General Help, Big Repair bill...

[Digi Dreamer]

Hi, needing urgent advice,

Sump collapsed, metal moths been busy,, Garage has quoted a 2000-pound repair bill to replace the VVT pulley, Oil Pick up and pump, Sump,

the cars a 2014 panda 1.2 pop, stalled turning a corner, car began to run rough, had grounded on a speed hump a few days earlier. last oil check about 1 month ago, minor top up.

no oil warning light came on.

thought the cam belt had slipped, cars only done 37000 miles drove a few miles home watching for the oil light, took 2 ltrs of oil when i got home, had a P0016 fault code, now cleared

the garage retimed the cam belt, said the VVT ran dry. engine runs smooth but fast

what are my options, hoping just a new sump and VVT pulley. how can i test the old pulley

got 3 days till my MOT runs out, and which timing tools do i need to replace the pulley.
any advice?

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

still leaking from sump seal, don't want to have to cut it all off again, any leak stop additives recommended? probably only works on seals not sealing compounds, looks like it's going back to a garage..

Is it leaking from the front - timing belt end of the engine? The generic sump - bought from a factor - which I fitted to our old "Felicity" leaked here first time so I had to do it again. On close examination it could be seen that this cheap sump just wasn't very well formed and I had to use a thicker bead of sealant in that area than I would have liked. I would now either buy a sump from S4p or from my local Fiat indy - who I believe actually sources his from them too! The one they fitted to my boy's Punto was one of those and definitely of better quality, although a wee bit more pricey - Gets what you pays for?

As far as sealant goes I've been using Loctite si 5980 black silicone sealant for all these sort of jobs for some years and never had a problem with it. Although labeled a silicon sealant it's oxygen sensor friendly so you've no need to worry about contamination. I approve of the blue Hylomar too but it's better for tight fitting parts in my opinion whereas the si 5980 can cope with poor fits. I like using the hylomar as a belt and braces with gaskets. I've no experience of Tiger Seal.

 

[Digi Dreamer]

Think it's from the flywheel end, put plenty on, may have hit a stud while assembling and rubbed the sealant off, going to find someone to do it, not lying under the car again for a while, -8Deg C last night, should take a garage long to do

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

Think it's from the flywheel end, put plenty on, may have hit a stud while assembling and rubbed the sealant off, going to find someone to do it, not lying under the car again for a while, -8Deg C last night, should take a garage long to do

Yup, very easy to catch the sealant against something whilst fitting isn't it. Very sensible not to try this in the present cold weather too. My boy's Punto needs front discs and pads quite badly and we've been battling really shocking colds for over a week now - just can't face a morning in the cold on my driveway at this time. He's got his ears tuned for listening for the first scraping sounds and he'll bring it right here at the first sign! - got the disc rotors and pads sitting right here.

 

[Digi Dreamer]

Think this may be my last fiat, getting to complex, getting fed up with can bus and bcm's, fighting the indicators, want something simpler. as soon as the leaks sorted, then "we buy any car"..

 

[jackwhoo]

Hi,
You will be hard pressed to find any vehicle without can bus / bcms etc unless its something built before the year 2000.
(-:

 

[Digi Dreamer]

i know, and hydraulic pas, not keen on abs either, doesn't stop on snow, have to used the hand brake to get it to stop.

 

[Marcus Daly]

Aye, hard to think of any car on sale less complex than a Panda.

 

[Digi Dreamer]

mk1 panda? my 2014 like the space shuttle in comparison

 

[Panda IIs]

Aye, hard to think of any car on sale less complex than a Panda.

Reality is that the Panda has most of the same systems as any other current ENCAP type modern vehicle and indeed perhaps less functionality than some. There are probably only a handful of Tier 1 suppliers of control systems etc to the industry; the issues are not unique to FIAT - many vehicles share the same systems. I do understand the sentiment of these comments, this is why I keep my Volvo 940 as by way of an antidote!

Ironically the issues that bought the OP to the forum, specifically this thread, related to apparent mechanical issues (leaks, corrosion etc). The diagnostics threw up some codes which may or may not have been related. One of the issues I come across is how folk interpret error codes and often fail to get to the root cause (easier said than done I know) and fire the "parts cannon".

Wait for the trials and tribulations that will be associated with EVs... EVs that are currently quoted as requiring less routine maintenance as part of a sales pitch... The reality is there's just not enough data out there yet.

 

[Digi Dreamer]

EV's are worrying enough, by the time they reach the likes of me, second/third user, they are worn out, running gear and batteries.

my car history has come up from austin mini, old skodas (Rear Engine), mechanics have been more important than electricals, don't mind error codes but some things don't need to be controlled by the vehicle,

 

[Herts Hillhopper]

The hard reality is to find a car that doesn't have error codes (and so doesn't have an ODB port and even a very basic fault-logging system) means going back to a car registered maybe 25 years ago. That means it will have many other issues instead. Rust for starters. The electronics of a modern car , and the generation of 'service technicians' brought up with them are fine - so long as codes are seen only as the very slightest hint of where problem may lye, and that the cause (more often than not, a failing battery or breaking wire to a sensor) is properly investigated before any other work is done. The best way to achieve that seems to be to steer well clear of 'dealer servicing', and find a good independent specialist workshop. I've found a great local one for the Fiat, and for the Volvo V50 we had till recently, a local garage here in town. The fault on the Volvo through up suggested it needed a new catalyst and various sensors connected to that (at huge expense). Not believing the codes, they followed all the wiring and found a small wire from a pressure sensor had broken high up at the back of the bonnet by the battery -- no where near the cat or any of its sensors. They charged me £45 for the diagnosis and repair (the latter being to solder in a short length of new wire). Don't get disheartened - just find a great garage.

