Technical First Service

[andytran]

You all have NO IDEA about how much you are being ripped off.

Lets look at a Panda.

It will take about £12 worth of oil (thats what the dealer pays) a £5 oil filter (again dealer gets at cost) and if you are really lucky, a pollen filter costing £4?

Then who does the service? Normally a 1st or 2nd year apprentice who is being paid around £6 an hour.

The service takes around 30 minutes. You dont get software updates in a service UNLESS there is a recall or you have a problem which can be fixed by software.

Whilst the old oil is draining on the ramp, the trainee is doing a VISUAL inspection of your brakes and everything else under the car, making sure there are no leaks, loose pipes, problems, etc.

He then swaps the oil filter, lowers the car and fills up with new oil, again checking wipers, oiling hinges and checking lights work.

All in all, the cost to the garage is in the region of £30 MAX.
Servicing is the biggest money generator for any franchised garage - you think they are being efficient sending you a little card to "remind" you about a service being due? Rubbish, they make so much money out of you that they will do anything to get your business.

Think Im lying? Well, my father owns a franchised dealership (not Fiat) my son works for a Ford main dealer and best of all, my local FIAT garage in Northern Scotland will do the service for £78 inc.

-Remember at £78 they are still making a nice profit. There should be a law against these southern garages charging so much.

I know Im ranting on, but it annoys the hell out of me the way that we are so ripped off by garages for servicing- it is absolutely disgraceful.

The only reason you are now allowed to get your car serviced at an independent garage( and maintain the manufacturers warranty as long as "approved" parts are used ), is because if the manufacturers didnt permit this, they knew they would be investigated by the monopolies and mergers commission.

I know that most people go to the main dealer because it is more comforting (I do also) but just be aware, when they delightedly tell you that they have kindly washed your car, its only because they have just made a bloody mint out of you.

Andy

Andy

 

[PandaPaul]

Thanks for that info, I thought that anything over 125pounds was expensive, but you've certainly put a new perspective on things! I do recognise that garages are running a business, and would expect to pay more at a dealer, however there is a lot of creative pricing out there.

Some of this is often put down to regional variations. I doubt mechanics in the South are paid any more than those in the North, however the cost of leasing premises is probably more. But, the different quotes between dealers in Kent shows how willing some are to take your money! It would be interesting to compare the service invoices to see exactly how the charges break down e.g. is it simply down to differing labour rates or hugely inflated parts prices?

Of course, none of this is anything new, but it does illustrate the importance of shopping around if you don't fancy giving your money away!

 

[100hpJames]

they'll always make big money out of servicing but its a price most people (including me in a few thousand miles) are willing to pay for peace of mind ( I'd do it myself if I could, dead against paying for simple service work)

 

[andytran]

Some of this is often put down to regional variations. I doubt mechanics in the South are paid any more than those in the North, however the cost of leasing premises is probably more. But, the different quotes between dealers in Kent shows how willing some are to take your money! It would be interesting to compare the service invoices to see exactly how the charges break down e.g. is it simply down to differing labour rates or hugely inflated parts prices?QUOTE]


Paul, you are totally correct - it costs a little more to run a dealership in expensive areas - but almost 3x more?

another good example is this:

I used to own a 2.0TDCi Focus Ghia. I bought it brand new from the garage my son works at in scotland.
Whilst working in High Wycombe, I had LOTS of EGR valve problems, which Perrys of High Wycombe attempted (very unsuccesfully) to fix. The car was a month from its first service, so I looked at their good old Menu servicing pricelist for some idea of the cost......to this day I still cannot believe it.....£290!!! For a Focus diesel!!!!
My sons garage would have charged £105 for EXACTLY the same job, which would no doubt be carried out with a great deal more care and attention as they rely on local repeat business.

Unfortunately I never did do the first service - the car was a pig so I traded it in for a new Focus ST!

andy

 

[Alan.D]

I haven't used a dealer for a service in about 14 yrs as it is so easy to do it yourself, but with a brand new car peace of mind is the largest consideration. Also when it comes to selling, a car with full dealer service history will always be more in demand.

 

[Trefor]

If one chooses to go independent, what spec oil is required for the 100HP at first service?

I'm not a skinflint, and I don't mind dealers making a good profit, but £199 is around £100 more than I would expect to have to pay for an oil change service which I believe the first service is (right?). After all, I bought this car to save a bit of cash on running costs.

Must hunt down a good Fiat indie in the Bucks/Berks area...

 

[randomizered]

Selenia 20K

or some 10w/40 semi synth should do the trick.

Kristian

 

[Trefor]

Anyone ever use these guys? I have family in Torquay so could get a service while visiting:

http://web.ukonline.co.uk/tillsonhawke/

Check out the prices.

