Technical Replacing electric power steering column?

[DaveMcT]

And they charge nearly £400 for the privilege.

The ECU Testing website says a Panda power steering motor is £195
https://www.ecutesting.com/product-catalogue/fiat/panda/power-steering-eps-electric-power-steering/

The cost issue is not as simple as "investing" (or not) in an old car. The car is old and worth very little. But cars are NOT investments they all COST money. All cars need maintenance. Stuff wears out.

If everything falling apart then of course, scrap the thing. If you need an excuse to scrap it, then fill your boots. However, what about these questions - Do you like the car? Is the car otherwise running well? Can you afford at least the same cost per month to replace it?

A reasonable mileage, basic car with good service history will be about £5000. Anything much cheaper is likely to have its own problems so nothing is gained. Even if you don't need to borrow the money, £5000 is equivalent to £200 per month as you have to put it back into the bank.

Edit - A 2017 Panda is about £3000 so you'd have two months to wait for the payback.

My car is still in the category of "I like it and its reliable". I don't want the cost of replacement so £200 for parts to keep it on the road makes sense. Eventually that wont apply but for the time-being....

 

[koalar]

The ECU Testing website says a Panda power steering motor is £195
https://www.ecutesting.com/product-catalogue/fiat/panda/power-steering-eps-electric-power-steering/

The cost issue is not as simple as "investing" (or not) in an old car. The car is old and worth very little. But cars are NOT investments they all COST money. All cars need maintenance. Stuff wears out.

If everything falling apart then of course, scrap the thing. If you need an excuse to scrap it, then fill your boots. However, what about these questions - Do you like the car? Is the car otherwise running well? Can you afford at least the same cost per month to replace it?

A reasonable mileage, basic car with good service history will be about £5000. Anything much cheaper is likely to have its own problems so nothing is gained. Even if you don't need to borrow the money, £5000 is equivalent to £200 per month as you have to put it back into the bank.

Edit - A 2017 Panda is about £3000 so you'd have two months to wait for the payback.

My car is still in the category of "I like it and its reliable". I don't want the cost of replacement so £200 for parts to keep it on the road makes sense. Eventually that wont apply but for the time-being....

I read it as £195 + £16pp + VAT = £253.20 + your cost to post original £269.20

and then it might not be rebuildable which probably incurs the £45 diagnosis plus PP to get it back.



or £275 + £16pp + VAT = £349.2 + your cost to post original £365.20

 

[koalar]

interesting did a search of the part number same for all models 2010-2011 on the catalogue I was using

There is an outside chance the program is different but I doubt it. The body computer has different part number if just the front fogs are enabled.

also on a different steering refurbishment site says all engine sizes

FIAT PANDA ELECTRIC POWER STEERING (EPS) COLUMN / MOTOR / ECU

Part Numbers:
VM No: 51746820 / 26096580 / 26096580 16C / BLM022 / 26093607 / 26099946 / 2610184805A / 26101917 / 26096711

OEM No:26096580 / 26096711

Vehicle Details:
Make: FIAT
Model: PANDA
Engine Size: ALL
Year: 2003 - 2011

 

[dac69er]

The saga continues......

The seller of the used column initially said it will fit. Then changed his mind when it came to actually buying it and said the parts numbers don't match!!!

Back to square 1 again

 

[koalar]

The saga continues......

The seller of the used column initially said it will fit. Then changed his mind when it came to actually buying it and said the parts numbers don't match!!!

Back to square 1 again

have you unbolted the two cables on top of the battery negative clamp and cleaned them up. One is the cable for the steering motor.

one of the refurbishment companies sells the same unit for

1.2 dynamic and the 100HP

 

[dac69er]

Yeah, done all of that.
The error code is c1002 which is for the torque sensor.

It's just so intermittent. I would probably agree that most if not all the units are the same for the panda, but it is hard to be sure.

 

[koalar]

Yeah, done all of that.
The error code is c1002 which is for the torque sensor.

It's just so intermittent. I would probably agree that most if not all the units are the same for the panda, but it is hard to be sure.

unfortunately C1002 isnt conclusive

https://www.fiatforum.com/panda/477923-red-steering-wheel-light-16.html?p=4570488


if you want to eliminate the torque sensor there not that expensive or difficult to swap

 

[jrkitching]

if you want to eliminate the torque sensor there not that expensive or difficult to swap

Do you happen to know of a UK source for these? All the ones I can find on the 'net are from continental Europe and cost at least double what they did before Brexit, and that's before any import taxes, fees and levies that might now be applied.

Would go some way toward explaining why the likes of WPS have significantly increased their prices.

 

[dac69er]

im in the same boat, hence why i was looking for a used complete column.

by the time i have bought the sensor, gone through the hassle of instaling it, its not a million miles off buying a recon unit with the cost of them at the moment.

 

[A3jeroen]

Check the colour of the loom from the sensor. My 100HP has a green one, but there's also blue and yellow ones.
If the column the seller refuses to sell you has a green loom as welll I'm pretty sure it will work fine.
While in there to check the colour, you could clean and reseat the connectors. If you are lucky, it cures the problem.

gr J

 

[koalar]

i would buy from China put a bit of effort I reckon you'll get down to below £30

I have seen 50 pieces for less than $10 each


I have just had 4 electronic parts arrive. All ordered on the same day. 2 arrived in two weeks. All work Fine.


