Tuning JTD - GSR induction & Red-Dot remaps!

[ABZSTILO]

Update

Sadly no sign of the bits I'd been hoping would arrive last week So 'tweaks' to the induction kit have been limited to trying out a modification which seems to have helped the GSR equipped Abarth/Schumi 5 cylinder jobs.

Have to report that I have had some success..... which intrigues me :shrug: So much so that if time allows the whole kit will be coming off on Thursday to have an alternate filter fitted to the end along with an 'abzstilo fix' which will be a bit more restrictive than the double-cone filter currently on (as standard) the GSR kit.

Nice to think that this will be a simple cure so I'm prepared for it not to work hope it does as I'm off to Ireland in it next week!!

If Peter is reading this you have a PM from me on Performancestilo which needs an answer sharpish

 

[Argonought]

Re: Update

...limited to trying out a modification which seems to have helped the GSR equipped Abarth/Schumi 5 cylinder jobs.

Have to report that I have had some success..... which intrigues me :shrug:

Is this the bodge (mod ) which Red spoke of in another thread which basically was to use a massive jubilee clip around where the MAF is located and then crush the GSR pipework down to the correct diameter :chin:

 

[ABZSTILO]

re: JTD - GSR induction & Red-Dot remaps!

Pretty accurate description of the 2.4 modification there Argo , just a jubilee placed roughly equidistant between MAF and conefilter and tigtened down a smidgen

Although I have something else planned the trial run I did with the above 'tweak' produced interesting results but I need some additional 'bits' to prove or disprove my thinking :idea:

 

[ABZSTILO]

Solution?!!!!!!!

In an extended and unexpected road trip today I happend to have the silver beastie on a road where previously the engine fault light seemed to be a passenger in the car it appeared that often...... good news is it would seem the jubilee clip modification to the induction has done the business Not a chirp, no light - nowt

But will it last Is it the solution to my woes It's certainly not 'pretty' but seems effective - I'd urge any JTD owners who've experienced the same 'spies' to try this very simple tweak out :yum:

When I get back from Ireland (holiday - going over on Monday) I will still have a few days off so I will be playing with a redesign specifically with the Stilo in mind, if it works the details will be posted up here

 

[Kirbs]

re: JTD - GSR induction & Red-Dot remaps!

So to sum up this thread the GSR air filter is not of merchantable quality!

Now discuss that!!

 

[Argonought]

re: JTD - GSR induction & Red-Dot remaps!

So to sum up this thread the GSR air filter is not of merchantable quality!

I think in fairness GSR have stopped selling these kits but I think it does rather beg the question - after all the bodges/mods have been made to get the kit to function 'correctly' - does any worthwhile advantage remain over the standard induction setup? :chin:

 

[stilosporting]

re: JTD - GSR induction & Red-Dot remaps!

100% if the cone filter is replaced by the standard box then there will be an improvement in airflow regardless of wether the maf housing is in situe or not.

its just to find the exact balance doesnt seem to have been done in the r&d.

so what im saying is given the choice i would still have the gsr (but would include the original maf housing in the creation) over the standard air box. thus giving more air (but not too much) to the engine to increase performance and reduce black smoke.

 

[Argonought]

re: JTD - GSR induction & Red-Dot remaps!

so what im saying is given the choice i would still have the gsr (but would include the original maf housing in the creation) over the standard air box. thus giving more air (but not too much) to the engine to increase performance and reduce black smoke.

Yes, as I've pointed out a couple of times, that should function fine as the ECU would then have an accurate idea of what's happening in regard to true air-flow.

The question is though - since this hasn't been done yet - then no one knows what advantages it does or doesn't offer (might even work better than original kit :chin

 

[stilosporting]

re: JTD - GSR induction & Red-Dot remaps!

it has been done as i did it. it was one of the first things i did with the prototype (punto kit) when i was having issues. there is actually a picture on the forum somewhere too. it reduced the error messages but we were not sure if the error messages were due to the punto induction (as opposed to a stilo specific one) or the induction type itself.

 

[Ffoxy]

re: JTD - GSR induction & Red-Dot remaps!

So... is there a summary to this Thread at all?

 

[stilosporting]

re: JTD - GSR induction & Red-Dot remaps!

not yet but were working on it.

 

[minimad99]

re: JTD - GSR induction & Red-Dot remaps!

