Police - New Driver Scheme - Opinions Needed

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Police - New Driver Scheme - Opinions Needed

Q1 dont really know a lot about them

Q2 1 pull right out in front of me down my road the other day, its a 60 limit but luckly i was only doing 35 as there was no one about and i was in no hurry :(

Q3 driving instructors have that and quite a few of them i see driving very bad

Q4 i old :(

Q5 they not all yobs but still need more skills. a lot on here claim not to be boy racers then a few months later they post that they have crashed

Q6 where is local? what will the £100 be used for?
 
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It's Roadcraft driving, rather than Racecraft. Do the same pursuit down a crowded High Street and see the difference ;) Out of interest, what is your opinion of police drivers based on?

Chris

like I said, if you're driving down a crowded high street at high speed and someone walked out from behind a van you'd hit them and probably kill them...police trained or not.

My experience of police drivers is based mainly on spending 8 years as a London despatch rider and seeing the countless number of mistakes they make and the bad attitude from traffic cops when they pull you up for no other reason than "we hate despatch riders".

I was once following another dizzy down the outside of a jam when a traffic car coming the other way swerved across the road (the road was the width of about 4 buses btw) and aimed for him head on.
Of course we both slammed on the brakes and the cop parked his car in the middle of the road and started giving this guy a lecture about how he was driving on the wrong side of the road.
I pulled up along side, told the cop he was a 'kin :tosser: and rode on.
"professional, highly trained drivers". Pull the other one it's got bells on.
That was just one of many incidents.
 
The idea has merit if the members genuinely wish to gain something out of it and make them safer drivers as well as faster.

1) IT could be argued that encouraging youngsters to behave by rewarding them is a good move if it keeps them out of Court and your car or house, but must be intensely frustrating to those who behave well yet would give their right arm to be involved in some of those activities.
2) I am employed by a certain Police force, but have also held a Driving Instructor's "Badge" for 21 years. There seems to be quite a wide gulf between Traffic Officers and "normal" Officers who have received "Response" training. Those who serve in the Traffic role, especially those in Tactical Vehicle Crime Units and are Escort specialists are among the most highly trained, safe, fast and capable drivers in the country, if not the world. This is reflected in the fact that those with "Response" training are limited by the Force to 20 mph over the prevailing speed limit. By "Response", I mean Astras,
Transits and the like.
3) I first joined the I.A.M. in 1978, but was very frustrated by some of the techniques which would have been apropriate for driving a Morris 8 or Vauxhall
Velox in the days of cross ply tyres, non-servo drum brakes and wipers that went slower, the slower you drove, but I didn't feel they were right for the heady technical heights of my Chevette with radials and servo disc brakes, not to mention synchromesh on all forward gears. So although the group have modernised many of their techniques, I can understand how, even today
young drivers may feel the I.A.M. is not for them. After packing it in, I enrolled on a scheme run by G.M.P. called the Citizen's Driving Scheme. This was run in the evening by Police Driving Instructors and I found it far more interesting than the I.A.M. and involved high speed driving on all kinds of roads and ended on the last night with a slalom course which was a right laugh. It was led by a Sergeant Instructor called Peter Livesey who had a highly tuned Mini Cooper S, and by the Cringe was he fast. My own Instructor
was P.C. Roger Taylor who took over as School Sergeant when Livesey moved
on or retired. On retirement, Roger went on to be an I.A.M. Examiner and I met him 10 years ago when I finally took my I.A.M. test. You can always learn
something even if it is only one piece at a time, as long as you think about it and not just accept everything you have been told. This is important for everything you learn about driving, as if you don't understand or agree, you should challenge it. Any instructor worth his badge whould be able to convince you why he or she is right.
4) Having survived half a century, alright 33 years of driving, I've done that by always assessing my driving and everytime I frightened myself, thought "That was a bit unpleasant" and tried not to do it again by thinking about what I'd done and thinking about how I could avoid it next time. I also went to the library and learnt about inertia, momentum and the laws of motion. I also read books by the likes of Stirling Moss and Jackie Stewart. Paul
Ripley writes some excellent books on high performance driving. In fact he runs driving courses where all his Instructors have track experience. My own cars in my younger days included a Chevette HS 2300, complete with obligatory four Cibie spots on the front and Castrol and DTV stickers on the sides.
5) "Keen" drivers are sadly let down by, although not exclusively, boy racers. There are plenty of poor drivers from the excessively fast to the criminally irresponsible, from the terminally slow to the totally bewildered. Successive government's cowardice in not making it law to undergo some form of post test training, or even periodic re-testing (to a realistic standard) has left us with a nation of drivers for whom using a car is regarded as no more important than operating a washing machine. Every day you can see drivers who don't know how to join a Motorway, which lane to drive in, how fast to drive or how to leave it. But then, how often have you heard members of the media refer to the slow, middle and fast lanes. The speed limit in each is 70. As for country driving, instead of insisting on training the Highways Agency, or is it the Department for Transport, or Department of transport, or the Driving Standards Agency simply reduce the speed limit which reduces the skill level even further. People have become so wrapped up in their own self importance that they generally have no conception of speed limits in any given situation which leads to traffic wishing to drive at the speed limit being baulked by slower vehicles and others driving far too fast in built up areas. Signalling at roundabouts seems to have become a lost art and many drivers either negotiate bends too slowly or too fast. I recently took a motorway bend at a safe 70 in my Panda MJ only to find the car that had just overtaken me had braked so hard that I was now overtaking it on the left. A BMW M3 ferchrist's sake.
6) You have to guard against people joining with their own agendas, in as much as they sometimes take only what they thought was right about their own viewpoint in the first place and ignoring everything else that goes with it.
The I.A.M. once had to drop its policy of teaching members to straight-line bends after one man defended colliding with a car on the wrong sided of the road by saying the I.A.M. had told him to do it. I was for a time involved with the National Driver Improvement Scheme and it only worked if people genuinely got involved and improved. But they had to acknowledge there was something wrong with their driving in the first place. Some wouldn't drive at 70 on the Motorway because they were frightened of the speed, but would not otherwise seek help.

