Your views and possibly your help please

[jug]

I'm not saying it is fantastic but if they gave in to all these peoples demands then you would be paying about £10-15 a chicken just to keep the companies afloat

pretty much everything would cost ten times as much if the whingers had their way, either that or it wouldnt be available any more. we'd all be sitting in small boxes eating vegetables to minimise our impact on the environment. there would be no cars, no industry, nothing, just vegetables.

its very easy to find fault with the world, any prick can do that, but suggesting workable realistic solutions is far more difficult, and far beyond the ability of whingers. that is why whingers do not make decisions or have any real power, they just whinge.

 

[ThisBitterPill]

It has actually encouraged me to seriously consider adopting ex batt hens which i'm currently looking into

Good on you Dobby....My parents (well my mum!) are looking into getting some chickens...I will recommend the ex-battery hens route

As for the whole 'what they don't know about they don't miss' argument....That would be true if the conditions they were kept in, were free from pain, suffering and stress...And before certain people jump up and down saying they wouldn't eat if they were unhappy etc....

Many animals will eat as much as they can whenever it is available. Try putting bowl after bowl down for a dog....Most of them will eat until they are ill.

And think about what a lot of miserable people do when they are unhappy....EAT!

 

[Dobby]

pretty much everything would cost ten times as much if the whingers had their way, either that or it wouldnt be available any more. we'd all be sitting in small boxes eating vegetables to minimise our impact on the environment. there would be no cars, no industry, nothing, just vegetables.

its very easy to find fault with the world, any prick can do that, but suggesting workable realistic solutions is far more difficult, and far beyond the ability of whingers. that is why whingers do not make decisions or have any real power, they just whinge.

thats not very fair, at what point in this thread have i whinged??? Doesn't mean it doesn't concern me, the thread was simply an invitation for people who feel the same as me to join the campaign

It is quite possible for chickens to still be produced on a large scale but to be done in a way that doesn't cause pain and suffering to the animal

If you noticed no-one is trying to turn people veggie here, they are merely pointing out the advantages and humane treatment of free range

 

[ThisBitterPill]

pretty much everything would cost ten times as much if the whingers had their way, either that or it wouldnt be available any more. we'd all be sitting in small boxes eating vegetables to minimise our impact on the environment. there would be no cars, no industry, nothing, just vegetables.

If by whingers you mean people who actually give a damn about things then I'm glad to put my hand up. I wish the important things in life did cost 10 times more. Then perhaps people would actually value them, rather than just take them for granted.

its very easy to find fault with the world, any prick can do that, but suggesting workable realistic solutions is far more difficult, and far beyond the ability of whingers. that is why whingers do not make decisions or have any real power, they just whinge.

I think a lot of people could (and do) suggest workable realistic solutions, the trouble is, the people who make the decisions are usually driven by profit and are more interested in looking after themselves and their organisations.

 

[ThisBitterPill]

the thread was simply an invitation for people who feel the same as me to join the campaign

Your thread got lost in the fighting Dobby!

 

[Dobby]

Your thread got lost in the fighting Dobby!

yeah i noticed!!!

 

[Munkul]

As for the whole 'what they don't know about they don't miss' argument....That would be true if the conditions they were kept in, were free from pain, suffering and stress

they arent THAT badly off.... properly designed modern battery hen sheds have a space enough to move a little in, plus they have mesh floors, so no standing in faeces.

but im not saying you are wrong, obviously freerange hans have a much better life.
we used to and still do get ex-battery hens... they come with half of their feathers missing, a month and they look top notch!

but they still have a FAR superior life quality than slaves on ships.... :bang:

 

[H2DaE]

So based on the argument that 'if you've never had it you dont know what your missing' How would you feel if you if it was babies/children/humans kept like that? I know its not a likely scenario, but would be comfortable with it? I know (some ) humans brains are more complex than a chickens, however they still feel, they still have pain receptors, and being kept in those conditions they are still going to be unhappy.
I remember seeing a news story about a year ago about a teenage girl who'd been kept in a cupboard all her life by her crazy, religious parents, she'd never seen another human being, had no education, so is that ok? because she didnt know any different....

Was that little girl being bred for food though? Or was it just that her parents were nutters....

