Technical 2009 MultiJet engine out cam chain repair

[DaveMcT]

I've just looked at costs for bottom end bolts (big ends and bearing frame). There are none on eBay so probably Fiat only. However bearing shells are cheap. This image shows how the bottom end is constructed. It's strong and solid without adding weight to the engine.

As said above, if it really needs that much attention I'll probably call it a day.

 

[bugsymike]

If the bores are worn I will probably call it a day. Which makes the costs of the injector extraction tool a risk to say the least. Not to mention the E18 socket.

Removing pistons will demand a new set of stretch bolts for the main bearing cage and big ends. This engine does not have separate bearing caps. Even doing it in spare time with no rush, I can't see the costs being viable.

I live in hope that injector will move and the engine internals will be good. The oil was (VERY) black but a nice consistency and the sump was clean. All I found were cam chain pins. Shockingly small to be honest. Thanks to Fiat bean counters.

Check my comment in "old wives"

 

[bugsymike]

Check my comment in "old wives"

What is your engine code as some of the Panda1.3 Multijets in Auto Data don't say replace bolts.

 

[bugsymike]

What is your engine code as some versions don't need bolts changing according to Auto Data.

 

[DaveMcT]

Engine is 188A8000
Version 169AXC1A 03
No for spares 1713347
I can PM the car VIN if it helps

 

[bugsymike]

Engine is 188A8000
Version 169AXC1A 03
No for spares 1713347
I can PM the car VIN if it helps

Sorry if not very clear, hands bit shakey at times. Engine code should be enough

 

[bugsymike]

Sorry if not very clear, hands bit shakey at times. Engine code should be enough

You will need this also no. 85 in special notes.

 

[bugsymike]

You will need this also no. 85 in special notes.

Sorry I can't find the figure 102975 picture in Auto Data.

 

[DaveMcT]

That's very helpful. Thanks.

Looks like pulling the bottom end is worth doing while it's already so taken down.

 

[koalar]

If there’s no brass coloured glitter in the sump oil it will probably be fine

Fingers crossed the pistons are okay

 

[DaveMcT]

Fab news! I've got the No 4 injector out. Yay!

It was basically welded in by carbon caused by the copper sealing washer leaking and allowing fuel mist to escape. No 3 looks similar but had not got so bad. Same issue leaky bottom seal.

The extractor kit is VERY heavy duty but anything less was not going to touch it. It has four legs which bear onto the rocker cover bolt faces and two heavy strong backs. A little more thought from the manufacturer would have had the legs sit on the bolt heads. But it's worked so no worries. The pulling bar has a ball thrust bearing and (of course) plenty of oil on the threads and bearing. A large adjustable getting close to full strength shifted the injector which popped and pinged all the way out. The injector is toast, the internals would not come apart so had to be broken out. It's no loss to be honest and used injectors are not silly money.

Pardon our interruption...

The kit has a tool for taking out the injector internals, two long threaded extractors and two short ones so you can pull two at the same time. An adaptor screws onto the injector top. Fiat fit them in pairs so you could easily find they both need pulling at the same time.

 

[DaveMcT]

Injector with pulling bar fitted.

 

[DaveMcT]

Injectors 3 and 4. The latter is polished on the bottom end where carbon clogged it solid. One and two (not pictured) are clean and nice.

 

[DaveMcT]

3-4 injector clamp sooted up with part burnt diesel soot.

 

[bugsymike]

Fab news! I've got the No 4 injector out. Yay!

It was basically welded in by carbon caused by the copper sealing washer leaking and allowing fuel mist to escape. No 3 looks similar but had not got so bad. Same issue leaky bottom seal.

The extractor kit is VERY heavy duty but anything less was not going to touch it. It has four legs which bear onto the rocker cover bolt faces and two heavy strong backs. A little more thought from the manufacturer would have had the legs sit on the bolt heads. But it's worked so no worries. The pulling bar has a ball thrust bearing and (of course) plenty of oil on the threads and bearing. A large adjustable getting close to full strength shifted the injector which popped and pinged all the way out. The injector is toast, the internals would not come apart so had to be broken out. It's no loss to be honest and used injectors are not silly money.

Pardon our interruption...

The kit has a tool for taking out the injector internals, two long threaded extractors and two short ones so you can pull two at the same time. An adaptor screws onto the injector top. Fiat fit them in pairs so you could easily find they both need pulling at the same time.

Just curious was it like my extractor in that you had to undo the top nut on the injector to fit the extractor, or would it pull it out all intact?

 

[DaveMcT]

The four injector holes into the cylinder head get progressively more filthy. I have pictures but all you can see is black kak.

 

[DaveMcT]

Just curious was it like my extractor in that you had to undo the top nut on the injector to fit the extractor, or would it pull it out all intact?

I had to remove the solenoid and the top end internals. These are supposed to lift out but the three winged “washer” would not move. I had already decided the injector is scrap so broke that out and could then fit the puller shaft.
The shaft screws into injector, puller nut goes over that to give additional support. The silver part is the puller reaction block. The kit has two but only one contains a thrust bearing.

The injector was so incredibly tight that anything less direct could never have removed it. The slide hammers you see on You Tube (that use a forked claw) would be unlikely to get the job done.

 

[bugsymike]

The four injector holes get progressively more filthy. I have pictures but all you can see is black kak.

Looking at the photo it did mean disturbing the ceramic ball valve etc under the top nut.
I bought a seat reamer tool to clean up where the copper washer seats, but still found it an ongoing issue due to one tiny clamp holding two injector down.
Still you can access the head now

 

[DaveMcT]

I had to remove the solenoid and extract everything below. There is another disc beneath the winged "washer" but I could not get that out. Taking these small parts out would be a risky in the car. I think you'd need a strong vinyl/cotton table cloth with hole though so any dropped parts could be captured.

The moral here is that anyone with a common rail diesel should regularly check for leaks around the injectors. If allowed to persist the fuel carbonises and this problem just gets ever worse. Not to mention damage to the seat at bottom of the injector hole. Mine are yet to be cleaned for examination.

I might be around to borrow your seat reamer.

 

[bugsymike]

I had to remove the solenoid and extract everything below. There is another disc beneath the winged "washer" but I could not get that out. Taking these small parts out would be a risky in the car. I think you'd need a strong vinyl/cotton table cloth with hole though so any dropped parts could be captured.

The moral here is that anyone with a common rail diesel should regularly check for leaks around the injectors. If allowed to persist the fuel carbonises and this problem just gets ever worse. Not to mention damage to the seat at bottom of the injector hole. Mine are yet to be cleaned for examination.

I might be around to borrow your seat reamer.

Could have borrowed the extractor as well if you were next door to sunny Torbay