In principle this would be a great idea, but, and it's a big but, Pass + already provides a discount of 10% on insurance premiums, and most people take the course for that reason, so you have to be good at training them to make them realise what you are telling them is important and has merit. I would love to see a situation where everybody was better trained and more considerate. You don't have to drive fast, indeed people should drive at a speed that is commensurate with their driving abilities, but the important thing
perhaps, is that they should be aware of other traffic and drive in such a manner as to let them make progress as safely as possible which would reduce the frustration which causes so many casualties.

And you thought your post was long. Still, my motto has always been: "Why use 10 words when 10,000 will do.
 
*CHEERS* :worship:

The idea has merit if the members genuinely wish to gain something out of it and make them safer drivers as well as faster.

1) IT could be argued that encouraging youngsters to behave by rewarding them is a good move if it keeps them out of Court and your car or house, but must be intensely frustrating to those who behave well yet would give their right arm to be involved in some of those activities.
2) I am employed by a certain Police force, but have also held a Driving Instructor's "Badge" for 21 years. There seems to be quite a wide gulf between Traffic Officers and "normal" Officers who have received "Response" training. Those who serve in the Traffic role, especially those in Tactical Vehicle Crime Units and are Escort specialists are among the most highly trained, safe, fast and capable drivers in the country, if not the world. This is reflected in the fact that those with "Response" training are limited by the Force to 20 mph over the prevailing speed limit. By "Response", I mean Astras,
Transits and the like.
3) I first joined the I.A.M. in 1978, but was very frustrated by some of the techniques which would have been apropriate for driving a Morris 8 or Vauxhall
Velox in the days of cross ply tyres, non-servo drum brakes and wipers that went slower, the slower you drove, but I didn't feel they were right for the heady technical heights of my Chevette with radials and servo disc brakes, not to mention synchromesh on all forward gears. So although the group have modernised many of their techniques, I can understand how, even today
young drivers may feel the I.A.M. is not for them. After packing it in, I enrolled on a scheme run by G.M.P. called the Citizen's Driving Scheme. This was run in the evening by Police Driving Instructors and I found it far more interesting than the I.A.M. and involved high speed driving on all kinds of roads and ended on the last night with a slalom course which was a right laugh. It was led by a Sergeant Instructor called Peter Livesey who had a highly tuned Mini Cooper S, and by the Cringe was he fast. My own Instructor
was P.C. Roger Taylor who took over as School Sergeant when Livesey moved
on or retired. On retirement, Roger went on to be an I.A.M. Examiner and I met him 10 years ago when I finally took my I.A.M. test. You can always learn
something even if it is only one piece at a time, as long as you think about it and not just accept everything you have been told. This is important for everything you learn about driving, as if you don't understand or agree, you should challenge it. Any instructor worth his badge whould be able to convince you why he or she is right.
4) Having survived half a century, alright 33 years of driving, I've done that by always assessing my driving and everytime I frightened myself, thought "That was a bit unpleasant" and tried not to do it again by thinking about what I'd done and thinking about how I could avoid it next time. I also went to the library and learnt about inertia, momentum and the laws of motion. I also read books by the likes of Stirling Moss and Jackie Stewart. Paul
Ripley writes some excellent books on high performance driving. In fact he runs driving courses where all his Instructors have track experience. My own cars in my younger days included a Chevette HS 2300, complete with obligatory four Cibie spots on the front and Castrol and DTV stickers on the sides.
