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Technical Panda 100HP no Hot air from heater?

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Technical Panda 100HP no Hot air from heater?

Daisyd said:
Hi all, my first post on here
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Hello and welcome to the forum. Sorry to hear you've got a problem.

Daisyd said:
...it sounds like it may now have a broken flap, but I'm not sure about that without dismantling the whole thing
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If someone has already tried an improvised repair and it hasn't worked, then your options are limited. Dismantling the heater box is a major job; most of the interior forward of the seats has to come out, along with both front doors - it's a day's work for an experienced mechanic and probably at least €1000 in labour alone if done by a fiat dealer. New replacement parts for the box are not individually available and a new heater box will cost you about the same again.

There's an independent specialist in the UK that can do the repair using secondhand parts for about £600-£700 all in, but with secondhand parts, there can be no guarantee that it won't happen again.

Someone recently repaired one using secondhand parts at home with the help of a mechanic friend and IIRC it took them a week :eek:.

It's a design weakness that potentially affects all 500's & Pandas with climate; AFAIK there is no way of checking the condition of these parts during a prepurchase inspection.
 
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Looks like I got well and truly screwed by the seller, a garage in Preston ... Too late to do anything about it now sadly.
 
i have repaired my girlfriends one. it is a fiddly awkward job, but not too bad.

works perfectly now. if it does go again, i should have enough plastic to do it 1 more time, but i shouldnt need too.

in hindsight, if you get one that is working ok. i would drill a hole down the centre of the spindle and screw it to give it strength and stop it snapping in the first place.

its not the garages fault, its just an inherent issue with the setup, poor design from fiat (surprise surprise).
 
dac69er said:
i have repaired my girlfriends one. it is a fiddly awkward job, but not too bad.

works perfectly now. if it does go again, i should have enough plastic to do it 1 more time, but i shouldnt need too.

in hindsight, if you get one that is working ok. i would drill a hole down the centre of the spindle and screw it to give it strength and stop it snapping in the first place.

its not the garages fault, its just an inherent issue with the setup, poor design from fiat (surprise surprise).
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Could you post up a photo of which part needs reinforcing?
 
Gavv8 said:
Could you post up a photo of which part needs reinforcing?
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not really as it is all glued together for the repair (just to hold it in place whilst reassembling, glue alone would never hold it for long).

if you remove the motor on the side of the heater box

watchdog-panda-heater-2_0.jpg


(it can be accessed from the driver side footwell, but is awkward), you will see the stub that the motor drives, that is what breaks due to constant twisting.

you can see the broken stub in the picture above, it is in the centre of the white bit.
 
Hi guys,

Unfortunately my 2008 100HP is undergoing the very repair detailed here. My struggle though is that the previous owner of my Panda had already identified this problem and removed the actuator and gears for the blend door flap and botched it with a bolt and nut in one position - HOT. So far I have struggled to find a spare actuator to buy and the gear to go with it. Does anyone have a part number they can share so I can have a better look online. Also does anyone know the process of calibrating the actuator once it's connected? I fear Im going to have to call around breakers to get what I need, but would rather a new part.
 
RickyRozay91 said:
Hi guys,

Does anyone have a part number they can share so I can have a better look online. Also does anyone know the process of calibrating the actuator once it's connected? I fear Im going to have to call around breakers to get what I need, but would rather a new part.
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We are told, the individual parts are not available. Have a look on here before doing any cutting but you may have to repair the broken shaft.
https://www.fiatforum.com/panda/298107-interior-temp-sensor-location.html

Option 1 -
Get a used 100HP heater unit and reinforce the weak part (before it fails) with a hot metal tag pushed through the plastic parts.

Option 2 -
Make a new metal shaft using the plastic parts as a pattern. I've not done it or commissioned such a thing, but worth considering.

Option 3 -
Fit a standard Panda Aircon heater and do away with the climate control. These don't have the thermostatic actuator with it's easy fail connecting tag.
 
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Hey all, first time poster. Had the exact same issue with my panda 2. I tried the metal fix but finding it hard to refit the motor as it is very tight on the top screw.

A shot term fix I'm using is to drill a screw (pictured) gently in so I can manually open the heater flap. I've attached a small handle on the screw which I can use to lock it on heat mode (not pictured).

It is a temporary solution until I figure out how to mount the motor without breaking my arms.

Hope this helps to understand the issue. I'll update once I do a permanent fix.
 

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Here is the image of the temp fix for this issue. I have forced the "flap" to the enabled position.

My observations for this issue

* The default position for the heater "flap" is to bypass the heater.

* It is very difficult or impossible to physically move the "flap" to heater mode if the fan speed is over 1/4. Which could explain the failures.

If you have a working climate controlled system you should avoid enabling the heater while the fan is on. The amount of torque required to change the "flap" is high which likely leads to the common failures we are seeing here.

* A dirty fix is to jam the heater "flap" in the on position (anti clockwise)
 

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Lapatroche said:
Hi
Many thanks for posting this - very useful and a real help!!