 

[Digi Dreamer]

good garages have become a rarity, sad to say, looking for one to sort me leak. should just be labour.

 

[Panda IIs]

for the Volvo V50 we had till recently, a local garage here in town. The fault on the Volvo through up suggested it needed a new catalyst and various sensors connected to that (at huge expense). Not believing the codes, they followed all the wiring and found a small wire from a pressure sensor had broken high up at the back of the bonnet by the battery -- no where near the cat or any of its sensors. They charged me £45 for the diagnosis and repair (the latter being to solder in a short length of new wire). Don't get disheartened - just find a great garage.

Hi @Herts Hillhopper if you need a Volvo independent I can happily recommend Rob at Riverway Workshop in Harlow. He has loads of (Volvo trained) experience and seems pretty reliable in the probably 10+ years I've used him (940). I'm assuming you are using Jamie at Alfa/Fiat workshop these days for the Italian job?

 

[Herts Hillhopper]

Hi @Herts Hillhopper if you need a Volvo independent I can happily recommend Rob at Riverway Workshop in Harlow. He has loads of (Volvo trained) experience and seems pretty reliable in the probably 10+ years I've used him (940). I'm assuming you are using Jamie at Alfa/Fiat workshop these days for the Italian job?

View attachment 416388

Thank you. The car’s gone now: we were in a position to replace it, so did, at 10 years and 100,000 miles. It never really was a Volvo - the v50 was basically a Ford Focus estate (every part except the trim was labelled Ford if you looked). The engine said FoMoCo on the front and Peugeot on the back - made in a facility jointly run by Ford and PSA (and also used in things like Landrover Freelander as well!)

My Panda has a bit labelled Ford too - I think it’s a pressure sensor for the particulate trap.

Yes to Jamie.

 

[Panda IIs]

Thank you. The car’s gone now: we were in a position to replace it, so did, at 10 years and 100,000 miles. It never really was a Volvo - the v50 was basically a Ford Focus estate (every part except the trim was labelled Ford if you looked). The engine said FoMoCo on the front and Peugeot on the back - made in a facility jointly run by Ford and PSA (and also used in things like Landrover Freelander as well!)

My Panda has a bit labelled Ford too - I think it’s a pressure sensor for the particulate trap.

Yes to Jamie.

Ah yes a Volvo by name only! I think things have improved as they have tried to get back to their roots more recently(?). Well Panda is Ka platform too... Good source for some of the more tricky exhaust clamps etc I believe the front suspension (wishbone for example) are identical too?? This is kind of the point I was trying to make above; most OEMs design from the handful of Tier 1 Supplier's parts bin!

 

[Marcus Daly]

EV's are worrying enough, by the time they reach the likes of me, second/third user, they are worn out, running gear and batteries.

The era of actually owning cars is drawing to a close. It won’t be a problem you’ll have to contend with.

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

i know, and hydraulic pas, not keen on abs either, doesn't stop on snow, have to used the hand brake to get it to stop.

Oh yes, re the ABS. Leaving my youngest boy's house a few days ago - he's out to the south of the city and considerably higher up than us so lots of snow and ice - traveling very gently down the little road which leads onto the main road and taking it very slowly and carefully (maybe 10mph max) trying to stop at the T junction ABS firing off wildly and sounding like a machine gun as we sailed serenely on until the front wheels hit the salted surface of the main road when she stopped almost instantly. Luckily no cars on the main road (it was quite late at night) so no one inconvenienced, and we stopped with about 2 ft of the bonnet in the running lane of the main road so likely, because the main road was salted, if someone had been coming down the main road they could have avoided us, but it was a most unsettling experience. Luckily I have a cable operated hand brake but I don't think it would have made any difference on the packed snow/ice in the lane. The good thing is that it's reminded me how difficult it can get on these slippy surfaces and made me even more aware than I otherwise would have been.

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

mk1 panda? my 2014 like the space shuttle in comparison

Yes, I loved ours dearly. Try and find one that's not falling to pieces with tin worm though!

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

Oh yes, the seductive allure of a "simple" car. For many years I've been resisting the powerful desire to own a Morris Minor Traveler - a car I worked on a lot in my early days in workshops and have a full original workshop manual for. I've nearly succumbed on a number of occasions. However I usually manage to dissuade my self by thinking about all that structural wood! Now I'm getting older, and considering whether I really should be driving the length of the country two or three times a year, the attraction is becoming much more difficult to resist. If I was going to do it at all I think I'd be tempted to buy a fully restored one with a 1275 engine, disc brakes and a few other options from Charles Ware: I could do all my own servicing and repairs but return it to him if any major structural repairs were needed.

 

[Motorcyclist Colin]

Buy a Citroen 2CV from about 1978/80 take it to a specialist 2CV restored and rebuild it from the ground up with everything rustproofed. It will go on for ever and NEVER give you any electronics problem.
Just by way of example, consider it.s air con system, a flap under the windscreen. Simples!
I remember Colin Chapman's quote when he first started building Lotus's "Simplicate and add lightness" I
In contrast to the modern ethos ,I suspect "Complicate it as far as possible, often with things no-one needs and then charge as much as you can get away with"


No need to tell me, I know I,m a dinosaur, and all that's totally unrealistic