These chickens are being raised this way to provide affordable food for the human population

 

[Dobby]

they arent THAT badly off.... properly designed modern battery hen sheds have a space enough to move a little in, plus they have mesh floors, so no standing in faeces.

but im not saying you are wrong, obviously freerange hans have a much better life.
we used to and still do get ex-battery hens... they come with half of their feathers missing, a month and they look top notch!

but they still have a FAR superior life quality than slaves on ships.... :bang:

They don't have enough space to stretch their wings, their body weight often means their legs break, they are pecked at by other hens (this actually is a form of bullying)

Even if there is wire on the base of the shed it means their legs can break more easily as they get caught and as Sammi said they have less space than a sheet of A4

Slavery was abolished.....there's something to think about eh?

 

[jug]

thats not very fair, at what point in this thread have i whinged???

you didnt, nor did i say you did.

 

[Munkul]

They don't have enough space to stretch their wings, their body weight often means their legs break, they are pecked at by other hens (this actually is a form of bullying)

Even if there is wire on the base of the shed it means their legs can break more easily as they get caught and as Sammi said they have less space than a sheet of A4

Slavery was abolished.....there's something to think about eh?

lol you are completely right

only point i would raise is that most of the ones i have seen, have far more space than A4 (still bad, though)
oh, and i know someone who runs a chicken farm, there aint many broken legs there

and no i wasnt trying to say that slavery is ok!!

 

[Dobby]

we used to and still do get ex-battery hens... they come with half of their feathers missing, a month and they look top notch!

Ex battery hens would have been used for laying, they are de-populated when they are no longer any use to the farmer which is why they are re-homed

They have their feathers missing because of stress and of course after a period of normal living they are going to look top notch, doesn't mean they haven't been suffering

 

[Dobby]

and no i wasnt trying to say that slavery is ok!!

lol, didn't think for a minute that you were

When the birds legs break they can no longer feed and water themselves, they won't gain weight and are culled

This of course is for the birds bred for consumption, not for laying

 

[Munkul]

Ex battery hens would have been used for laying, they are de-populated when they are no longer any use to the farmer which is why they are re-homed

They have their feathers missing because of stress and of course after a period of normal living they are going to look top notch, doesn't mean they haven't been suffering

http://www.thepoultrysite.com/articles/217/moulting-a-natural-process

says it all really

 

[Magical Trevor]

Was that little girl being bred for food though? Or was it just that her parents were nutters....

These chickens are being raised this way to provide affordable food for the human population

Of course she wasnt bred for food, her parents were just nutters.

My point was, why is it ok for one species to cause that kind of suffering, when in another its condemed.

 

[Dobby]

Poultry scientists have bred chickens which grow fast. As they grow, their living space – smaller than an A4 piece of paper for each bird – gets more and more cramped as they near the end of their short lives. With around 17 birds packed into each square metre they have barely enough space to walk, preen themselves, stretch their wings or even turn around.

Such cramped conditions and rapid growth cause severe welfare problems. Chronic lameness is common – one third of chickens have difficulty walking without pain. The stress on their hearts and lungs can cause heart failure. About 5% die or have to be culled prematurely.

A typical chicken shed holds 40,000 birds…

They never set foot outside or see natural light…

They feed around the clock - with as little as one hour of darkness for every 24 hour period.

 

[Dobby]

http://www.thepoultrysite.com/articles/217/moulting-a-natural-process

says it all really

Baldness and Alopecia (sp?) there is a difference!

 

[Magical Trevor]

http://www.thepoultrysite.com/articles/217/moulting-a-natural-process

says it all really

Moulting and feather plucking are very different things though, ones a natural process, the other is a direct result from stress, guess which is which.

 

[Dobby]

http://www.rspca.org.uk/servlet/Sat...ampaignfacts&marker=1&articleId=1177591305965

Interesting reading on the life (or should i say unnecessary suffering) of a battery hen

 

[H2DaE]

Of course she wasnt bred for food, her parents were just nutters.

My point was, why is it ok for one species to cause that kind of suffering, when in another its condemed.

You can't really compare the two then...

One is the result of being born into a family with mentally ill parents and nobody benefits from this

The other puts affordable food on the table for thousands of hard up families in the UK

Unfortunatly for the chickens they are lower down the food chain than us...