What's made you smile today?

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

Many moons ago our utilities company was one of the first to fit Smart Gas and Electric meters. It was wonderful, and sobering, to be able to watch the consumption and cost of individual devices and made us very aware of cost saving - like, for instance, only boiling enough water for purpose so a cupful at a time if you're just making one cup of coffee and taking showers of shorter duration whilst turning off the water while you soap and then back on again to rinse off. We didn't think we were wasteful before but having the "live" consumption meter definitely helped us make savings.

Then all the rubbish with switching to get a better deal kicked in and as soon as we switched the smart meters went dumb so we had to do manual readings and email them (we've probably had at least four providers non of whom could remotely connect to our meters). What I hadn't realized until very recently is that the gas meter is battery powered (if I'd bothered to look it would have been obvious due to no wire going to it) and probably a good thing too from the safety aspect. So, a few weeks ago, the meter started behaving erratically and not always giving a reading when I pushed the button. I rang our present supplier (to whom we were recently moved due to our supplier going out of business) and they informed us that almost certainly this battery had expired. Rather surprisingly, the batteries cannot be replaced so a whole new meter is required! Anyway, the very pleasant meter fitter - who was subcontracted to our supplier - has just fitted us with new gas and electric meters. The gas meter again is battery powered and again can not have it's battery replaced when it runs out! I had a wee discussion with him about the waste in doing this but he said that probably by the time the battery runs out, if not before, we will need to change it anyway because the communication protocol (G3/G4 just now I believe?) will have moved on by then and this new meter won't work with the new one (maybe G5?) I had read about this a couple of weeks ago so wasn't surprised to hear this but what a waste? My old meter was working just fine it was just that the communications side of it had failed.

And, to cap it all off, having fitted the new meters, he started clearing his tools away into his van and turned to say goodbye. But hold on, don't we get a usage display so we can see what we are consuming? Oh, sorry, said he. We're out of stock of those just now. We're hoping to get more soon and when we do someone will come out and sync it to your meters. If you haven't got one within about a month then Email your supplier and ask about it. I've informed them that I haven't supplied one with this installation. So what's the problem I asked (we were looking forward to concentrating on making further savings in advance of the humongous bills which are shortly going to be coming) I believe it's to do with the shortage of chips/brexit and container availability he said.

So there we are, quite pleased with our new Mini Meters - the gas one in particular is much smaller and looks "lost" in the old cabinet - but disappointed we don't have a new monitor to "frighten" us.

 

[Eklipze3k]

<snip> I had a wee discussion with him about the waste in doing this but he said that probably by the time the battery runs out, if not before, we will need to change it anyway because the communication protocol (G3/G4 just now I believe?) will have moved on by then and this new meter won't work with the new one (maybe G5?) I had read about this a couple of weeks ago so wasn't surprised to hear this but what a waste? My old meter was working just fine it was just that the communications side of it had failed.<snip>

I work for the company that supplies the smart meters for the north of the UK - all the way from Doncaster to Shetland, so I can provide a little insight into this if you're interested.
The first generation of smart meters (SMETS1) were bought individually by the suppliers (British Gas, etc) and used whatever mobile network they could get the best deal on. They were never designed with network switching in mind, so as you experienced they go dumb as soon as you move from the supplier who bought it.
SMETS2 meters (provided by us - Arqiva - for the North, and Telefonica for the South/Central regions) are designed specifially to be able to switch suppliers, so you won't have this issue again. The Telefonica ones use their mobile network as they have great coverage down that way anyway, we built our own proprietary network to cover the North as we already had a lot of the infrastructure in place anyway (our main business is TV and radio, so we own and operate pretty much every mast). The battery in the GSME (Gas Smart MEter) is designed to last 15yrs, the electric smart meter obviously runs off the mains.
Oh, and just to clarify we/Telefonica actually only supply the part called the comms hub which sits atop the electric meter, the meters themselves though are made to a standard that both of us have agreed upon, so could theoretically work with either comms hub, just that an Arqiva comms hub wouldn't work south of Donny as we have no network coverage down there. The comms hub talks to our network, and to the meters, and to the in-home display (once you get one). We then pass all the reading data, etc back to your supplier - securely of course