5) "Keen" drivers are sadly let down by, although not exclusively, boy racers. There are plenty of poor drivers from the excessively fast to the criminally irresponsible, from the terminally slow to the totally bewildered. Successive government's cowardice in not making it law to undergo some form of post test training, or even periodic re-testing (to a realistic standard) has left us with a nation of drivers for whom using a car is regarded as no more important than operating a washing machine. Every day you can see drivers who don't know how to join a Motorway, which lane to drive in, how fast to drive or how to leave it. But then, how often have you heard members of the media refer to the slow, middle and fast lanes. The speed limit in each is 70. As for country driving, instead of insisting on training the Highways Agency, or is it the Department for Transport, or Department of transport, or the Driving Standards Agency simply reduce the speed limit which reduces the skill level even further. People have become so wrapped up in their own self importance that they generally have no conception of speed limits in any given situation which leads to traffic wishing to drive at the speed limit being baulked by slower vehicles and others driving far too fast in built up areas. Signalling at roundabouts seems to have become a lost art and many drivers either negotiate bends too slowly or too fast. I recently took a motorway bend at a safe 70 in my Panda MJ only to find the car that had just overtaken me had braked so hard that I was now overtaking it on the left. A BMW M3 ferchrist's sake.
6) You have to guard against people joining with their own agendas, in as much as they sometimes take only what they thought was right about their own viewpoint in the first place and ignoring everything else that goes with it.
The I.A.M. once had to drop its policy of teaching members to straight-line bends after one man defended colliding with a car on the wrong sided of the road by saying the I.A.M. had told him to do it. I was for a time involved with the National Driver Improvement Scheme and it only worked if people genuinely got involved and improved. But they had to acknowledge there was something wrong with their driving in the first place. Some wouldn't drive at 70 on the Motorway because they were frightened of the speed, but would not otherwise seek help.

In principle this would be a great idea, but, and it's a big but, Pass + already provides a discount of 10% on insurance premiums, and most people take the course for that reason, so you have to be good at training them to make them realise what you are telling them is important and has merit. I would love to see a situation where everybody was better trained and more considerate. You don't have to drive fast, indeed people should drive at a speed that is commensurate with their driving abilities, but the important thing
perhaps, is that they should be aware of other traffic and drive in such a manner as to let them make progress as safely as possible which would reduce the frustration which causes so many casualties.

And you thought your post was long. Still, my motto has always been: "Why use 10 words when 10,000 will do.
 
I got a years NCD out of it but depends on your insurance company. knocked about 300 quid off my 1st years insurance and meant I was always a year ahead on NCD then other people my age, tho up to max NCD now.
 
i payed for my son to do pass plus what a waste or time and money he had half an hour on the motorway and all the rest was the same as what he done with his instructor, and none of the insurance company's has given him any discount for it. very disappointing.
In that case you should have complained to the Driving Standards Agency as the Instructor wasn't keeping to the syllabus. When I used to train for Pass+ there would be at least 2 hours on Motorways, 2 hours on Dual Carriageway and 2 hours on higher speed single carriageway roads. Where possible training would also be carried out in poor weather and darkness. I usually took
pupils for 4 2 hour sessions. The minimum for the course is 6 hours.

