Technical Thanks and Timing belt question

[Swifty12]

Just wanted to give my thanks for all the information on here regards the retro fitting of cruise control. I did it with a fiat stilo stalk and the information on here was invaluable.

I'm thinking of changing the timing belt on my x244 2.3td. I'm a bit concerned after reading the dayco instructions regards the self tensioner. It seems a bit of a faff. I've looked at a gates kit and no instructions at all regards this. Should I stick with Fiat only kit? Also the talk of securing and loosening the nut for the cam sprocket is confusing. Plus whether to change the water pump at the same time. I'd have thought it makes sense to do this at same time.

 

[bugsymike]

Just wanted to give my thanks for all the information on here regards the retro fitting of cruise control. I did it with a fiat stilo stalk and the information on here was invaluable.

I'm thinking of changing the timing belt on my x244 2.3td. I'm a bit concerned after reading the dayco instructions regards the self tensioner. It seems a bit of a faff. I've looked at a gates kit and no instructions at all regards this. Should I stick with Fiat only kit? Also the talk of securing and loosening the nut for the cam sprocket is confusing. Plus whether to change the water pump at the same time. I'd have thought it makes sense to do this at same time.

If vehicle is older than 2012 and you have engine series number, I could post a pic of the 2012 Auto data cambelt timing book details tomorrow if that helps.

 

[Swifty12]

Many thanks. It's an old shape 2006 model so I suspect not of much use?

 

[Swifty12]

Sorry miss read your post. Yes that might be helpful thank you. Think engine number might be FIAE048ID. Possibly

 

[bugsymike]

Sorry miss read your post. Yes that might be helpful thank you. Think engine number might be FIAE048ID. Possibly

See pics re cam belt job.

 

[Swifty12]

See pics re cam belt job.

Thank you

 

[Swifty12]

I'm a bit confused as to part numbers 1.870.815.000 and 1870.836.000 and 452/1 and 1.845.028.000. They seem very expensive and seem to do with cam sprocket removal. Are they that critical? Can't even find some of them online.

 

[bugsymike]

I'm a bit confused as to part numbers 1.870.815.000 and 1870.836.000 and 452/1 and 1.845.028.000. They seem very expensive and seem to do with cam sprocket removal. Are they that critical? Can't even find some of them online.

To be honest I have not fitted a cam belt to that model, others here will be able to advise better, but often with a little careful commonsense you can manage with the basics.
Just remember to make sure everything is tightened correctly at the end and turn engine in correct direction by hand at least two full revolutions, then recheck timing etc. That way even if you get it wrong you will know you are not going to cause any physical damage when you turn the key.
Also make sure any plastic covers etc are correctly fitted and not fouling any thing like auxiliary belts or pulleys.

 

[Swifty12]

Many thanks. I'm just a bit concerned about removing the cam sprocket. I've found a universal holder and pulley that look like they will work but not certain. The reference to universal puller washer fiat no 1.845.028.000 is something I'm not sure on at all.

 

[bugsymike]

Many thanks. I'm just a bit concerned about removing the cam sprocket. I've found a universal holder and pulley that look like they will work but not certain. The reference to universal puller washer fiat no 1.845.028.000 is something I'm not sure on at all.

As I mentioned , not one I have done, but generally the cam pulley only has to break away from it's taper so that when belt fitted and timing pins in correct position, when cam shaft bolt tightened to correct torque timing should be more precise without straining belt to meet marks etc.
I also note reading the instructions it mentions turning over engine by hand 8 full turns of the crankshaft so even more that I thought as a safety margin.
Maybe see if any one else on Forum can give more detailed advice.

 

[Communicator]

@Swifty12 ,

Hi, have you looked at Fiat eLearn for your cambelt change? If not, eLearn for the x244 is available in the forum "Downloads" section at the top of the page. You need a Windows computer to run it on. Also available as CD from Ebay. As a taster I am attaching a pdf version of the timing belt section. There is also separate mention of belt tensioners.

 

[Swifty12]

I haven't no. Thank you for your help, I'll take a look.

 

[jackwhoo]

As I mentioned , not one I have done, but generally the cam pulley only has to break away from it's taper so that when belt fitted and timing pins in correct position, when cam shaft bolt tightened to correct torque timing should be more precise without straining belt to meet marks etc.
I also note reading the instructions it mentions turning over engine by hand 8 full turns of the crankshaft so even more that I thought as a safety margin.
Maybe see if any one else on Forum can give more detailed advice.

Hi all,

The 8 full crank turns by hand after setting tensioner in FIRST position is to ensure belt settles in its running position before setting the tensioner in its SECOND final position. It is VITAL to do this or the belt tension will be incorrect.

Thanks to @Communicator for download from elearn. Good brand cam belts are made to very high tolerances .

I very much doubt fiat workshops loosen the cam pulley .....in this case I would not loosen the cam pulley but would follow all the other steps.

Best wishes
Jack

 

[Swifty12]

Thank you. Don't understand the reasoning of loosening the cam sprocket. Is it worth marking the old belt and sprockets with a white paint pen

 

[jackwhoo]

Oh and yes change water pump.
Do not turn water pump by hand when dry it can damage the seal - prime the seal with antifreeze first.

 

[jackwhoo]

Thank you. Don't understand the reasoning of loosening the cam sprocket. Is it worth marking the old belt and sprockets with a white paint pen

Yes but only when crank and cam in correct position -belt and braces

The idea behind loosening cam sprocket is to get the timing "super" accurate accounting for any variation in belt manufacture.....

 

[Swifty12]

Correct position being locked in TDC?

 

[jackwhoo]

Y

Correct position being locked in TDC?

Yes but also with cams locked , crank tdc can be cams 180 degrees out

 

[jackwhoo]

Because cams turn 180 degrees for each full turn of crank.
If crank at tdc but cams in wrong position turn crank one full turn back to tdc and cams will be in correct position.

 

[Swifty12]

Sorry don't understand