I have the same issue and am just about to try this repair. The thing I'm wondering about is how to make sure the flap is set to cold - on my car it's definitely cool but not certain it's at the minimum. I can't see any easy way to move it without the little plastic bit that's snapped off. Maybe I can move it with a couple of pins.

My other query was whether it is best to glue the metal to the actuator / broken bit, or whether it's possible to glue it to the flap (still with a metal strip/slot) so that it's held to the flap with both glue and the metal part? Maybe the broken bit is too small to melt / Dremel the metal bit to?

Thanks again

Lapatroche
(Blue 100HP)
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Just found out today that this has happened to my panda... Did you ever get a video together on the process of fixing it with the metal insert? Thanks.
 
Hi Lucio

I never did a video but did fix it - I made a small metal blade from an electrical connector, about 15mm long and 5mm wide and fitted this into the solenoid where the original plastic bit had broken off - it was quite a tight interference fit but I glued it with epoxy also. Then working upside down in the drivers footwell and after removing the plastic trims in the way of the heater's end, I then made sure the big plastic hot/cold air flap / drum in the centre heater console was turned to cold, set the heating to cold as well (so the solenoid would rotate to the cold position), and lined up the solenoid with the big plastic drum to get the position & angle of the new blade right. I then heated up a separate strip of metal that was the same width as the repair bit, 5mm wide, with a small blowtorch, holding it with Mole Grips / locking pliers, and then pressed it whilst hot into the flap. It melted a slot the same size as the new metal bit. You need to check the angle and position as you only get one shot at it ! I then wrapped the end of the new metal bit with some Duck tape to protect the plastic slot, and refitted it. It worked perfectly and has ever since.

Hope this helps - if you are stuck, please let me know. The alternative to repair is to get the centre heating housing out, which I read involves removing the dash, which needs the doors removing etc. so it's worth doing this repair. I think the repaired version is more robust then the original.

I still have my Panda 100HP; it's been off the road for a couple of years whilst I fixed the head gasket but it's back up and running now. Mine has done 175K miles, bought in 2011 with 9K and used daily until a couple of years ago. They are great cars IMO.

Best,

Lapatroche
 
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Lapatroche said:
The alternative to repair is to get the centre heating housing out, which I read involves removing the dash, which needs the doors removing etc. so it's worth doing this repair. I think the repaired version is more robust then the original.
Click to expand...

I did suggest swapping the heater unit for a manual control aircon heater. That's really not an easy fix as I had thought. the plastic dash comes out easily (there's a video on You Tube). But the welded steel scuttle support frame is bolted via the door openings meaning the doors have to come off the car for access to the bolts.

You then need a suitable manual control air-con heater unit, which makes the whole exercise uneconomic in time or money.
 
MrMagoo said:
The above is exactly what I did and if that was your idea then thank you very much.
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Thanks - the idea was not mine though, I found it posted from CCTG and just followed the guide !
 
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Lapatroche said:
Hi Lucio

I never did a video but did fix it - I made a small metal blade from an electrical connector, about 15mm long and 5mm wide and fitted this into the solenoid where the original plastic bit had broken off - it was quite a tight interference fit but I glued it with epoxy also. Then working upside down in the drivers footwell and after removing the plastic trims in the way of the heater's end, I then made sure the big plastic hot/cold air flap / drum in the centre heater console was turned to cold, set the heating to cold as well (so the solenoid would rotate to the cold position), and lined up the solenoid with the big plastic drum to get the position & angle of the new blade right. I then heated up a separate strip of metal that was the same width as the repair bit, 5mm wide, with a small blowtorch, holding it with Mole Grips / locking pliers, and then pressed it whilst hot into the flap. It melted a slot the same size as the new metal bit. You need to check the angle and position as you only get one shot at it ! I then wrapped the end of the new metal bit with some Duck tape to protect the plastic slot, and refitted it. It worked perfectly and has ever since.

Hope this helps - if you are stuck, please let me know. The alternative to repair is to get the centre heating housing out, which I read involves removing the dash, which needs the doors removing etc. so it's worth doing this repair. I think the repaired version is more robust then the original.

I still have my Panda 100HP; it's been off the road for a couple of years whilst I fixed the head gasket but it's back up and running now. Mine has done 175K miles, bought in 2011 with 9K and used daily until a couple of years ago. They are great cars IMO.

Best,

Lapatroche
Click to expand...
Sorry, it's not a solenoid, it's a small motor with a white gear, as shown in the post / images by CCTG earlier in this thread, whose instructions I originally followed.
 
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Hi to all! This is my first message. I own a 2007 100hp and i did the bend flap fix repair, but now, the climate control only blows hot air. The actuator seems to be working when i change the temp. I tried to turn off the climate control and the air continues to get hot. Any idea? Before the fix i only got cold air from the vents. Thx to all :)
 
DaveMcT said:
The actuators will work just fine. The problem is caused by the shaft failing between flap and actuator.
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The shaft has been repaired and working fine already. Before fixing it, it only blew cold air, now only blew hot :(
 
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