Tuning Getting more power and torgue out of the 100hp

[miksfiatpanda]

Hi, I'm wondering if there is an easy way to get more power and/or torque out of the 100hp without doing an engine swap. Is getting a new cold air intake and full custom exhaust going help? Anything else I could try?

Whilst I have your attention, has anyone fitted bucket seats into a panda? I'd love to get something with more support and potentially lower than stock seats. Cheers

 

[varesecrazy]

Rotrex supercharger
Been mentioned a few times

Welcome

 

[jimboy]

Hi, I'm wondering if there is an easy way to get more power and/or torque out of the 100hp without doing an engine swap. Is getting a new cold air intake and full custom exhaust going help? Anything else I could try?

Whilst I have your attention, has anyone fitted bucket seats into a panda? I'd love to get something with more support and potentially lower than stock seats. Cheers

Anything is possible, depends how deep your pockets are. Of course insurance is another matter.

 

[miksfiatpanda]

Anything is possible, depends how deep your pockets are.

I'm looking for best bang for the buck. Maybe £1000 total. Was quoted just under 300 for a full custom exhaust, 200 odd for BMC CDA intake. Anything else worth looking at? I don't mind spending money if it brings in real performance gain.

 

[jimboy]

I'm looking for best bang for the buck. Maybe £1000 total. Was quoted just under 300 for a full custom exhaust, 200 odd for BMC CDA intake. Anything else worth looking at? I don't mind spending money if it brings in real performance gain.

I’m afraid an exhaust and an intake ain’t going to do much if any performance gains apart from a “sporty” sound. As I’ve said you’re going to have to spend if want power. This question comes up again and again on the forum. Mainly young guys, getting insurance would be very difficult even if you had work done. I’m afraid these are facts.

 

[miksfiatpanda]

Mainly young guys, getting insurance would be very difficult even if you had work done. I’m afraid these are facts.

I'm not that young anymore and have a fair few years of no claims. But yea, I thought I'd ask people that know more about it before I spend the cash. My exhaust is still stock and rusted through, it needs to be replaced soon anyway, might as well get a bit more sound out of it whilst I'm at it. Are there any mods that with real performance gain? Maybe suspension upgrades for better handling? I don't want to spend thousands on supercharger kits or anything like that.

 

[chris3234]

Hi, I'm wondering if there is an easy way to get more power and/or torque out of the 100hp without doing an engine swap. Is getting a new cold air intake and full custom exhaust going help? Anything else I could try?

Whilst I have your attention, has anyone fitted bucket seats into a panda? I'd love to get something with more support and potentially lower than stock seats. Cheers

Nope a cold air intake and exhaust Will more then likely reduce your engines power (especially if you you one of those tacky induction kits)
You may get a small increase in power if you remap it afterwards but likely small


A decat will increase power do to less restriction on the exhaust but this ofc is illegal and a mot failure

 

[jimboy]

I'm not that young anymore and have a fair few years of no claims. But yea, I thought I'd ask people that know more about it before I spend the cash. My exhaust is still stock and rusted through, it needs to be replaced soon anyway, might as well get a bit more sound out of it whilst I'm at it. Are there any mods that with real performance gain? Maybe suspension upgrades for better handling? I don't want to spend thousands on supercharger kits or anything like that.

I’m in my 60s, back in the day bigger carbs and straight through zosts were easy to do, no ECU and the feds never really bothered us. Today fifty years later and it’s a different ball game. The usual advise given on here is save up for something bigger\faster. I have a daily driver three pot, I also have my toy, a five pot Fiat Coupe 20vt they fill my needs.

 

[koalar]

more torque and a standard gearbox. Not so sure. Just been looking at 5 and 6 speed box's a good percentage have trashed input bearing at less than 100K although the will limp on for another 100K

the bearings can be updated

Most engine designs are good for 100HP per litre


Yet Fiat chose to tune it to less than 100HP which isnt much difference to a lot of standard 1.2 these days

 

[DaveMcT]

Look for David Vizard on You Tube. He is the famous Leyland/Rover A-Series engine tuner. The engine specific details wont apply but 80% of what he says is about porting manifolds - same on any engine.

A fancy cat-back exhaust wont do much, if anything, for power. A 4:2:1 manifold with underfloor catalyst will make a considerable difference because the OEM "Manicat" is not a good flowing device. It basically connects the engine to the exhaust pipe via a catalyst.

If you want full information on souping up the 100HP search "100HP turbo". ECUs and compatibility are a major issue. Swapping out the engine for a 500 or Brava/o turbo engine is likely to be the best option as long as you get the full set of electronics to go with it. That begs the question why you'd not just buy the 500 and be done with it.

Insurance? Talk to Adrian Flux for estimates of potential costs and demands by the underwriters.

