General Help, Big Repair bill...

[Digi Dreamer]

Hi, needing urgent advice,

Sump collapsed, metal moths been busy,, Garage has quoted a 2000-pound repair bill to replace the VVT pulley, Oil Pick up and pump, Sump,

the cars a 2014 panda 1.2 pop, stalled turning a corner, car began to run rough, had grounded on a speed hump a few days earlier. last oil check about 1 month ago, minor top up.

no oil warning light came on.

thought the cam belt had slipped, cars only done 37000 miles drove a few miles home watching for the oil light, took 2 ltrs of oil when i got home, had a P0016 fault code, now cleared

the garage retimed the cam belt, said the VVT ran dry. engine runs smooth but fast

what are my options, hoping just a new sump and VVT pulley. how can i test the old pulley

got 3 days till my MOT runs out, and which timing tools do i need to replace the pulley.
any advice?

 

[Digi Dreamer]

researched the VVT pulley, loss of pressure shouldn't cause permanent damage, what position does it get set to, 1/2 way between stops or one or the other stop?

 

[eeeno]

OK, well you could try cleaning the VVT solenoid screen with brake cleaner - which might be blocked and prevent adequate oil flow from getting into the vvt system. The solenoid's on the valve cover secured with a small hex bolt. Easy.

So the garage did full timing belt change with water pump and tensioner? It's waste of money to re-time the old cambelt - same job, same bill.

You need a new sump - you can't keep driving and dripping oil all over the place. I remember it's said that one drop of oil pollutes thousand litres of ground water - so don't drive it.

So my idea would be to first clean the solenoid to see if the vvt system starts to work properly. Does the oil pressure warning stay on while driving? Then it needs a new oil pump - if no warning and no code, my guess is that it does not need a new oil pump. Then i'd change only the sump and get the oil pump screen cleaned.

 

[Digi Dreamer]

OK, well you could try cleaning the VVT solenoid screen with brake cleaner - which might be blocked and prevent adequate oil flow from getting into the vvt system. The solenoid's on the valve cover secured with a small hex bolt. Easy.

So the garage did full timing belt change with water pump and tensioner? It's waste of money to re-time the old cambelt - same job, same bill.

You need a new sump - you can't keep driving and dripping oil all over the place. I remember it's said that one drop of oil pollutes thousand litres of ground water - so don't drive it.

So my idea would be to first clean the solenoid to see if the vvt system starts to work properly. Does the oil pressure warning stay on while driving? Then it needs a new oil pump - if no warning and no code, my guess is that it does not need a new oil pump. Then i'd change only the sump and get the oil pump screen cleaned.

just received an oil pressure tester to check the pump, need to work out which sump, 10mm or 8mm holes, think the oil warning light switch is defective, never activated, was intending to flush the oil pickup.

 

[varesecrazy]

MOT isnt a disaster..

Plenty of knowledge on here re the VVT..

Search for @jackwhoo posts

And @puntodeltathema

Had a VVT timing problem resolution

 

[jackwhoo]

@koalar

Has recently helped someone with a vvt solenoid valve problem- fine gauze at bottom of valve can get blocked.

If you only added 2 litres of oil to get level to max on dipstick Then you had oil left in sump - not much but possibly enough to prevent disaster.

If obd code for crank / cam sync the could be vvt valve issue.

 

[jackwhoo]

Hi, needing urgent advice,

Sump collapsed, metal moths been busy,, Garage has quoted a 2000-pound repair bill to replace the VVT pulley, Oil Pick up and pump, Sump,

the cars a 2014 panda 1.2 pop, stalled turning a corner, car began to run rough, had grounded on a speed hump a few days earlier. last

the garage retimed the cam belt, said the VVT ran dry. engine runs smooth but fast

Does this concern anyone else?

Why mess with the cam timing given the reported problem?

Lots of people/ garages included run into problems cam /crank timing because they don't use the required special tools.

My feeling is it would be very very wise to buy the special tools and check it yourself using the guides on this forum.

 

[varesecrazy]

Wiping off the oil sender wiring along with the sump pan is worse

 

[Digi Dreamer]

what oil pressure should i expect from the pump? will check it tonight..