 

[T14086]

The service takes around 30 minutes. You dont get software updates in a service UNLESS there is a recall or you have a problem which can be fixed by software.

Any available software updates I carry out (as do most techs I know) because (1) the examiner is connected up anyway to reset service light (2) service sheet says 'using examiner check for errors in injection system (3) update can take between 5 - 15 minutes,not exactly that long to carry out..do it while lubricating locks etc (4) It saves a customer possibly returning in the future for a possible fault requiring this update,this means less time car is in garage thus customer not having to return & therefore customer having more faith in product and likely to renew car with same brand. (5) Hence reason for Fiats best service recall so these updates (and other issues) can be carried out at no cost to customer.

Whilst the old oil is draining on the ramp, the trainee is doing a VISUAL inspection of your brakes and everything else under the car, making sure there are no leaks, loose pipes, problems, etc.

He then swaps the oil filter, lowers the car and fills up with new oil, again checking wipers, oiling hinges and checking lights work.

All in all, the cost to the garage is in the region of £30 MAX.
Servicing is the biggest money generator for any franchised garage - you think they are being efficient sending you a little card to "remind" you about a service being due? Rubbish, they make so much money out of you that they will do anything to get your business.

Think Im lying? Well, my father owns a franchised dealership (not Fiat) my son works for a Ford main dealer and best of all, my local FIAT garage in Northern Scotland will do the service for £78 inc.

I have no doubts that this goes on but a few points;

Personally I never use a trainee (no offence to them,we all got to start somewhere I know) but I find that after I have checked everything he has done (as the tech is responsible legally should something go wrong!) I could of done it quicker myself.If I have spare/extra time & there is a apprentice standing nearby with hands in his pocket i'll show him a few tips or ask if theres anything he needs to know/help him with college work etc

I dont give a rats arse if a service is timed at (for example) 1 hour...it takes aslong as it takes to do it correctly (I rarely do service within time allowed) and to manufactures spec....if my employer has a problem with that & expects me to cut corners to achieve that time then sack me...at least I can sleep at night knowing in myself I did the job correctly/completely!

Why not watch service getting done (should be viewing window/area) as I would especialy if apprentice working on car which I wouldn't mind aslong as correctly supervised.

Ford have recently slashed service times but you get a lot less for your money.Ford techs I know are not happy that some have been cut from 1.2 to 0.7 (little over half hour).Fiat are abit more generous with service times but even these are getting cut back...but then again cars are more reliable these days/parts lasting longer/longer service intervals.

Fair enough if you can correctly maintain your car yourself but your probably talking about what 20% of the population,of the remaing 80% some cant or would rather pay but many are happy and often grateful.....if they were not they wouldn't come back.

Yes a dealer does make good money from servicing (retail work is vital as warranty work is at a lower rate) but dont forget to take into account training bills/software subscriptions/equipment etc....after all would you want a cowboy to work on your gas/electric system at home or a proper registered and trained/tested technician? Its also around about now that I wheel out this old nugget...council tax! £110/month for getting my bins emptied of which I have to wash the cans/bottles,seperate the paper/garden cuttings and try & compress 2 weeks rubbish into a bin the size of one that used to be emptied every week...........now thats true value for money

 

[andytran]

T14086,

I can see validity in the majority of your comments.

I must say, I would like to have my car serviced by you!

Your garage must be one of a handful in the UK that do not use trainees to conduct routine servicing - Admittedly you wouldnt have a first year apprentice doing it unsupervised, but it is the norm for 2nd year on apps doing all of the work and getting their supervisor to sign off the job.

Also, you must be one of the few who will take whatever time is required to do a service. at the Ford dealers where my son works, they wheel em through the service dept faster than your shopping gets scanned at Tesco!

No matter what, in the main, servicing is 50% too expensive - period. The fact that small town garages can do it so much cheaper, as can the French, Belgians and Dutch, just proves we live in a rip off country.

Andy

 

[T14086]

I must say, I would like to have my car serviced by you!

I have my off days the same as anyone else,were all human

Your garage must be one of a handful in the UK that do not use trainees to conduct routine servicing - Admittedly you wouldnt have a first year apprentice doing it unsupervised, but it is the norm for 2nd year on apps doing all of the work and getting their supervisor to sign off the job.

Apprentices do servicing but are checked afterwards,however a tighter quality control would be even better.As for supervisor signing off work...on his head be it.

Also, you must be one of the few who will take whatever time is required to do a service. at the Ford dealers where my son works, they wheel em through the service dept faster than your shopping gets scanned at Tesco!

I know,one of the many reasons I left ford...annoys me when people seem to think its only Fiat garages that are bad,its widespread.