I got a years NCD out of it but depends on your insurance company. knocked about 300 quid off my 1st years insurance and meant I was always a year ahead on NCD then other people my age, tho up to max NCD now.
Hopefully if you had a decent Instructor, you would have got more out of it than just a discount.
 
im a young driver

i can shed some light on this one

you tend to find alot of young male drivers like to not go as i would call stupidly fast but be able to take corners at speeds i wouldnt dream of doing, ie corsa sports punto sportings etc etc tend to be the choice because they are quite nippy

i feel as thought a lot of young male drivers let the side down by showing off, then get ahead of them selves and take it to faw and as dave says crash, i made a silly mistake last november which haunts me everyday,

learned my lesson, don't drive like a **** it simply isnt worth it. if you care about your car why thrash it??

police... yus i agree alot of them drive like complete knob heads, why must they sit up your backside, this is intimidation. which if a normal driver did. is a pullable offence, its so irritating..

as for the twocers rehabiliation act

they don't deserve anything, they choose to take people car's, not like its compulsary is it??
 
Q1. OUTRAGEOUS

Q2 Depends on experience and decisions made, everybody makes mistakes whether it be highly trained or general public.



Q4. Both however performance is where it is at in my opinion. I personally love going to tracks and drags etc its a great day out where everything is safe and secure within reason. Dont get me wrong i will accept that i have put my foot down from time to time when it is safe to do so.



Q6 I despise boy racers and the impact they have on my social life tbh..
Since buying a saxo vtr all i get at traffic lights is people looking at me as if i am going to wheelspin off the lights. I also seem to get targetted a lot by coppers in the local area as their is a huge crackdown on boy racers however anyone with a young lads car gets pulled to try and sway them from driving round i suppose. I am personally in a car enthusiast group in which has police backing as we try and restrict idiots coming in and hold numerous charity events etc.
 
Q1. I dont feel anything really

Q2 Cool

Q3 i dont know what this is

Q4. I would rather have a squeaky clean car with no mods at all and how fast i goes does not bother me

Q5 Yes and Yes
 
Hopefully if you had a decent Instructor, you would have got more out of it than just a discount.

It was a Direct response to the post above saying that Pass plus had saved him no money, when in my experience it did save me a fair bit, The course itself I did the syllabus described, Most useful bit of which I found was fast road technique, as dual carriageways/motorways had never troubled me particularly but learning to overtake properly is invaluable and is not covered on the test. Also one minor shunt in 5 years so not doing too bad compared to some I know who didn't do it.
 
It was a Direct response to the post above saying that Pass plus had saved him no money, when in my experience it did save me a fair bit, The course itself I did the syllabus described, Most useful bit of which I found was fast road technique, as dual carriageways/motorways had never troubled me particularly but learning to overtake properly is invaluable and is not covered on the test. Also one minor shunt in 5 years so not doing too bad compared to some I know who didn't do it.
Perhaps I didn't make my point very well, but my experience of taking pupils for Pass +, which for my pupils was most of them, is that the deciding factor for them is the discount not the training
 
once i saw a plice astra with his sirens on in busy traffic go past then down the road he switched them off and carried on as normal...
I just want my drivers liscence so i can drive a car if i want to but id be enthralled at the oppurtunity of doing driviing stuff with trained officers as said in Q2 - aslong as it wasnt overpriced.
 
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Perhaps I didn't make my point very well, but my experience of taking pupils for Pass +, which for my pupils was most of them, is that the deciding factor for them is the discount not the training

I took it as a refresher course really, After getting my license couldn't afford a car for 6 months so took it the week before I went car shopping to make sure I wasn't too rusty. Although I must be one of a small number of people to have gone rallying thinking hmmm this should be good for my car control skills.
 
1. I remember things like this for trouble makers at school for example, the naughty lads would get to go indoor mountain climbing or something like that, really annoyed me, us that were well behaved(ish) lol were stuck at home.

