E10 petrol....

[HughJarsse]

As above. Not too sure how widespread knowledge of this is, so sharing with you guys..

It appears that from this summer (2021) standard petrol will become 'E10' grade, not the existing 'E5' grade...
Apparently this will affect certain vehicles, especially older models that will not be able to use this new 'E10' grade..

Link to GOV.UK site. https://www.gov.uk/guidance/e10-petrol-explained

Appears that some of our beloved Fiats are among the casualties..

Link to GOV.UK site. https://check-vehicle-compatibility-e10-petrol.service.gov.uk/manufacturer/Fiat.

Fortunately my daughters Punto, ('53 plate 1.2 8V Active,) is not affected, and my '55 plate multipla is 1.9JTD...But appears the 1.6 petrol mult is...

Might cause problems for some of us, that's for sure...

 

[AndyRKett]

Fortunately my daughters Punto, ('53 plate 1.2 8V Active,) is not affected, and my '55 plate multipla is 1.9JTD...But appears the 1.6 petrol mult is...

I hate to point out the bloody obvious but no, the change E10 petrol definitely won't effect your diesel car. Is the Multipla Pre 2001 ?

I do wonder if the changes to E10 are something that can be easily rectified with an engine remap?

Mechanically I assume the engine doesn't require anything different, my presumption is the new fuel needs very slightly different timing or a car that can detect the difference between higher and lower octane fuels and alter its timing?

 

[chris3234]

I hate to point out the bloody obvious but no, the change E10 petrol definitely won't effect your diesel car. Is the Multipla Pre 2001 ?

I do wonder if the changes to E10 are something that can be easily rectified with an engine remap?

Mechanically I assume the engine doesn't require anything different, my presumption is the new fuel needs very slightly different timing or a car that can detect the difference between higher and lower octane fuels and alter its timing?

I sure I've read roblem with older cars is due to the higher ethanol content being damaging to some type of rubber
Rather then then to do with how the engines runson the fuel

 

[HughJarsse]

I hate to point out the bloody obvious but no, the change E10 petrol definitely won't effect your diesel car. Is the Multipla Pre 2001 ?

Obviously this wont affect the multipla, I just mentioned it because the petrol multipla's WILL be affected... (also, if you read the post again, my multi is '55 plate)

Re the effect E10 has, is to do with the rubber seals and gaskets used in older vehicles. adjusting timing or mixture will not make any difference. If your car cannot use E10, you will have to use the 'super' grades of petrol, (costing more!) or your car will suffer internal damage...

 

[AndyRKett]

The consequence of putting E10 fuel in an incompatible vehicle depends on the vehicle/engine variant and how much fuel has been put in.

It may cause some pre-detonation (‘pinking’), and perhaps a little rough running and poor cold starting, but it shouldn't be a disaster for the driver.

Also

There have also been reports that E10 is a less stable fuel and that this can make it more difficult to start a vehicle that has not been driven for an extended period.

Finally

if you put E10 fuel in an incompatible car it will still run, but seals, plastics and metals may be damaged over longer periods as a result of bioethanol's corrosive properties.

How many people are going to just carry on picking up the pump and putting whatever is cheap in the car without being overly worried.

Sorry I missed the age of the multipla in the original post, looking at the list of cars effected it seems to be those designed pre 2001, so while there maybe newer than 2001 cars effected I’m guessing they have old engine designs.

I’m wondering specifically from that list if it plastics and seals or if it would genuinely cause some of the running issues noted above.

 

[HughJarsse]

Think that the problem of 'older' engines being put in 'newer' models of the same car could be the difference. The multipla petrol version is marked as not compatible, yet the same 1.6 engine was used from beginning to end of production, whereas the diesel was modified a few times (not that that matters being diesel) also, note that the Punto's all seem OK, except for the 118 1.8 version, not the 1.2's, so assume that the 1.8 is an 'old' version engine, and the 1.2 was newer design?
Going to be a right mess, I can see, with people just not knowing, (or bothering) regarding the potential damage it can cause..

Was looking at a nice little petrol Multipla, low miles, well kept, etc, until I read about the E10. Think I'll give it a miss now!!

 

[AndyRKett]

That’s a shame, someone else will probably wreck that old multi by chucking any old fuel in and abusing it. They’re not really loved these days and older petrol cars even less so

 

[DaveMcT]

It's been a similar issue with biodiesel. Cars pre 1995 could be certain to suffer with biodiesel as methyl ester attacks rubber seals. Even silicone rubber cant cope with it. Anything built after 2000 is safe with biodiesel because it's been added to the pump fuels. That said, I'd not want to risk B100 in a state-of-the-art common rail engine.