I done a 1.2 hour service yesterday,took me 1.6...I dont care! As I said i'd rather get it right & double check stuff if I have too.Can't sack you for being too slow,about time more techs stood up for themselves & the customer.At Fiat you are more customer focused trained which is what I like

The fact that small town garages can do it so much cheaper, as can the French, Belgians and Dutch, just proves we live in a rip off country.

Can't do anything about that its the price we pay for living in this country with its glorious weather

 

[Nuova500]

I serviced all my new and old Fiats myself, you then know that its all been done properly and if it goes wrong its your own fault. I always let Fiat do the first one for the warranty but after that just me, and at part ex time not one dealer has ever looked at the service book or checked their system to see if its been done. I was told it matters nothing to them, as they will stamp the missing pages if there are any

Back to dealer servicing... they overfilled a Cinq I had so much, you could hear the extra oil slopping about, on a new Panda they forgot to change pollen filter, didnt reset service light and couldnt for several days and when they did change the filter, they pinched a load of electrical wiring and broke the filter housing. On a Sei they mentioned they rehinged my bonnet as it was misaligned, they made it even worse so I did it myself! When the Cinqs were current I saw them filling a new one up with Castrol GTX mineral oil once.
This is not one dealer, but three seperate ones... I have used a fourth who were great, but they have since gone

 

[Trefor]

Reading Evo today, their Leon Cupra cost £169 for its first annualish service, their Golf cost £15 less. This is why I say £199 is too much. Fiat won't be doing any more than VW/Seat at this service.

 

[T14086]

depends what is fitted though (plugs/air/pollen filters etc)...all cars are different.Fiat service sheet says 'connect examiner for EOBD errors' wethers frord will change filter,check light & levels and out the door etc etc

 

[Layney]

According to my service book, the 12000 mile service is basically an oil and oil filter change with a few checks carried out. I wouldn't expect them to charge for more than 1 hour labour plus oil and filter.

I used to work for VW - HQ + dealer, which was an eye opener. A simple oil and filter change should only take 0.5hrs.....the dealers make a mint by charging stupid amounts for labour. At VW they charged £90 per hour - Ouch!!!

 

[T14086]

At VW they charged £90 per hour

Jst thought i'd rub that in abit:devil:

 

[Layney]

lol! I used to have a Polo Sport lease car, but would never get one of my own at that rate if I had to pay for it myself!!!!! Rip off!!

 

[PandaPaul]

I e-mailed several dealers local to me (within 25 miles) all in Hertfordshire and Buckinghamshire, plus one in Essex that was mentioned earlier in this post.

I asked dealers to quote for a standard 12,000 mile first annual service for a 100HP, providing vehicle details to enable them to use the Fiat service Menu.
The labour time for this service is 1.1 hours according to Fiat, and parts include 2.9 litres of oil, an oil filter and a pollen filter for the air-con. All the dealers are listed on the Fiat UK web site, and I used the e-mail addresses given there, or on the dealers own site.

1/ D salmon Colchester (Essex) (Fiat After Sales & Saab dealer)
TOTAL 148.54 inc parts labour and VAT (no itemisation given)

2/Perrys Amersham (Bucks) (Fiat & Alfa Romeo)
Parts 57.51 + VAT Labour 74 per hour + VAT
TOTAL inc VAT 163.22

3/Anthony Betts Hemel Hempstead (Herts) (Fiat & Suzuki)
Parts 64.41 + VAT Labour 69 per hour + VAT
TOTAL inc VAT 164.87

4/Palmers Watford (Herts)
Labour 97.50 per hour + VAT
TOTAL inc VAT 179.65

5/Glyn Hopkins St. Albans (Herts)
Parts 90.86 + VAT Labour 98.95 per hour + VAT
TOTAL inc VAT 223.03

Perrys of Aylesbury would not provide a written quote, and Souls of Milton Keynes did not respond at all, following two requests to each.

As a point of comparison, Autocar magazine recently reported that similar services on a Seat Leon Cupra 1.8 Turbo 237BHP was 155pounds and a Suzuki Swift Sport 1.6 cost 149pounds (Chiswick West London).
My local BMW main dealer charges 110 + VAT labour per hour.

The distance between the dealers at Hemel Hempstead and St Albans is about 10 miles, the price difference is 58 pounds (35%). Draw your own conclusions, however none of the prices are especially competitive when you take into account that this is not a premium brand or particularly powerful vehicle.

 

[T14086]

dont see why a premium brand or powerful vehicle should come into itits based on how long it actually takes to complete the job.

Some cars you have to remove mounts to get oil filter off etc....those cars(models) should have higher service costs because they take longer.

 

[Geminifm]

I contacted my local dealer (Vospers) and they quoted £174 for a 12,000 mile service on my 100hp.

So i rang a couple of other Vospers branches and one was al low as £121 (but 50 miles away) , a £63 difference.

So told my local dealer this and within 5 seconds the price dropped to £135. So my car is now booked in with them.