Panda (Classic) John Dragon Man's 4x4 Sisley

[Most Easterly Pandas]

yeah. thanks. i guess ill just park him around the back. the mot, tax and insurance is due by the end of the month anyway. thats a good £2k for me and insurance costs for talon alone. the marbella is ready for its mot. will get that through and see if that gets it price up more.

John, word of advise, reMOT it now, easier to get her back on the road / sell when sitting with and MOT than sitting without

 

[blu73]

as someone with multiple cars i can see the sense in the above statement.. As ultimately all you need to do is ring insurance and then pop to post office when it next moves, its much more of a big deal to pull a car out and give it the once over, get insurance just so you can drive to an MOT and in turn tax. And you know sods law something will fail from non-use and fail the mot and cost more money.

 

[goodgirl156]

Have to agree, collecting a car with no tax and test involves a transporter for any one who likes to stay legal and this offsets the cost massively, that and a car with no MOT is a unknown variable for many many people that they wont want to take on.... unless your me and clinically insain

 

[scout]

Yes I understand what you guys are saying however there are a few things that you need to appreciate (coming from a 'regular' car buyer not an enthusiast).

1. The panda 4X4 market is very limited, as I stated above, unless you know what your looking at its an old tatty Panda.
2. What is asked and what is achieved are two completely different animals.
3. There are very good examples of the Panda out there (I know I was at the NEC ) and I'm not sure even these would achieve sky high prices.
4. If your selling to a non Panda enthusiast/forum member (as in an auction) then they WILL look at the mis-matched panels, any rust spots etc and will 'mark' it down, therefore even an enthusiast will get it at the rock bottom price as nobody will bid against them.
5. If I saw a car being sold just before the MOT ran out it would ring alarm bells and I would be wondering what bill I'd be in for to get the new MOT. This would affect the amount I would be willing to invest.

I know you guys love your little tin boxes but realisticly in a tatty condition needing much fettling they are not going to achieve big prices.
I would love to be proved wrong on this point (but only after I get mine ) but feel there are a few more years to go before this happens.

Personally I would say unless you really really need to get shot of it keep it SORN'ed and as and when you can afford it bring it back to its former glory ready to bring it back to life when you can afford to run it again (It will happen, honest, even if you don't think so now). It is worth much more to you long term as Talon than it is as short term cash.

 

[goodgirl156]

I respect your opinion, but you do not buy a 20 year old fiat panda 4x4 now with out actively looking for one.

You could use your argument against the old fiat 500, perhaps a Citroën DS, or any number of now classic cars - i'm afraid that the argument doesn't hold water.

If I said, right, I need a 3 door hatch thats cheep to run and cheep to insure I would be looking at new shape panda, punto, sci, something horrid and french even, not a panda.

The panda will never appeal to that markit and cannot be priced in that manner. Pricing is relative, and subject to demand in that respect you are correct. The fact of the matter is you cannot get a panda for the money you are suggesting it sells for, so any one wanting a panda has to spend above that and at that level, pricing is only so important.

If it were to be offloaded at the price you suggest there would be a hole cue of us chucking money at him, doesn't that tell you something?

 

[Didge3]

Scout I agree with you in some ways but its very unlikely a complete randomer is ever going to look at buying a 20+ year old Panda at all so the market isn't really aimed at them, John's Panda being a Sisley should immediately plonk it in enthusiast territory and therefore condition is down to mechanics and bits that are hard to get (interior) both of which I believe are good on this Panda. As always its worth what someone is willing to pay for it but I would say with new MOT & Tax (the buyer doesn't have to worry about anything for a year really) it should be worth around £1000 easily.

Just my 2 pence

 

[scout]

I agree with you both and agree if it was priced at sub £500 I would consider it however John was talking about auctioning it off and with a ltd audience the price would be lower than if offered on here for instance. It may take a while to sell but over £1000 may be achievable. I still maintain that as a vehicle it is worth more to the present owner than would be its monetary value on the open market.

As far as the monetary value, as of yet one hasnt been set. You, @goodgirl156, have said you would buy it at £500. Would you buy it at £1000? If you are willing to pay £1000 then John has his answer. At the end of the day its down to the price John is willing to let it go for and the price one person is willing to pay for it. If theres a que of people willing to pay £500 then that is too low I would agree. If however there is only one person then that is what its worth.

 

[scout]

Scout I agree with you in some ways but its very unlikely a complete randomer is ever going to look at buying a 20+ year old Panda at all so the market isn't really aimed at them, John's Panda being a Sisley should immediately plonk it in enthusiast territory and therefore condition is down to mechanics and bits that are hard to get (interior) both of which I believe are good on this Panda. As always its worth what someone is willing to pay for it but I would say with new MOT & Tax (the buyer doesn't have to worry about anything for a year really) it should be worth around £1000 easily.