Also had a MAF arrive from China okay for an A Class. Its built into the ECU. You can't buy them in the UK and aren't suppose to be repairable. Easy choice £15 or new ECU

a quick search for a cheap UK source

I didn't check too carefully

and know nothing about them

https://www.autodoc.co.uk/car-parts/oem/2610176108a

 

[koalar]

the £150 ones on UK ebay are using the same photos as this site

https://store.minitools.com/en/cata...atibile_marca=184&compatibile_modello[]=29252

I doubt Mini Tools will not be the source

 

[dac69er]

Well it's been perfectly fine up until a week ago with some intermittent faults.

Now it has completely failed. Will double check connections are ok. Battery has been put on charge for a few days too, just to make sure it is topped up.

I think it is getting to the end of me being able to limp it through

 

[DaveMcT]

Plug a cheap voltmeter into the ciggy lighter or better wire one into an ignition controlled circuit and place it somewhere easily seen. That will tell you if the alternator is coping with the power demand (13.8V with only a short drop on engine start = good).

I did this when our 1.2 was demonstrating steering problems and found the alternator was intermittently not providing enough power. Wires and earth points all checked out so a new alternator was fitted (£100) and the problem was solved. The old alternator casing was cracked and a few days after removal was seized solid.

If the charging system checks-out ok, you are probably looking at replacing the power steering unit.
Here's some options - https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_...l1313&_nkw=fiat+panda+power+steering&_sacat=0

 

[koalar]

Well it's been perfectly fine up until a week ago with some intermittent faults.

Now it has completely failed. Will double check connections are ok. Battery has been put on charge for a few days too, just to make sure it is topped up.

I think it is getting to the end of me being able to limp it through

have you unbolted the cables on top of the battery negative and cleaned them ? picture below

have you tried a different battery ?


check the large 60A fuse for corrosion

 

[koalar]

Great. Sounds good to me.

I'm just thinking of getting a used one off a lower mileage car as it's a lot cheaper. The current one works 95% of the time but fails unexpectedly now and again.
Recalibration did nothing. It's as soon as it gets cold that it plays up.

got to be a clue here

 

[koalar]

Plug a cheap voltmeter into the pciggy lighter or better wire one into an ignition controlled circuit and place it somewhere easily seen. That will tell you if the alternator is coping with the power demand (13.8V is with only a short drop on engine start = good).

I did this when our 1.2 was demonstrating steering problems and found the alternator was intermittently not providing enough power. Wires and earth points all checked out so a new alternator was fitted (£100) and the problem was solved. The old alternator casing was cracked and a few days after removal was seized solid.

If the charging system checks-out ok, you are probably looking at replacing the power steering unit.
Here's some options - https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_...l1313&_nkw=fiat+panda+power+steering&_sacat=0

As I have said many times. This may have work once for you with a faulty alternator. Just like a misfire is fixed by changing spark plugs do not mean every misfire will be fixed by changing the pugs

I have repaired dozens of electric steering

Vauxhall, Mercedes and Fiat not a single one has been a faulty alternator,

To say if it checked out here it probably needs a steering column is poor advice in my opinion

there's is no charge drop at the cigarette lighter on cars with a faulty battery, Again I have tested and written this many times. There's at least 30 car on here that would have needlessly had a column changed fallowing this advise

I have also written many times the only quick reliable test for the battery is substitution. Easy for me as I two car and just swap the batteries over. There's at least 2 threads on here where they had the battery tested at a garage okay and wasted several more day, weeks, months chasing their tail assuming the fault was elsewhere

 

[DaveMcT]

Electrical problems are (almost) always multi-faceted - nobody wants chapter & verse every time.

I substituted the battery. Problem went away for a while but returned as the battery charge was not keeping up. Symptom vs cause of symptom.

System voltage is the same across the whole car so any consistent voltmeter will show changes in SYSTEM VOLTS. Current (Amps) vary circuit to circuit, so are not a useful indicator.

Low volts are caused by a weak battery or a partially charged battery or a power demand the alternator cannot keep up with. That might be a weak alternator or endless short journeys where battery can't recover. It might be excessive load elsewhere in the system but that's unusual.

Monitoring system volts allows you to deduce what is going on.

 

[Mike1alike]

I went through this very problem with my Punto. I fixed it by replacing the column torque sensor. An easy job and it works perfect since.
To know which sensoe you need, do this:

Check the colour of the loom from the sensor.

 

[irc]

I went through this very problem with my Punto. I fixed it by replacing the column torque sensor. An easy job and it works perfect since.
To know which sensoe you need, do this:

Mostly, problems I have fixed with EPS have been low or bad battery, earth points, bad connections.
These have all been EPS light coming on, and/or loss of power assistance.
The only ones I have come across which have required new torque sensor (or a column swap) have had an additional symptom - either more power assistance turning one way than the other, or a juddering action when steering.
On the other hand, I have fixed quite a few which have already had a replacement column (or torque sensor) - usually by replacing the battery, (often after a passed "battery test" by someone else).
Not definitive proof, but usually pushes me towards looking at everything else properly first.