 

[jackwhoo]

Oil pressure switches in general tend to switch off around 6 psi.
You should see more than that at idle speed.
Post pressure you see at idle speed and at 3000rpm. I'm sure lots of people will help interpret your results.
Best wishes
Jack

 

[jackwhoo]

You can check your oil pressure warning light system by grounding the switch wire to the engine , when engine running you should get a warning on dash.
Switch should be closed circuit with no pressure.

 

[Digi Dreamer]

Thanks, Hoping for 50+ PSI, sorta average car pressure.

looking at cam alignment kits, take it as long as it's got the crank and cam lock and adjusting leaver for the water pump adjuster it'll be ok

 

[jackwhoo]

@Pugglt Auld Jock

Timing tool advice ?

 

[eeeno]

Have you done cambelt jobs before? There's plenty of work involved so, i'd suggest that you consider it again. Unless you have a good mechanic friend who can help you and lend you the tools.

I've done mine first time a month ago and can honestly suggest against doing it. £200 for the job itself sounds quite cheap to me. It's such a hassle doing it the first time.

 

[Digi Dreamer]

used to do all my own maintenance, to complete rebuilds, know the old fire engine well, the new bells and whistles are the problem.

things just get slower and more painful

 

[eeeno]

Congratulations then, just do it. Good luck! Aliexpress sells quite cheap £20 + sets of timing tools for Fire 1.4 and 1.2 with VVT pulley locks (they're really needed). Infact it's the same set that I needed for my 1.4. I got it faster from Poland warehouse.

 

[Digi Dreamer]

kinda lost confidence in the garage, working full time, not much quality time.

i could do a Suzuki jimny wheel hub seal and bearing in 3 hrs. wife thinks cars are just for driving about in..

 

[Digi Dreamer]

Congratulations then, just do it. Good luck! Aliexpress sells quite cheap £20 + sets of timing tools for Fire 1.4 and 1.2 with VVT pulley locks (they're really needed). Infact it's the same set that I needed for my 1.4. I got it faster from Poland warehouse.

seen some on ebay, for the panda EVO 2012, but nothing later, asked the sellers but no one seems to know if it'll fit the later models, has 5 parts + Bolts

 

[koalar]

My thoughts

It started off simple

P0016

Wrong oil
Blocked vvt solenoid
Phonic relearn
Wrong timing
2000-pound repair bill get another garage

If the VVT pulley has been loosened you need 3x timing tools

Oil pressure is

Pressure @ idle 10 psi
Pressure @ 4000 RPM 58 psi

Not sure but guess that’s hot engine

Not sure I understand

Sump collapsed, metal moths been busy,, Garage has quoted a 2000-pound repair bill to replace the VVT pulley, Oil Pick up and pump,
Sump,

If I have a weeping sump I change the sump. Nothing else

I use to do component level electronic repairs. When a unit came in I would change what was faulty and ship it out repaired. Everything is simple

Use to take much longer to repair units where someone else had been there first. Not only do you have to do the above but also fix what they have done wrong not knowing which bits or parts they had touched fitted badly or wrong parts fitted

 

[Digi Dreamer]

My thoughts

It started off simple

P0016

Wrong oil
Blocked vvt solenoid
Phonic relearn
Wrong timing
2000-pound repair bill get another garage

If the VVT pulley has been loosened you need 3x timing tools


View attachment 413814

Oil pressure is

Pressure @ idle 10 psi
Pressure @ 4000 RPM 58 psi

Not sure but guess that’s hot engine

Not sure I understand

Sump collapsed, metal moths been busy,, Garage has quoted a 2000-pound repair bill to replace the VVT pulley, Oil Pick up and pump,
Sump,

If I have a weeping sump I change the sump. Nothing else

I use to do component level electronic repairs. When a unit came in I would change what was faulty and ship it out repaired. Everything is simple

Use to take much longer to repair units where someone else had been there first. Not only do you have to do the above but also fix what they have done wrong not knowing which bits or parts they had touched fitted badly or wrong parts fitted

p0016 showed after the stall and missfire, thought the belt had jumped a tooth or so. oil had disappeared from the last check a few weeks earlier, no pools of oil where i park, garage said it was pouring of sump, i had refilled it, i'll check the pickup pipe when the sumps off, and the solenoid valve.

that looks like the kit i'm looking at