Just my 2 pence

For Johns sake I hope your right and I would gladly be proved wrong.

 

[goodgirl156]

As far as the monetary value, as of yet one hasnt been set. You, @goodgirl156, have said you would buy it at £500. Would you buy it at £1000?

If I was in the market for another, yes but I have a drive full already.

 

[Palio]

For Johns sake I hope your right and I would gladly be proved wrong.

For John's sake I would prefer you to be right Bob, coz he wouldn't then consider selling it!

And yes I would also buy it at £1000 if I was in the market - as you know (we counted em up at the NEC ) there's no way I can have another though . And the reason I'd buy it at £1000 is that it's probably £1500 to the right person. It's a cracking proper off-roader for £1k - all sorted and ready to plunge through Yorkshire

Edit: to put into context a rotten 4x4 will cost you £500. To get it fit for off-road use I'd have to pay more than £500 to a mechanic, and still wouldn't be confident it was roadworthy - that's why it's £1000 minimum to anyone wanting one.

 

[scout]

For John's sake I would prefer you to be right Bob, coz he wouldn't then consider selling it!

And yes I would also buy it at £1000 if I was in the market - as you know (we counted em up at the NEC there's no way I can have another though ). And the reason I'd buy it at £1000 is that it's probably £1500 to the right person. It's a cracking proper off-roader for £1k - all sorted and ready to plunge through Yorkshire

I have to agree with you, I think its better off with John than anyone else. So far we have two people saying they would buy it for £1000 but can't and one saying they would buy it sub £500. Unfortunately with the data we have that puts the value sub £500 as there is someone willing to part with readies at that price but not at £1000. (Yes I know this is a very small sample and a very closed market but I think it demonstrates my point. Its only worth what someone is willing to pay for it.) That is the market value at the moment.

 

[goodgirl156]

(Yes I know this is a very small sample and a very closed market but I think it demonstrates my point.

No, no it doesn't

we could look at arguably the less valuable panda's (none 4x4) and some 4x4 prices

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Classic-R...8726632?pt=Automobiles_UK&hash=item3a8756f6e8

£1500 with 1 bid

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1992-FIAT...7177973?pt=Automobiles_UK&hash=item1c391b5975

BIN of 950

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FIAT-PAND...2563637?pt=Automobiles_UK&hash=item4d14ddd335

2.9k

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1990-Fiat-Panda-750L-/161149767313?pt=Automobiles_UK&hash=item2585464e91

£1500

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1991-J-RE...0510365?pt=Automobiles_UK&hash=item51b34cde9d

2.8k winning bid

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1989-Fiat-Panda-4x4-/290990935839?pt=Automobiles_UK&hash=item43c0694f1f

Ended at 1.7k

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FIAT-PAND...7618391?pt=Automobiles_UK&hash=item43c036b057

Ended at 2.2k

I have been reminded however that arguing on the internet is about as useful and constrictive as a condom machine in the vatican - so I bow out of this now

 

[purple haze]

£120 for two doors and £1000 for a respray and it's a £2500-£3000 car. That's been proved. The way it is a non panda nut looking for an off-roader or dare I say a charity rally car would pay £1200-£1500 when they see how much work has been done. That's been proved by the questions asked on ebay sales. After a weekend at the NEC I still have the same questions ringing in my ears.... How much can I get one for? Where can I get one? I always wanted a 4x4! I'm going to look for one as I have great memories of my old one! Wow, £2000 not much to pay.

 

[Palio]

:yeahthat:

And mildly straying from 4x4's, I had lengthy conversations with 2 people about mk1's. Both failed to turn a funny colour, fall over, or generally question the sanity of Casper being prepared for sale at circa £4000. One actually seemed quite interested, and clearly felt it would be a £6k car in a few years - I tend to agree......

 

[scout]

No, no it doesn't

we could look at arguably the less valuable panda's (none 4x4) and some 4x4 prices

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Classic-Red-Fiat-Panda-Selecta-1994-Outstanding-Inside-and-Out-/251378726632?pt=Automobiles_UK&hash=item3a8756f6e8

£1500 with 1 bid

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1992-FIAT-PANDA-1000-CLX-IE-RED-/121217177973?pt=Automobiles_UK&hash=item1c391b5975

BIN of 950

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FIAT-PANDA-CLASSIC-1-0-FIRE-CLX-1993-1-OWNER-FROM-NEW-20-000-GENIUNE-MILES-MINT-/331062563637?pt=Automobiles_UK&hash=item4d14ddd335

