Fiat Ducato Maxi 2013 150bhp

Hi all,
Some kind “person” decided to help themselves to my van last week to go ram raiding!! The police alerted me and after recovering it from the poor office wall it was used to knock down, I cannot start it.

They smashed the barrel and I guess used a screw driver turn it over. When I collected it, it was still running and the police allowed me to travel 3 miles back home. This is did without issue. When I got home, I had to stall it, I then removed the battery.
The following morning I reconnected the battery and it would not turn over, nothing at all. The immobiliser dash light illuminates 2 seconds after I turn the ignition on, so I’m assuming that the way they broke in is related to the issue.

Can anyone please help, in trying to troubleshoot the issue.

Ignition code ring is around the ignition barrel so it won't be able to read the code
I'd looks into a replacement barrel and immobiliser barrels

Hi.

Sorry to hear that

If they just blindly smashed the lock.. how did they get it running?

Agreed the code reading aeriel is around the lock barrel..

Maybe the Keys chip is working in reverse?
Actually triggering the immobiliser..

chris3234 said:

Ignition code ring is around the ignition barrel so it won't be able to read the code
I'd looks into a replacement barrel and immobiliser barrels

Click to expand...

Thanks Chris,

Is that the ignition ring in the remains of the barrel (photo). Is there a transponder within the key? Is it possible to hold the key into the barrel and turn it over with a screwdriver?

Cheers

Rdav1s said:

Thanks Chris,

Is that the ignition ring in the remains of the barrel (photo). Is there a transponder within the key? Is it possible to hold the key into the barrel and turn it over with a screwdriver?

Cheers
View attachment 207352

Click to expand...

If the ring is still there hold the key against the side of the and lock and turning the key should start the engine if it's un damaged

But as above they shouldn't have been able to start the van by just breaking the ignition as the imobliser should stop that?

Was there any other damage to the van? Fuse boxes wiring ect? Or a stolen key?
Obd port been accessed?

chris3234 said:

If the ring is still there hold the key against the side of the and lock and turning the key should start the engine if it's un damaged

But as above they shouldn't have been able to start the van by just breaking the ignition as the imobliser should stop that?

Was there any other damage to the van? Fuse boxes wiring ect? Or a stolen key?
Obd port been accessed?

Click to expand...

They had broken the cover and accessed the fuse box below the steering wheel.i cannot see any tampering tho.
I only got one key when I bought the van, I’m sure that if this was used they would not have needed to smash the lock

Rdav1s said:

They had broken the cover and accessed the fuse box below the steering wheel.i cannot see any tampering tho.
I only got one key when I bought the van, I’m sure that if this was used they would not have needed to smash the lock

View attachment 207353

Click to expand...

Don't suppose the cover was off The obd port when you picked it up?



But looks like they used a laptop via diagnostic port to bypass the imobliser

chris3234 said:

Don't suppose the cover was off The obd port when you picked it up?



But looks like they used a laptop via diagnostic port to bypass the imobliser

Click to expand...

I literally drove it home and parked it up for 3 days before it went missing. From memory the fuse cover was loose. After the theft or was broken and thrown on the floor, so they defo accessed it. Is the diagnostic port the black one labelled MCD? If so, it was still covering the port when I collected it.

Isn't there a cutout somewhere which is triggered if there is a severe jolt i.e. accident ? Not sure if this cuts the engine immediately or prevents restart. If the van was still running it suggests the bump wasn't severe enough to trigger it, but probably worth checking out.

Anthony489 said:

Isn't there a cutout somewhere which is triggered if there is a severe jolt i.e. accident ? Not sure if this cuts the engine immediately or prevents restart. If the van was still running it suggests the bump wasn't severe enough to trigger it, but probably worth checking out.

Click to expand...

Probably electric usually reset by pressing the Indicator's in a certain pattern allthough it usually says something like fuel cut out active on the dash when it's been enabled

It looks to me that they used an electronic compromise device to start the engine via the diagnostic port, which is why they have accessed the fuse box area. Although that lets them start the engine, they still have to disengage the steering lock to be able to drive the vehicle, hence the forced damage to the ignition lock.

The electronic compromise devices are now becoming more widespread for Fiats. They work by hacking the manufacturer's key coding routines and fooling the immobiliser system into thinking that a correctly coded key is present, so allowing the engine s to start.