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

I work for the company that supplies the smart meters for the north of the UK - all the way from Doncaster to Shetland, so I can provide a little insight into this if you're interested.
The first generation of smart meters (SMETS1) were bought individually by the suppliers (British Gas, etc) and used whatever mobile network they could get the best deal on. They were never designed with network switching in mind, so as you experienced they go dumb as soon as you move from the supplier who bought it.
SMETS2 meters (provided by us - Arqiva - for the North, and Telefonica for the South/Central regions) are designed specifially to be able to switch suppliers, so you won't have this issue again. The Telefonica ones use their mobile network as they have great coverage down that way anyway, we built our own proprietary network to cover the North as we already had a lot of the infrastructure in place anyway (our main business is TV and radio, so we own and operate pretty much every mast). The battery in the GSME (Gas Smart MEter) is designed to last 15yrs, the electric smart meter obviously runs off the mains.
Oh, and just to clarify we/Telefonica actually only supply the part called the comms hub which sits atop the electric meter, the meters themselves though are made to a standard that both of us have agreed upon, so could theoretically work with either comms hub, just that an Arqiva comms hub wouldn't work south of Donny as we have no network coverage down there. The comms hub talks to our network, and to the meters, and to the in-home display (once you get one). We then pass all the reading data, etc back to your supplier - securely of course

Thanks Eklipze, that was very interesting. Just for your interest, here's a couple of pictures of the installed meters.

 

[Eklipze3k]

Tidy

 

[Rocinante]

Eklipze,
If Jock had not called to chase up the supplier that his meter was causing issue, would a flat battery have resulted in no gas being registered as used, until the new meter was replaced ?

 

[Eklipze3k]

Eklipze,
If Jock had not called to chase up the supplier that his meter was causing issue, would a flat battery have resulted in no gas being registered as used, until the new meter was replaced ?

If he'd stayed on the old SMETS1 meter then yes, it wouldn't have been picked up until someone came out to physically read the meter.
With SMETS2 the Comms hub will inform the Supplier if it loses Comms to the gas meter, and they'll contact the end customer to confirm if it's faulty, etc.

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

Eklipze,
If Jock had not called to chase up the supplier that his meter was causing issue, would a flat battery have resulted in no gas being registered as used, until the new meter was replaced ?

Now that's an interesting thought. So what you're asking is does the meter require a battery to record gas consumed?

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

Oh, and there's the answer. Thanks Eklipze.

 

[Eklipze3k]

Now that's an interesting thought. So what you're asking is does the meter require a battery to record gas consumed?

I'm not 100% on the function of the actual meters themselves, but my assumption is that it wouldn't record units used if the battery is dead.
For what it's worth, the meter also reports its battery level to the Comms hub so if it gets below a certain level the supplier will likely arrange replacement before it expires.

 

[Rocinante]

Jock, You might have been a bit proactive in reporting your faulty meter, if your meter wasn't recording your gas use, that would definitely have maximised your savings, never mind a new display.

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

Jock, You might have been a bit proactive in reporting your faulty meter, if your meter wasn't recording your gas use, that would definitely have maximised your savings, never mind a new display.

Oh yes, Think I missed a "trick" there - Ha Ha!

 

[s130]

Oh yes, Think I missed a "trick" there - Ha Ha!

Only problem with this trick is that the supplier will apply an estimated usage reading.

I had this with a water meter. In my case there was a water leak on the meter output (tree roots growing into the joint) and as I was regularly recording water usage I noticed this going up. Eventually the water company replaced the meter and then estimated what I probably used in reality had there not been a leak. This estimate was way too high and I had to challenge and supplied them with years worth of usage data, worked out a fair IMHO estimate which they subsequently accepted and then refunded me for units which were lost and billed to me.