2.9k

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1990-Fiat-Panda-750L-/161149767313?pt=Automobiles_UK&hash=item2585464e91

£1500

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1991-J-REG-FIAT-PANDA-4X4-SISLEY-SPECIAL-EDITION-/350900510365?pt=Automobiles_UK&hash=item51b34cde9d

2.8k winning bid

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1989-Fiat-Panda-4x4-/290990935839?pt=Automobiles_UK&hash=item43c0694f1f

Ended at 1.7k

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FIAT-PANDA-SISLEY-4X4-1990-/290987618391?pt=Automobiles_UK&hash=item43c036b057

Ended at 2.2k

I have been reminded however that arguing on the internet is about as useful and constrictive as a condom machine in the vatican - so I bow out of this now

And there was me thinking it was a discussion . I was not trying to be argumentative, just putting the 'other side'. Its no good everyone saying "No problem you'll get at least £2000 for that" when there are issues with the car for a potential buyer that doesn't know the seller. Unless a Sisley was the only car I could live with in the Panda range I, as a relative novice in the car maintenance/upkeep/restoration process, would avoid this car as being a lot of work to get it to a standard I would be happy with. As I have said I am more than happy to be proved wrong and as far as price is concerned (apart from some very old, very rare vehicles) is dependant on condition, all those above are, at least cosmetically, in better condition than Talon. However Talon being a Sisley there is probably a floor to the price that it won't drop below, its just nobody knows that floor. There are a few things going against Talon. one is the mis matched panels, club members and friends say it adds character & shows that its been looked after, buyers say "that will need a respray". Another is the fact that the MOT is nearly up. This all gives a potential buyer leverage to reduce the price for themselves. You are of course further reducing your market aswell, I for instance, unlike John, am not handy with the welder so things that John think are minor problems would cost me money to fix. The best thing is to see what the future brings.Personally I hope John can find a way of keeping it as it seems to suit him and he'll find it difficult to replace when the going gets better, but if he sells it I hope he gets a good price for it. I would have thought any car with a years MOT should be worth at least £700 (& hopefully as others have said more), without (as this one will be soon) becomes a bit of a crap shoot TBH.

Anyway, @Dragon Man I hope you can find a way of keeping your Talon even if you have to SORN it to cut expenditure. As I said in an earlier post I dont think you would get the price for it that its worth as a vehicle to you and in a few years time it will be almost impossible to replace (You know what these Panda owners are like , never give up thier babys and with the Panda killer about). I hope you turn the corner soon and the outlook becomes brighter.

 

[scout]

£120 for two doors and £1000 for a respray and it's a £2500-£3000 car. That's been proved. The way it is a non panda nut looking for an off-roader or dare I say a charity rally car would pay £1200-£1500 when they see how much work has been done. That's been proved by the questions asked on ebay sales. After a weekend at the NEC I still have the same questions ringing in my ears.... How much can I get one for? Where can I get one? I always wanted a 4x4! I'm going to look for one as I have great memories of my old one! Wow, £2000 not much to pay.

Where can I get a respray for £1000?, whenever I came close to getting a good respray done I've been quoted more than that.

 

[purple haze]

Same place as I did...if you think mine looks ok.

 

[goodgirl156]

Looking at getting mine done, would it be rude to ask for the details please?

 

[PuntoHowTo]

I have to agree with scout500 there can be a large disparity between what someone wants and what someone thinks its worth.

for something like a mint condition car with no rust and original condition there will always be someone out there with the money to pay top dollar especially in the case of a Sisley which gives a little more kudos

However even a little bit of rust will drop the price a ding here a dent there and £4000 car is suddenly not worth a lot.

Seeing what they have been selling for on eBay including the blue one which went for a surprising £2800 and all the scrappers that have consistently not sold and reappeared, I would personally value Talon at around £800 and that't the point I would bow out of bidding. The £2800 car that sold recently was a bit of a special car in that it was completely original from new one owner being sold by the dealer who sold it originally, and even then I felt it was over priced for the condition it was in.

If put into a local car auction you'd be lucky to get £200-300 so not worth considering.

I would also like to know where you'll get a decent respray for £1000.

 

[Palio]

The £2800 car that sold recently was a bit of a special car in that it was completely original from new one owner being sold by the dealer who sold it originally, and even then I felt it was over priced for the condition it was in.

That one was discussed at some length. We all felt it was waaayyyy over what we thought it was worth.

It wasn't original as the wheels are wrong & seriously devalue it for an enthusiast. More importantly a dealer selling it with 1 month mot, loads of rust and a huge (tricky looking) dent in the side didn't sound like £2000 to us. We were clearly all wrong & it's one of many recently shifting 4x4 prices upwards.