You can get low cost headers on eBay for the 1.2 16 valve. The 1.4 is not listed but its likely the ports are the same. Do I have proof? No, you'd have to take measurements. But for the costs of returning a package (within UK) it's probably worth a punt. Use a standard catalyst from an exhaust manufacturer like MIJ (West Midlands).
https://www.ebay.co.uk/str/mijexhaust?_bkw=catalytic+converter

 

[DaveMcT]

Yet Fiat chose to tune it to less than 100HP which isnt much difference to a lot of standard 1.2 these days

The car and bike engines are not very far apart -

The air/oil cooled BMW R1200 twin cylinder bike made 100 bhp (83 bhp per litre).
The Fiat 1.8 16V variator engine makes 130 bhp (72 bhp per litre).
The Alfa 1.8 Twinspark made 144 bhp (80 bhp per litre)
So called "basic" Japanese bikes make around 100bhp per litre. They do it by revving a bit higher. A typical 125 makes 12.5 bhp. Yamaha's 900 Diversion made 90bhp at 8,500 revs.

Check it out the designs are nothing special. It's all about the details and efficient gas flows.

 

[jimboy]

My BMW 1200cc twin cylinder bike made 100bhp (83 bhp per litre).
The Fiat 1.8 16V Variator engine makes 130bhp (72 bhp per litre). They are not very far apart. So called "basic" Japanese bikes make around 100bhp per litre. They do it by revving a bit higher. A typical 125 makes 12.5 bhp. Yamaha's 900 Diversion made 90bhp at 8,500 revs. Check it out the designs are nothing special.

So a motorbike is the answer

 

[DaveMcT]

Many bikers have a powerful/stylish machine for fun and a Fiat Panda for transport.

My point is that car engines are not much less powerful per litre. They can be tuned mechanically to make similar power per litre. The issue is ECUs that can't be rechipped/remapped to suit the changes.

Going back to David Vizard - He was getting 100bhp from a 1275cc A-Series engine. Not bad for a design going back to the 1950s with a five port cylinder head and 1.5" SU carburettor. He modded the cylinder head, used free flowing manifolds and modded the carb for better gas flow. There was no fancy ECU, just electronic ignition and attention to detail.

 

[jimboy]

Many bikers have a powerful/stylish machine for fun and a Fiat Panda for transport.

My point is that car engines are not much less powerful per litre. They can be tuned mechanically to make similar power per litre. The issue is ECUs that can't be rechipped/remapped to suit the changes.

Going back to David Vizard - He was getting 120bhp from a 1275cc A-Series engine. Not bad for a design going back to the 1950s with a five port cylinder head and an SU carburettor.

ECU was already mentioned. No mention of a motorbike by the OP.

 

[DaveMcT]

ECU was already mentioned. No mention of a motorbike by the OP.

You seem to be missing my point. I'm using bikes to show that 100bhp per litre is not difficult. The 1.4 litre 100HP Panda should easily make 120bhp with some careful mechanical tuning.

 

[jimboy]

You seem to be missing my point. I'm using bikes to show that 100bhp per litre is not difficult. The 1.4 litre 100HP Panda should easily make 120bhp with some careful mechanical tuning.

I think you’ve missed the OP point, he didn’t want to spend too much money and was looking for best power for buck. A motorbike since you’ve mentioned it,can be tuned for far less money than a car. You should know that when trawling through the net, to get any kind of real power out of in this case a Panda 100, it can become very expensive.

 

[Scotty100hp]

I think the general consensus is that it is what it is. I’ve had mine for 6 years now and feel it’s the best it’s ever been and I’m happy with it. I have Koni Str shocks, Eibach springs, K&N panel filter (had the cooperman intake mod but it was just noisy) and a cat back stainless steel exhaust with a single centre silencer. I know these things are subjective, but for me all had a positive effect on how the car drives, however the biggest difference was made by changing the 10 year old coil packs! I live in London so yes it does feel slow sometimes, but whenever I take it for it’s yearly jaunt to Wales for some B road blasts it feels plenty fast enough, and never fails to make me smile.

There is a guy on here and Youtube called Pandamime who seems to have managed to fit a T-jet and solved the associated ecu problems, however for a budget of £1000 I think it would better spent on handling and braking improvements.

 

[DaveMcT]

Pandamime bough a crashed car (cant remember which model) to get the full set of electronics. I think he also explains how he reset (virginsied) his ECUs so they would work with the Panda parts.

As someone else says you won't get much done for £1000 but if you are doing the head porting yourself and get a used exhaust manifold you might get it done. My ported 1275 head cost me a set of valve guides and a lot of work with a die grinder. It went like stink even with a standard cam.

 

[nitramtpr]

The basic answer is that modern non-turbocharged cars are quite hard to get any decent horsepower gains out of (cheaply).

 

[Dan at Adrian Flux]

Hi.
If you do have any issues with insurance for modifications then please feel free to drop me a line.
Regards,
Dan.