 

[Cheest]

Finished a job early yesterday. The flight home today was around 5:30 pm and I really, really didn't want to spend all day in Newark, New Jersey if I didn't have to. I got on a stand by flight at 12:30 pm AND got a first class upgrade. Okay, Qantas domestic coach beats US domestic first class hands down. That should give you an idea what US domestic couch is like and why I like those upgrades.

 

[Popitinpete]

Eklipze,
If Jock had not called to chase up the supplier that his meter was causing issue, would a flat battery have resulted in no gas being registered as used, until the new meter was replaced ?

The old rumour was to put a strong magnet on the wires to 'slow' the pulse and record less usage, old wives tale me thinks

 

[AndyRKett]

The old rumour was to put a strong magnet on the wires to 'slow' the pulse and record less usage, old wives tale me thinks

I have no background in electric meters but used to work for fluke and we used to make a design a lot of clamp meters (not the ones you or I would buy, but the one car manufacturers use on production lines)

So I’m no expert on domestic power supplies, but I assume any digital electric meter would use some sort of inductive coil to read the current through the main feed and then calculate from that the power used based on the voltage.

As a clamp meter works by measuring the change in the magnetic field and not just by measuring magnetism you could put as big a magnet as you want on it and it’s not going to do anything. I suppose theoretically if you could create an sinewave generator that opposed that of the mains AC, then get this close enough to the pick up for the meter, theoretically you could influence the way it reads but you get the timing wrong and you’ll make you meter go faster.

So yeah a magnet is going to be an old wives tale, there are things you could do (all of which would be illegal) but it’s been an interesting thought experiment

 

[Popitinpete]

I have no background in electric meters but used to work for fluke and we used to make a design a lot of clamp meters (not the ones you or I would buy, but the one car manufacturers use on production lines)

So I’m no expert on domestic power supplies, but I assume any digital electric meter would use some sort of inductive coil to read the current through the main feed and then calculate from that the power used based on the voltage.

As a clamp meter works by measuring the change in the magnetic field and not just by measuring magnetism you could put as big a magnet as you want on it and it’s not going to do anything. I suppose theoretically if you could create an sinewave generator that opposed that of the mains AC, then get this close enough to the pick up for the meter, theoretically you could influence the way it reads but you get the timing wrong and you’ll make you meter go faster.

So yeah a magnet is going to be an old wives tale, there are things you could do (all of which would be illegal) but it’s been an interesting thought experiment

Cr@p, typical, ive got a nice big strong magnet sitting around somewhere.. What a waste

 

[AdamFiat]

Someone complimented my Seicento

 

[Cheest]

Lucky score at the annual Chicago Winter Bike Swap today.


Even though I was never very good at it, I have a soft spot for track bikes. The above is an upper atmosphere seventies Gitane with 531 tubes, Campy BB, and Tange fork and headset. The second fork is the original. It's old enough to have French threading. I also have a Gitane Tour de France road frame from the same era in the same color.
I'll have to dig in my stash and see what I have on hand to build up an easy riding fixed gear bike.

 

[puntofan01]

Having missed the compactness of my Samsung Galaxy S3 Mini ever since it died over 4 and a half years ago, and having not managed to find a worthy replacement for it in that time, after watching a MrMobile review on YouTube some time ago, I finally decided to treat meself to a Unihertz Jelly 2 at the start of the year. I've had it for about 4 weeks now, and it's absolutely perfect for what I want.

We had a 14 year old lad helping out at work today, and as he's been brought up with the huge, bland, "slab" smartphones of the current trend, I was curious to see what he'd make of my Jelly 2. His reaction involved the sentence "What the f**k?!" being uttered several times, lmao!! He seemed unable to get his head around the facts that a) it's my only phone; and b) it's a completely normal specification smartphone, just in a much more hand and pocket friendly size, lol!

 

[The Panda Nut]

Wiring fixed. Outside light was tripping constantly last week. Cable was burried in the wall 30 years ago. All carefully marked at the time. All the cables removed and replaced yesterday and fnished off today in a dry hour. Thankfully all sorted with a new outside light fitting and low power bulb to boot. one tiny split in the outer seems to be the cause. Odd that inspite of much wetter times its chosen a dry spell to fail.