Technical Subframe Rot

[DaveMcT]

There are probably quite a few classics that shouldn’t be.

My Spider is a classic example of multiple bodged MOT repairs that are all having to be removed and replaced with proper repairs, using replacement panels where available.

I fully agree that old cars have problems and very often old fixes have to be chopped out and done properly. I'm just saying that banning correctly made repairs is a bad idea as it would stall our right to repair our own property.

The central part of the 169 4x4 subframe could be repaired and even duplicated easily enough. It would probably need a jig making and the skills to accurately cut and weld metal but it's far from impossible and would not by definition result in a dangerous bodge. Self -evidently, the result has to be roadworthy.

 

[vexorg]

I'm just saying that banning correctly made repairs is a bad idea as it would stall our right to repair our own property.

No one's saying ban correctly made repairs. The definition of "correctly made" is under debate. Even if you take a copy panda 4x4 subframe, it should go to some other qualified engineer that can approve it. This prevent cowboys, or the sunday afternoon guys that find some bit in the garage to cut and chop and join with an aldi welder.

 

[koalar]

No one's saying ban correctly made repairs. The definition of "correctly made" is under debate. Even if you take a copy panda 4x4 subframe, it should go to some other qualified engineer that can approve it. This prevent cowboys, or the Sunday afternoon guys that find some bit in the garage to cut and chop and join with an Aldi welder.

agreed

the car isn't valuable enough to make a proper repair to the frame a viable option

I haven't worked in the industry for over 30 years but fully expect over thousand pounds for the First one.

the only cost effective option at the moment would be to import a solid one.

 

[DaveMcT]

No one's saying ban correctly made repairs. The definition of "correctly made" is under debate. Even if you take a copy panda 4x4 subframe, it should go to some other qualified engineer that can approve it. This prevent cowboys, or the sunday afternoon guys that find some bit in the garage to cut and chop and join with an aldi welder.

I've seen some new subframes that look like an Aldi Welder with Lidl rods made the thing. The worst of all is a patch repair over rusted metal as often gets done on sills and floor pans with seat belt and seat mounts nearby. When I was looking for a Panda, I found a few with horrid quality welds on the rear spring pans. Admittedly a failure there (probably) won't crash the car but the repairs looked worse than the original problem.

 

[Mire Mare]

OP here - the 4x4 Panda is still with me.

I just read through the thread - some interesting debate. I'm still undecided on what to do. As someone already mentioned, it depends how much we are attached to our cars and I'm quite fond of this little car. However, I feel I must be economically sensible as well as safe! I won't be patching it. I could possibly replace the subframe - I found one but have not checked how good it is yet. Plus, local garage will charge approx £600 labour. There are other jobs I need to do, or that I'll have to pay someone to do. So actually it may just be too expensive to repair. I may park it up and look for another, better, 4x4 - as someone else suggested.

Or, take this as an opportunity to get another bucket list car. I've still to own and run a 100hp.

 

[eethon]

I think I have managed to locate sub frames on the Italian bay if anyones interested? My wife's panda needed rear wheel bearings, which turned into bearings and hubs, which turned into bearings hubs and swing arms which led me here and probably means bearings, hubs, swing arms and a sub frame! going to check that now! I struggled finding the parts anywhere, stumbled across this depressing thread and started looking on eBay.it

 

[eethon]

think this is it