Have VAG totally lost the plot?

[vexorg]

I still dont get how we (the UK) have a huge amount of renewables now, even last summer they claimed the entire country was running on renewables for a full day, yet are still hammered for electricity prices. The windturbines are appearing everywhere in central scotland, and yes, not as reliable as fossil /nuclear, it still must be making a big difference now. I thought the move to renewable would have work hand in hand with the EV market, to be more green.

I cant justify replacing my aging citroen that will probably be good for at least another 100k+ miles with a £40k car. I just fix up my cars and they get whatever they need to keep going, rust is about my limit as that's when I know it's time to move on.

As for the chip shortage, it's a global issue, with random components being on stupid lead times, every day components are stitting at 12 months or more.

 

[StevenRB45]

More and more companies doing away with cars, or allowing more ‘opt-outs’, and giving a bonus instead…this is now how one of my brothers gets motors and goes for cars a couple of years old…he’s now got some merc or other
Mate, who has a 500, and works for one of the big banks, also opted out of scheme

Fleet buyers are the majority of sales.

If everyone opts out, supply of used cars is down prices go up anyway.

We've got an opt-in at work it only offers electric cars. To be fair I could get a decent price on a Tesla but given my business miles are in the region of 28 a month seems a bit unnecessary.

 

[porta]

Fleet buyers are the majority of sales.

If everyone opts out, supply of used cars is down prices go up anyway.

We've got an opt-in at work it only offers electric cars. To be fair I could get a decent price on a Tesla but given my business miles are in the region of 28 a month seems a bit unnecessary.

Yup, still in this country fleet sales are by far the biggest…but company car sales are in decline and, according to ONS and the SMMT, that’s year on year. The slack isn’t being taken up by those on opt-outs or bonus schemes, as they appear to be buying older cars or smaller ones…except like my Merc brother, or my neighbour who get an older or new behemoth status symbol
But full fleet sales include vans and trucks and, at the minute, there isn’t a rush to buy EVs as they either don’t exist or can’t carry the load except short stint inner city work

 

[chris3234]

Let’s be very clear, Covid didn’t make cars expensive, brexit did

So Brexit caused a worldwide care price increase?

 

[AndyRKett]

So Brexit caused a worldwide care price increase?

Didn’t you know ? Brexit also rigged the 2020 US election and shot JFK.

 

[porta]

I do accept that Covid, and the knock on effects on output from everything from chips to steel and then Ukraine/Russia. My argument was that, although globally prices increased, the reason our increases were greater is ‘that which cannot be challenged’…anyway, I deleted my treatise on economics and political intrigue…I’m going to steer clear of that on here, especially after last time where the mods had to step in…anyway
EU 8.7 ECB
UK 15%
EU figures, all passenger vehicles, UK figures exclude EVs…I don’t know why, nor does it explain that it’s an overall average with some vehicles seeing an increase of (only!) 11.5% and some more (no examples given).
Extrapolating evidence from SMMT seems a bit ‘cherry picking’, and it’s likely been cherry picked anyway as I got it from the BBC, who quoted the AA, who got it from god knows who at the SMMT…it’s a pity it’s not as thorough as the ECB report, however that goes against Autovista24 EU price increases, who report average figures similar to ours, but also give examples of figures across Europe AND, crucially, over classes/segments of vehicles, where some increases in UK were an eye watering 26+%…incidentally, we all witnessed the knock on effect on used car prices that meant some used cars prices were higher than equivalent new!

 

[vexorg]

Didn’t you know ? Brexit also rigged the 2020 US election and shot JFK.

Whereas some of us are still waiting for the benefits of brexit (if they ever appear), or that £350million to a week(!) to the NHS.

Very little impact in the global market, but really has not helped locally within the UK.