2. TBH i havent seen much of the police's driving, when they're driving along it seems quite poor TBH not indicating, speeding etc.

3. not sure as to what the IAM is.

4. both but more the way it goes TBH.

5. yes, what really has annoyed me lately is my mate who just passed his test has been stopped and let off for speeding twice, he drives like a total idiot everywhere, he rang me once whilst driving and asked if he could leave me because i was driving too slow.. i just like to take my time, i got caught speeding in a deserted 30mph road at 11pm and i am a careful driver.

6. sounds good, and there should be more coppers like you! if you could get a few mates to join, even with the cheap insurance and days out, it could be a laugh, i've seen loads of road war programs on TV saying they have nowhere to go to mess about with there cars without being moved on.
 
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Perhaps I didn't make my point very well, but my experience of taking pupils for Pass +, which for my pupils was most of them, is that the deciding factor for them is the discount not the training

When i passed and went ahead and took pass plus it was purely for the discount - I felt safe and comfortable with my driving and didnt really think i'd get anything from doing the course (which is what most young drivers are probably thinking.) It wasn't until i'd completed it i realised how valuable the experiance was and how much more there is still to learn after you've passed. Now I think it should be compulsary.

Its just one of those things really, until you've been there, you'll never realise what good it will do you.
 
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once i saw a plice astra with his sirens on in busy traffic go past then down the road he switched them off and carried on as normal...

More than likely that more than one car was going to an incident, first car on scene either didn't need back up or has found that the call is not worth an emergancy status and has cancelled the second car, hence turning the lights n sirens off and continuing as normal
 
When i passed and went ahead and took pass plus it was purely for the discount - I felt safe and comfortable with my driving and didnt really think i'd get anything from doing the course (which is what most young drivers are probably thinking.) It wasn't until i'd completed it i realised how valuable the experiance was and how much more there is still to learn after you've passed. Now I think it should be compulsary.

Its just one of those things really, until you've been there, you'll never realise what good it will do you.

The only good thing about pass plus is Motorway driving. I know loads of people who daren't go on the motorway because they've never been taught how. Its a bit mad how to drive anywhere far you need a Motorway and it isn't in a standard test... :rolleyes:

Once you know how to actually drive on a motorway as well and you realise its a bit different to how everyone does drive. :rolleyes:
 
When i passed and went ahead and took pass plus it was purely for the discount - I felt safe and comfortable with my driving and didnt really think i'd get anything from doing the course (which is what most young drivers are probably thinking.) It wasn't until i'd completed it i realised how valuable the experiance was and how much more there is still to learn after you've passed. Now I think it should be compulsary.
If you have a good insructor you will get a lot out of Pass +. What might be the most important aspect of the scheme is that you continue to develop your skills after you've finished the course.

Its just one of those things really, until you've been there, you'll never realise what good it will do you.

More than likely that more than one car was going to an incident, first car on scene either didn't need back up or has found that the call is not worth an emergancy status and has cancelled the second car, hence turning the lights n sirens off and continuing as normal
Quite often when an incident arises a nunber of cars and vans may be asked to answer the call. At some point the first officers on scene may say that the fight (or whatever) has finished but the crims may well return as they are still probably in the area. In that case the instruction will go out "Patrols not yet on scene, slow down but still attend.

The only good thing about pass plus is Motorway driving. I know loads of people who daren't go on the motorway because they've never been taught how. Its a bit mad how to drive anywhere far you need a Motorway and it isn't in a standard test... :rolleyes:

Once you know how to actually drive on a motorway as well and you realise its a bit different to how everyone does drive. :rolleyes:
Motorway training is very important, but, how much do new drivers know about roll oversteer, or lift-off oversteer, or understeer? Do they know how to
deal with any of them? I would say that the answer to both is a resounding NO. Although many people who live in built-up areas may not go on national speed limit rural roads and those in the country may not go on motorways. But then again, they might. In that case, you have to cover all the bases. You have 3 or 4 lanes on most motorways whereas most country roads have only one so although there is more traffic on the m-ways there is also no oncoming traffic. I'm not sure of the actual statistics but I think the number of deaths on out of town roads is about the same as motorways, but the death rate per thousand is much higher in the country, because of this training on those roads is just as important.
 
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