Don't forget that i'm having the same although not as frequent overboosting issues as Abz and I don't have the GSR. I do however have the Reddot JTD remap as does Abz, Stilosporting and a few others.
Personally i think the issues originally raised in this thread are to do with the map and not the induction but the GSR probably exagerates(sp) them to be more noticable.

 

[stilosporting]

re: JTD - GSR induction & Red-Dot remaps!

that is a fair and very important point minimad. although i dont have the red dot map. mine is chipped uk. i did also have the overboost issue with the angel tuning map.

so it would be fair to say it is NOT tuner/tuning company related but mapping related. (if the issue lies with the map)

and that the gsr does in fact exaggerates the problem.

one thing that has NOT been tried yet is gsr induction with no remap. and i dont mean a rolling road with it pre map but a full run out for say a thousand miles to check for problems.

 

[Argonought]

re: JTD - GSR induction & Red-Dot remaps!

I'd say there are TWO problems.

The 1st, as minimad, points out is a problem with the Red Dot map. I've never had an issue with the AT map and I gather the same applies to Bozzy who had a map on his longer than most on here. Considering the problems stilosporting has had with his JTD (and current situation ) then I'm not too sure many conclusions should be drawn from the fact his AT map produced some errors :chin:

The 2nd, in my view, is the relocation of the MAF sensor within the GSR induction, as recently commented on, and pretty much proven to be the case by ABZSTILO. If the GSR kit can somehow be modified to attach to the end of the standard MAF fitting then I reckon that particular problem should disappear.

Once that's sorted then any errors generated can pretty much be blamed on the particular map in use. In other words if you're using, shall we say, one of the more stable maps then you wont get any errors

 

[stilosporting]

re: JTD - GSR induction & Red-Dot remaps!

i disagree! no map should be ruled out. my stilo was 3 months old when i got the AT remap and i had P0235 issues. i then got the chipped uk remap and had P0235 issues. red dot tweeked the map slightly and i still had P0235 issues. so i say dont rule out any map. but rule out the people the put the map on the car. meaning they are not solely at fault, they are however the ones that would need to look into a solution.

 

[Argonought]

re: JTD - GSR induction & Red-Dot remaps!

i disagree! no map should be ruled out. my stilo was 3 months old when i got the AT remap and i had P0235 issues. i then got the chipped uk remap and had P0235 issues. red dot tweeked the map slightly and i still had P0235 issues. so i say dont rule out any map. but rule out the people the put the map on the car. meaning they are not solely at fault, they are however the ones that would need to look into a solution.

Yea, but you're missing the common thread.

Your motor has produced PO235 errors with every mapping company. On that basis I'd say you shouldn't blame the mapping companies but should blame the engine.

As it so happens, it looks like you're about to get a complete replacement engine so that should be the end of that

Talking of which, you're going to need to work out what to do with the existing ECU since it will hold a 'live' map of the wrong engine and that would concern me Just hope your PO235 errors aren't related to the ECU itself as that wouldn't be funny

 

[stilosporting]

re: JTD - GSR induction & Red-Dot remaps!

i had the errors before i had the engine replaced the first time. then had the errors on the second engine. i have also had the ecu replaced and again the same problem. so i wouldnt say it was the engine.

 

[ABZSTILO]

re: JTD - GSR induction & Red-Dot remaps!

Aye, it's a swine of a fault

Ho hum - a solution seems no closer as the "2.4" modification isn't the answer Never mind, off to Ireland for a fortnight in the Stilo.... will see how it behaves 'touring'

 

[Argonought]

re: JTD - GSR induction & Red-Dot remaps!

Ho hum - a solution seems no closer as the "2.4" modification isn't the answer Never mind, off to Ireland for a fortnight in the Stilo.... will see how it behaves 'touring'

Thing is Abz, even with induction 'sorted' you still have a Red Dot map and based on minimad's post that could still be your problem.

Anyway, have a good trip

 

[ABZSTILO]

re: JTD - GSR induction & Red-Dot remaps!

Back from the emerald isle and, some 2k miles later, the engine fault is still there Mind you, averaged something like 52mpg on the trip Having a think at the moment about possibly replacing the car with something else Fiat and diesel but determined to get to the bottom of the fault first.....
I'm still not 100% convinced the induction is entirely to blame and methinks something within the remap is suspect.
So, it's possible I may try an alternate remap from another company to try and prove once and for all where the "blame" lies - just don't let "she who must be obeyed" find out or my nuts will get chopped off