 

[The Panda Nut]

When I was working I worked out that having my own car was was way way better financially than a company car. The tax refunds I got were sufficient to ensure I could buy a new or nearly new car every two years, pay for the tax, insurance, breakdown cover and tyres and make a few pounds towards the next car. Further advantage was I got to select the car and ensure that all the features required to drive 100K miles a year were provided and seats that fitted me etc etc. Final choice was the Bravo 1.6D. That car could either cruise at three figure speeds or hit 80+mpg driven carefully, so I did the latter and stuck to 60mph even on motorways. Company cars are for people who do very few miles only. They didnt want me to withdraw from the scheme but I played the health card having had carpel tunnel ops insisting in having either a nice round section steering wheel or an oval one as all the sill shaped wheels caused my hands to hurt. Financially getting my own car was one of the best moves I ever made. When they finally pissed my off so much that I decided not to go back I walked out WITH the car keys! Unlike many predecessors who were forced to call a cab!

The Bravo also did 70K on front tyres, 85K on back tyres 65K on brake pads and had no breakdowns. A real advert for Fiats engineering.

 

[The Panda Nut]

I find the rising cost of chips a real pain. It wouldnt be so bad, but fish is also going up.

 

[StevenRB45]

When I was working I worked out that having my own car was was way way better financially than a company car. The tax refunds I got were sufficient to ensure I could buy a new or nearly new car every two years, pay for the tax, insurance, breakdown cover and tyres and make a few pounds towards the next car. Further advantage was I got to select the car and ensure that all the features required to drive 100K miles a year were provided and seats that fitted me etc etc. Final choice was the Bravo 1.6D. That car could either cruise at three figure speeds or hit 80+mpg driven carefully, so I did the latter and stuck to 60mph even on motorways. Company cars are for people who do very few miles only. They didnt want me to withdraw from the scheme but I played the health card having had carpel tunnel ops insisting in having either a nice round section steering wheel or an oval one as all the sill shaped wheels caused my hands to hurt. Financially getting my own car was one of the best moves I ever made. When they finally pissed my off so much that I decided not to go back I walked out WITH the car keys! Unlike many predecessors who were forced to call a cab!

The Bravo also did 70K on front tyres, 85K on back tyres 65K on brake pads and had no breakdowns. A real advert for Fiats engineering.

But salary sacrifice is the thing these days. Also all cars are massively more expensive..

So to take the scheme at work as an example if you're in the 40% tax bracket a Tesla Y works out at sub 400 quid a month once the reduction in taxes you pay elsewhere has been applied. They've even installed free rapid chargers..so you can do down to the office once a week to top your car off if you feel like it and have zero fuel costs.

That also covers service, tyres and insurance.

Summat like a mini electric is mid 250s, yes you must pay BIK but on an electric car it's 2% or about 800 per year on a 40k car. On a pure piston car it would be in the 10 to 20% of the P11d value.

 

[The Panda Nut]

But salary sacrifice is the thing these days. Also all cars are massively more expensive..

So to take the scheme at work as an example of you're in the 40% tax bracket a Tesla Y works out at sub 400 quid a month once the reduction in taxes you pay elsewhere has been applied. They've even installed free rapid chargers..so you can do down to the office once a week to top your car off if you feel like it and have zero fuel costs.

That also covers service, tyres and insurance.

Summat like a mini electric is mid 250s, yes you must pay BIK but on an electric car it's 2% or about 800 per year on a 40k car. On a pure piston car it would be in the 10 to 20%.

Yes economics ... I was paid £530 a month in lieu of the car, and then got 13ppm for fuel. Government topped this up to £40ppm or more. Endo of year Taxrefund was 50% of the cost of the car! You do have to be doing miles for this to work but as I keep the car immaculate and fully serviced although high miles it was still as new when I retired. Electric cars do move things a long way, but would not be practical for the sort of driving I was required to do. The best thing the company ever did was to reduce the PPM for fuel. This pissed me off and set me on driving withing their budget so much reduced speed and MUCH better MPG. It was really staggering how good that car was on fuel. I was making a profit on the companies 12.9pp once in the groove. Government top up was pure profit.

