Technical Lock and key issues

[Psycloud]

Hi All,

We have a 61 plate Fiat Panda (169) 1.2 with central locking. We bought it second hand 18 months ago so no chance of any warranty from the car dealer, however we now have a number of lock and key problems and I’m trying to work out if these can be fixed by an auto locksmith or if the car needs to go to a Fiat service centre.

- The key fob has been playing up, the lock button has been sticking so that when you Pressed unlock it immediately locked again. I tried a 3rd party replacement fob but the board didn’t quite fit but have managed to get the old buttons working by heating the rubber buttons in hot water and pushing them back into shape. I don’t think it will last terribly long though so probably need an official fob replacement, but the boot unlock doesn’t work at all - someone else took the key apart to change the battery and part of the boot microswitch came off. On that basis I think I need a whole new fob and board programmed to the car.

- The driver door lock barrel seems to be broken or not the right barrel for the key blade. The blade works in the boot and the ignition but doesn’t turn the forint door barrel. Can the barrel be replaced to match the key blade or do Ibhave to get all the barrels replaced with a new key and fob? We didn’t realise this was an issue as didn’t use the key in the door for about 6 months after we bought it so was probably already and issue.

- One if the back doors doesn’t lock with the central locking. It unlocks fine but to lock it I have to push the interior lock handle before shutting the door.

So, should I call a lock specialist or take it to Fiat?

Many thanks.

 

[varesecrazy]

Hi,

Ebay may well supply a Skeleton of a key quite cheaply,

local shoe and key place will supply a basic key for @£60, that will start the car and be crisp and straight.. So may well improve the steering lock

 

[The Panda Nut]

I have tried extensively to get hold of a complete aftermarket fob and failed. I found a place in Italy that said it sold them for c£50 but it was a scam. Thankfully Paypay / eBay refunded me. I would ask a locksmith first. They may have experience. You can buy microswitches so a locksmith would be able to. I would suggest a breakers for an original key case. I believe you can reprogramme a secondhand fob, but only if its exactly the same as the car you have and possibly the same year too. I retained Bravo fobs and hoped to reprogramme them for my Panda. This could not be done as MES couldnt match the fob chip to the car. If the fob works try a locksmith, good ones can do magic. Failing this, as suggested above get a standard key and forego the central locking. Round end style key fobs for the Bravo were £325 some 8 years ago and a fob for the Panda 169 cost me £199 five years ago. Standard keys are readily available via locksmiths as Varesecray has indicated.

 

[varesecrazy]

Purchasing a sound used Panda/Punto era key and swapping the innards shouldn't be Too big a challenge

 

[irc]

There are a couple of places doing fob refurbishment on eBay. I have used one in the past to replace buttons, and cut a new straight blade (think someone had used it as a pry-bar).
The one I used doesn't seem to be advertising on eBay at the moment, so no specific recommendations, but could be worth a try?

 

[koalar]

Just re shell it

There only £1.50ish from china

Make sure you order the right one

Fiat do two different but very similar keys
The inside can not be swapped from one type to the other

Type A

Type B

The blade swaps over

 

[koalar]

Unfortainly the barrels have to be ordered as a set with a new key. Most second hand places will not split them from the ECU and BSI as they are coded togrther

But there are work arounds

First the blades inside the barrel stick, normally through sqirting anti freeze or WD40

dipping the key in some thin oil and working it back and forwards sometimes frees it up

Worst case the one inside the glovebox can be swapped over

 

[koalar]

A new remote
Plus pre programming
Plus programming in to the car
Plus cutting

Is normal around £250 assuming you can find someone able to do it

Or simpler but more expensive is to order a pre programed one from Fiat from the VIN number

If you haven't got a spare get a none remote spare cloned ASAP £35-75 it's a nightmare and expensive if you lose the only key

 

[koalar]

I have tried extensively to get hold of a complete aftermarket fob and failed. I found a place in Italy that said it sold them for c£50 but it was a scam. Thankfully Paypay / eBay refunded me. I would ask a locksmith first. They may have experience. You can buy microswitches so a locksmith would be able to. I would suggest a breakers for an original key case. I believe you can reprogramme a secondhand fob, but only if its exactly the same as the car you have and possibly the same year too.

Nope it's a write once

You can use a secondhand key, but you would have to unsolder the chip and fit a blank one, but even then that needs programing with the information stored in the BSI

The only realistic way second hand and avoid a £200 bill for programming would be to buy a complete set, locks, keys, BSI and ECU

I retained Bravo fobs and hoped to reprogramme them for my Panda. This could not be done as MES couldnt match the fob chip to the car. If the fob works try a locksmith, good ones can do magic. Failing this, as suggested above get a standard key and forego the central locking. Round end style key fobs for the Bravo were £325 some 8 years ago and a fob for the Panda 169 cost me £199 five years ago. Standard keys are readily available via locksmiths as Varesecray has indicated.