Some do this through a by-pass type hack, others hack in to the vehicle's key programming routine and effectively introduce a "new" key (although the key doesn't physically exist).

If yours was stolen by the latter method, your existing keys will all have been deleted during the programming hack and can't be re-used.

When you try and start it, presumably you are still turning the ignition lock with a screwdriver. Are you holding your key against the lock barrel at the same time? The transponder in your key needs to be very close to the transceiver aerial that sits around the lock for the signal to be read to deactivate the immobiliser.

But if that isn't working, then you may need to get new keys programmed as above.

Success

Thank you everyone for your advice.
The way I got it started was do as hold the key into the remains of the barrel and turn it over with a screw driver. This was and is still hit and miss. The dash light goes out every time the genuine key is in the barrel but it will not always start.

If I buy a new barrel, can I transfer what ever the part is that governs the immobiliser across.

Again, a massive thank you everyone

Rdav1s said:

Success

Thank you everyone for your advice.
The way I got it started was do as hold the key into the remains of the barrel and turn it over with a screw driver. This was and is still hit and miss. The dash light goes out every time the genuine key is in the barrel but it will not always start.

If I buy a new barrel, can I transfer what ever the part is that governs the immobiliser across.

Again, a massive thank you everyone

Click to expand...

Good stuff

Yes the 'aerial'is probably just a ring that clips around the lock barrel

Ive not done it on a modern ducato though..

So somebody may know different

varesecrazy said:

Good stuff

Yes the 'aerial'is probably just a ring that clips around the lock barrel

Ive not done it on a modern ducato though..

So somebody may know different

Click to expand...

It should be clipped to the ignition lock body with a wiring connector plugged into it, Just unclip it and swap it to the new lock assembly.

Rdav1s said:

They had broken the cover and accessed the fuse box below the steering wheel.i cannot see any tampering tho.
I only got one key when I bought the van, I’m sure that if this was used they would not have needed to smash the lock

View attachment 207353

Click to expand...

This sounds pretty high tech...to steal your van.

Maybe they scanned your transponder code or spoofed it.

If they bypassed your immobiliser, you would be able to start the car now.

Perhaps ask a Fiat dealer.
Please let us know. I think we would all like to know.
Could the crooks have switched your fob key or cloned it?

That is the modern method..

Audi RS owners have to fit mechanical devices.. because the electronics are no longer a barrier

IceVovo said:

This sounds pretty high tech...to steal your van.

Maybe they scanned your transponder code or spoofed it.

If they bypassed your immobiliser, you would be able to start the car now.

Perhaps ask a Fiat dealer.
Please let us know. I think we would all like to know.
Could the crooks have switched your fob key or cloned it?

Click to expand...

I have now changed the lock set. The antenna ring was intact so that clipped back on and the whole setup looks like new now. I changed the key in the transponder and it starts without issue.
Because the fuse box cover was forced open, I assume the accessed the diagnostic port to plug in their device.
Im not sure it was high tech, just some low life with a little bit of knowledge.
I’m in the process now of trying to figure out how to repair the rear end damage they have caused and adding some “real” security, that fiat failed to do.

Glad you have it sorted- must be a big relief for you. Any physical protection (hardened metal casing or such, will be very hard to do, and will never be 100% effective IMHO), so it looks like fancy electronics will ahve to suffice, maybe, perhaps an aftermarket developer taking up the challenge. Unfortunately, the crims are never far behind if there are ill gotten gains to be had.

Rdav1s said:

Im not sure it was high tech, just some low life with a little bit of knowledge.
I’m in the process now of trying to figure out how to repair the rear end damage they have caused and adding some “real” security, that fiat failed to do.

Click to expand...

It's high tech from the point of view of the hackers that reverse engineer the immobiliser cryptography and manufacture the compromise devices.

Not so high tech for the thief, who just plugs it in and waitrs 10 - 20 seconds for an LED on the device to change colour

A hidden breaker is probably the best, to a critical circuit like the fuel pump. If the courtesy light doesn't work and the whole van seems initially dead even better. Don't have to over think it, if it is not a pattern design they can plan for you would hope they give up and move on.
A mechanical device also, however, that would soon annoy me unless done elegantly and let's face it they rarely are.