 

[StevenRB45]

Yes economics ... I was paid £530 a month in lieu of the car, and then got 13ppm for fuel. Government topped this up to £40ppm or more. Endo of year Taxrefund was 50% of the cost of the car! You do have to be doing miles for this to work but as I keep the car immaculate and fully serviced although high miles it was still as new when I retired. Electric cars do move things a long way, but would not be practical for the sort of driving I was required to do.

We're not really talking about "true" company cars here.

We're talking about companies offering their staff lease via the company to reduce their tax bills and get a new car out of it. Things like NHS fleet solutions...

Imagine a standard lease except you make the payment out of your income before it is taxed rather than after.

 

[porta]

I find the rising cost of chips a real pain. It wouldnt be so bad, but fish is also going up.

at our local it went from a tenner for ‘twice’ to just shy of £19 and that’s take out!

 

[porta]

Whereas some of us are still waiting for the benefits of brexit (if they ever appear), or that £350million to a week(!) to the NHS.

Very little impact in the global market, but really has not helped locally within the UK.

Hahahahahaha indeed…
I now use the ‘ignore’ function vey much easier on my blood pressure and sense on incredulity, but I will qualify my stance once more and then no more
Whilst I agree, to a certain extent, that Covid did cause a surge in costs globally, it affected us more significantly AND whatever they say to defend brexit, we were already hit with higher prices because of it:

• Report shows cost of car ownership has increased relative to inflation since 2016
• The average price of a new car is now 12.3% higher than it was 3 years ago
• ONS stats show that maintenance and repairs up 9.2% and spare parts rose 8.7%
• Fuel prices have risen by up to 11.6% and insurance premiums jumped by £46

Cost of owning a car has jumped since the Brexit vote

A review of new vehicle prices and other driving-related charges suggests that political uncertainty and a weakened pound have resulted in motoring costs rising higher than the rate of inflation since 2016.

www.thisismoney.co.uk

and these are old figure, things are getting worse not better!

 

[AndyRKett]

Whereas some of us are still waiting for the benefits of brexit (if they ever appear), or that £350million to a week(!) to the NHS.

Very little impact in the global market, but really has not helped locally within the UK.

Totally agree with you.

I am not going to spend the rest of my life blaming everything on Brexit, there is a lot more going on right now than Brexit and Covid and the Ukraine war has had a far more massive impact on global prices than Brexit ever did.

Just the shift away from Russian Oil and Gas has done more to global prices than brexit and that instability is still ongoing. Therefore in a period of global political and economical flux. To just say "brexit did it" is not only a massive injustice but really shows a lack of understanding of what's really going on in the world.

We did actually benefit during covid due to Brexit because we were able to make decisions away from Europe and not have to wait for them to all get together and agree on a plan..... its just unfortunate our politicians pissed away £30bn on a pointless track and trace system....... which is probably where that £350M a week has gone for many years to come.

 

[AndyRKett]

Hahahahahaha indeed…
I now use the ‘ignore’ function vey much easier on my blood pressure and sense on incredulity,

Becoming incredulous at anything you don't agree with, and then choosing to ignore it rather then learn or discuss.......

Sounds a perfectly healthy way to get through life.

Trump supporters, religious extremists, the far right and flat earthers also take this approach.

Of course I know you won't see this

 

[vexorg]

We did actually benefit during covid due to Brexit because we were able to make decisions away from Europe and not have to wait for them to all get together and agree on a plan.....

I dont think that was the case, or ever was the case. Most countries still do what they want relgardless of the EU, hence the reason for all the individual spikes withinthe european countries.

I remember finding out years ago when in germany (and france later too) that the local areas were free to add and remove any taxes they liked. And we were fed the lines about "cant change that EU says so", I took the EU rules to be a nice place for the UK politicians to hide behind and avoid the awkward questions.