Punto (Mk1) 1994 Punto Cabriolet ELX 90

[mrcinquecento]

Certainly isn't there on mine, maybe Cabrio's don't have them

They don't have them. Remember from mine (at least on the 1.6 ones) that the only way to open the boot was to use the key.

 

[digger58]

Nice idea! I bought a very clean 1999 4 door today for €90, drives very well, needs 2 front wheel bearings, although it's going to be a donor, power steering, electric windows etc, same interior cloth as my cabrio, Had an idea to get bags made like the X1/9s to match! didn't notice a remote for the boot.

 

[PuntoHowTo]

There is a good reasons cabrios (not just fiat) don't have a boot release in the car, you'll also find no way of folding the seats from the cabin, this is so you can go out leave the roof down while you go off into shops and are still able to secure things in the boot.

It's something the all convertible cars subscribe to, they usually don't have an electronic push switch or anything either as someone can pop the switch out and add their own power to pop the boot.

 

[Didge3]

There is a good reasons cabrios (not just fiat) don't have a boot release in the car, you'll also find no way of folding the seats from the cabin, this is so you can go out leave the roof down while you go off into shops and are still able to secure things in the boot.

Ah now that does make sense, thanks for your words of wisdom

 

[Didge3]

Started cleaning down the engine today, forgot to take before/after pics but it is significantly less oily now. It was literally caked in dry oil,

One gross wire brush and a destroyed cloth too

Anyway, this is going to be potentially a stupid question but I've only ever worked on FIRE engines and even my knowledge of those is limited.
What is this?? (outlined in red)

The pipe coming out of the right leads into the throttle body and it has some sort of sensor on it but I can't figure out what it is??

 

[renaultvation]

That's the EGR valve, which I believe is only fitted to the 1.6 engine. I seem to remember from another thread that it is shared with the Vauxhall Corsa!

 

[Didge3]

That's the EGR valve, which I believe is only fitted to the 1.6 engine. I seem to remember from another thread that it is shared with the Vauxhall Corsa!

That was my first guess but I ruled it out because I thought that was a more recent thing on cars

 

[puntofan01]

That was my first guess but I ruled it out because I thought that was a more recent thing on cars

Especially on petrols, I thought they were only used on disiesel engines!

 

[Didge3]

Especially on petrols, I thought they were only used on disiesel engines!

I knew they were on petrols but I thought they came in around 2001 when the tax brackets were changed to emissions based, meaning EGR = Less emissions = lower tax bracket. No idea what its purpose is on an ancient engine design like mine, improve MPG a tad I guess??

 

[blu73]

i would have guessed ICV but i never seen a 1.6 in the flesh so wouldn't know.... If its not the ICV where is it?

 

[puntofan01]

I knew they were on petrols but I thought they came in around 2001 when the tax brackets were changed to emissions based, meaning EGR = Less emissions = lower tax bracket. No idea what its purpose is on an ancient engine design like mine, improve MPG a tad I guess??

I have no idea.

 

[Didge3]

i would have guessed ICV but i never seen a 1.6 in the flesh so wouldn't know.... If its not the ICV where is it?

If its an ICV then surely if I unplug it and start the car it'll struggle to idle? That would prove it?

EDIT: Found this on eBay, would certainly suggest its an EGR, fits all Fiat's that use the 1581cc. At that price better hope mine never goes wrong

 

[blu73]

It's old.. I bet you can blank it pretty easily without I'll effects. Wouldn't worry about it myself

 

[renaultvation]

I have seen EGR valves for considerably less, but as blu73 says you can blank it: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/48-EGR-va...846689?hash=item2a2c0058e1:g:sj0AAOSwPYZU74UY

 

[Didge3]

I have seen EGR valves for considerably less, but as blu73 says you can blank it: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/48-EGR-va...846689?hash=item2a2c0058e1:g:sj0AAOSwPYZU74UY

Well if it ever were to break that would be an option but why are these blanking plates so readily available? Why do people blank EGR's?

 

[blu73]

well they send exhaust gases back through the engine, which is not great for performance although not really noticeable power gains from blanking them really. But exhaust gases are far from clean and you eventually end up with loads of sooty crap all inside your inlet which can block things up, even stop the butterfly valve closing properly.

When EGRs fail they can cause all sorts of running issues, my old alfa 159 egr failed and the car plain wouldn't run at all.

tbh, for the ease and price i'd be tempted to try blanking it and see if you get engine management light, if not then just leave it as if it does fail the light will come on and stay on whether its blanked or not. Which really isn't a big issue but it is annoying. Plus you can't tell the lights come on for something else in the future if its always on for an egr failure.

My friends corsa kept having running issues once and cleaning up the throttle body always sorted it and eventually we plugged it in and found an egr error code (eml had been on for years but never read codes - not a car person) - so we blanked it - the code is still there obviously but the car runs great, better than ever before and now the intake doesn't get all coked up either so a win win.

 

[Didge3]

tbh, for the ease and price i'd be tempted to try blanking it and see if you get engine management light, if not then just leave it as if it does fail the light will come on and stay on whether its blanked or not. Which really isn't a big issue but it is annoying. Plus you can't tell the lights come on for something else in the future if its always on for an egr failure

I did some general research on the matter but my god there is a lot of mixed opinions... I think they're pretty good for a diesel engine as they help cool the cylinder temp when you lift off the throttle (overrun) which can be necessary in a diesel since they run a lot more compression. With a petrol I'm not entirely sure what the benefits are, as with diesels it also reduces the amount of NOx in the emissions.... Regarding blanking off it should be pretty easy, the plate goes on and a lot of people put the valve back on but swing it 180° so the valve is bolted on at one side and the other just hangs off, this way you can still have it plugged in to the ECU and the valve can still operate but it's not actually doing anything.

My friends corsa kept having running issues once and cleaning up the throttle body always sorted it and eventually we plugged it in and found an egr error code (eml had been on for years but never read codes - not a car person) - so we blanked it - the code is still there obviously but the car runs great, better than ever before and now the intake doesn't get all coked up either so a win win.

Googling brought up a lot of threads on Vauxhall forums, seems it was common on a lot of petrol Vauxhall's and the general consensus is to blank it off, apparently Vauxhall even sell the blanking plate themselves as later engines had a blanking plate from the factory, with all this it does make me think it is kinda useless on a petrol engine other than reducing some NOx with the expense of gammy'ing your intake...

 

[blu73]

They are, from manufacturers view, for reducing NOx. The cooling effect, not really read about that but it's certainly not needed per say and if you look inside an intake of a modern diesel that's not even that old you'd be amazed how dirty they are. Particularly if you look inside say a panda or cinq fire engine i.e. petrol engine without egr, they are clean as a whistle if they have been looked after.

I am sure if it weren't for the emissions benefits cars just wouldn't have egr at all.

Not sure I see the point of turning it round when blanking though. Is it something to do with not getting an eml? Are the blanking intake side or exhaust side? I suppose if you blank inlet side and then let the egr vent the exhaust gases into engine bay you may trick some older ecu that it's working and not get a code but not sure I like the idea of that myself.

 

[PuntoHowTo]

My 1993 Mondeo (petrol) had an egr system, I believe that's about the time they became required on all new cars along with catalytic converters and such.

One of the pipes broke on mine pumping exhaust gasses with lots of carbon monoxide out under the bonnet and gave me a terrible head ache for weeks before I found out what was going on.

 

[blu73]

most cars interior air intake systems are separate from engine bay for precisely that reason though, usually from scuttle and sealed off from engine bay - of course lots of gases in there will escape from the back of the bonnet right near there though. People who run them little filters on oil breathers have same problems - will never get why people run them