 

[varesecrazy]

Unfortainly the barrels have to be ordered as a set with a new key. Most second hand places will not split them from the ECU and BSI as they are coded togrther

But there are work arounds

First the blades inside the barrel stick, normally through sqirting anti freeze or WD40

dipping the key in some thin oil and working it back and forwards sometimes frees it up

Worst case the one inside the glovebox can be swapped over

Swapped barrel is certainly cheap and a guaranteed fit

 

[Psycloud]

So the main key (remote 3 button) blade does work in the ignition and we have a also have a non-remote that works in the ignition. These also both work in the boot.

Have spoken to Timpsons who seem to have an issue with 169 Pandas so now contacting an auto locksmith in the hope of an aftermarket 3 button fob.

The driver door barrel is definitely broken. Looks like a forced entry at some point prior to our owning it as the outer lock plate is bent slightly as if a large screwdriver was forced in. I’ve squirted loads of WD40 and wiggled as much as I could but doesn’t move at all. Inserted a very thin/small screwdriver and extracted what looks like swarf so giving up on getting that working.

I wonder if it’s possible to just get a new barrel and key just for the driver door so it can be opened in the event the fob stops working before I source a replacement? There are loads on eBay for very little £ - is there any reason why they wouldn’t work? The electronic central locking and the mechanical barrel are not necessarily matched are they?

 

[jrkitching]

I wonder if it’s possible to just get a new barrel and key just for the driver door so it can be opened in the event the fob stops working

Seems like a reasonable plan to me; if you've a working fob, this is going to be for emergency use only.

I've had mine from new, and in the 13 years I've had it, I've never had to use the key to unlock the drivers door.

And in an emergency, you can always get into the car without a working remote fob by using one of the existing keys to unlock the rear hatch.

This is another advantage of the 169 Panda over the 500 - you can't unlock the 500 hatch with a physical key.

 

[Psycloud]

Yes we managed to get in and get it started via rear hatch when the fob wasn’t working.

I may see if I can use the airbag barrel in the door and use an eBay barrel in the airbag, that way at least the main keys will work on the exterior doors.

Now I need to work out why the rear door unlocks using the fob but doesn’t lock. Makes no difference if childlock is on or not, the only way to lock it is to open the door and depress the handle. May be I should start a separate thread for this?

 

[varesecrazy]

Need confirmation..

But the Airbag isolator barrel CAN Be swapped with the ignitiin

Wondering if it could give you a genuine door barrel?

@koalar

 

[portland_bill]

Need confirmation..

But the Airbag isolator barrel CAN Be swapped with the ignitiin

Wondering if it could give you a genuine door barrel?

@koalar

Has the airbag lock got any innards? Most cars I've seen have them just as a switch, and can be turned with anything. They make it for the key to fit for convenience. Surprising if they go to the trouble of fitting it with unique tumblers.

 

[Psycloud]

Has the airbag lock got any innards? Most cars I've seen have them just as a switch, and can be turned with anything. They make it for the key to fit for convenience. Surprising if they go to the trouble of fitting it with unique tumblers.

The airbag lock definitely has innards. I can only turn it using my ignition key from this car. I have another 169 with the same type of key blade and it goes in but doesn’t turn.

 

[koalar]

Need confirmation..

But the Airbag isolator barrel CAN Be swapped with the ignitiin

Wondering if it could give you a genuine door barrel?

@koalar

Yes

It's been confirmed to work, within the Last couple of weeks, but not by me

Here

Panda 2008 lock barrel | FIAT Panda (Mk3)

Some scrote had a go at the lock on my 2008 panda. I'm looking on Amazon / eBay for replacement lock sets. Does any one have a picture of the barrel so that I can be sure I'm ordering the correct one? Tia

www.fiatforum.com

 

[koalar]

Has the airbag lock got any innards? Most cars I've seen have them just as a switch, and can be turned with anything. They make it for the key to fit for convenience. Surprising if they go to the trouble of fitting it with unique tumblers.

Yes it's full functional

I have swapped the switch for one out of a punto and then swapped the barrels over so I didn't need two key


Which probably confirms the punto lockets have identical barrels

 

[Psycloud]

Success!

Today I managed to remove the airbag lock and fit it to the door and now the key works!

Dismantling the door was more complex than I imagined but with the help of YouTube and a cordless drill to remove a couple of rivets The whole process probably took me 90 minutes.

The faulty barrel has a stuck pin. I can’t move it with pliers and it remains sticking out when the key is inserted while all the others retract. I wonder if there’s a way to remove that pin so the key still works? Could I just file it flat?

Thank you for all the help on this subject. Could not have done it without you all.

 

[koalar]

Success!

Today I managed to remove the airbag lock and fit it to the door and now the key works!

Dismantling the door was more complex than I imagined but with the help of YouTube and a cordless drill to remove a couple of rivets The whole process probably took me 90 minutes.

The faulty barrel has a stuck pin. I can’t move it with pliers and it remains sticking out when the key is inserted while all the others retract. I wonder if there’s a way to remove that pin so the key still works? Could I just file it flat?

Thank you for all the help on this subject. Could not have done it without you all.

I don't see why not as long as the key fully inserts

If I have an ignition barrel that will not turn because the key worn

I either remove the blades completely or file them down and never had any bother

I have repaired quite a few locks but never seen one that's jammed like this, could it be super glue?