used 'cos it looks about right?
As for the fittings, all the different FIAT rear calipers I have ended up collecting so far (UT, Coupe, Punto HGT, Cinquecento, Seicento & 1 unknown variety!!!) have the same thread & depth on their fittings so if anyone is having the hoses made up for the Punto GT rears & they plan to connect to the existing hoses they should need:
A straightforward male fitting at one end (goes into existing flexi hose), & a right angled male fitting (at the caliper end).
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afraid i can 't remember the length but as the front is jacked up at the mo, i may be able to squeeze down the back and measure. Will let you know
Bump me tomorrow night if i forgot
Kristian
Bump me tomorrow night if i forgot
Kristian
afraid i can 't remember the length but as the front is jacked up at the mo, i may be able to squeeze down the back and measure. Will let you know
Bump me tomorrow night if i forgot
Kristian
Did you get chance to measure up?
just take the wheel off, and get a bit of string and measure it. you can roughly gauge where the caliper will be and then how long the flexy needs to be. think kristian is busy with his ECU atm!
