General Twin Air - How bad?

[nikcoleman]

Is the TwinAir as problematic as I'm seeing? I've god 4 Pandas now, and I've been looking at a TwinAir with a blown head gasket - just curious, but from what I'm seeing that looks like new engine time? Yikes. The technology of the TA is mighty impressive, as are the power figures but it looks like it's a wholly disposible item? Just curious!

 

[Bonefish Blues]

TA engines are wonderful, won't hear a word agin 'em.

TA engines are an utter liability, won't touch 'em.

Truth's somewhere in the middle, I guess, but there are some truths such as TAs being (particularly?) susceptible to poor service routines - adhering at least to the letter of the Fiat regime in terms of fluids and intervals is key.

 

[varesecrazy]

Is the TwinAir as problematic as I'm seeing? I've god 4 Pandas now, and I've been looking at a TwinAir with a blown head gasket - just curious, but from what I'm seeing that looks like new engine time? Yikes. The technology of the TA is mighty impressive, as are the power figures but it looks like it's a wholly disposible item? Just curious!

Is it a blown gasket, or a failed Multiair?

LOW compression could be either..

 

[nikcoleman]

Is it a blown gasket, or a failed Multiair?

LOW compression could be either..

No idea, I ws looking on CoPart and it's marked up as 'blown head gasket' so just out of curiosity I looked into it.

 

[Panda IIs]

No idea, I ws looking on CoPart and it's marked up as 'blown head gasket' so just out of curiosity I looked into it.

Just as likely CoPart don't recognise its just two cylinders! TA engine runs to its own beat

 

[Panda IIs]

Just as likely CoPart don't recognise its just two cylinders! TA engine has runs to its own beat

But more usefully (perhaps) UniAir fail essentially makes it run on one cylinder (in my experience) so swapping coil packs plugs etc has no effect, it might drive but horribly and requires much slipping of clutch to get going. If this is the case and has been the case for a while anticipate a new clutch.

I had all these issues which were incorrectly diagnosed by a local workshop...

 

[boozyjay]

I currently own two T/A Pandas, and have owned four in total. I've never had an issue with any of them and they are the most reliable cars I've ever owned. When buying used I have always purchased one with a full Fiat service history as I know they are very oil specific. Mine are serviced by my (brilliant) local Fiat dealer and if any parts need changing due to wear and tear, I always get them done.

I've always said, If you look after the car, it will look after you.

 

[The Panda Nut]

TA engines are wonderful, won't hear a word agin 'em.

TA engines are an utter liability, won't touch 'em.

Truth's somewhere in the middle, I guess, but there are some truths such as TAs being (particularly?) susceptible to poor service routines - adhering at least to the letter of the Fiat regime in terms of fluids and intervals is key.

"I never open the bonnet, and never have it serviced"
" I have a full service history and give it lots of TLC"
We have both ofg these approaches in the same household. None of the women would ever check anything, never top up the oil and never book a service. I anticipate once im dead and gone they will fiond out the hard way that my way was better.
I think the TA is likely as reliable as anything else and the people on here with over 175,000 miles under the belt suggest it too. As you say though the power from this tiny twin cylinder engine is staggering and there is a cost for that. It must be hard on many components and being turbcharged very hard on oil. The state of the oil after 5 or 6 thousand suggests this is true and Im happy to see mine done at anything above 5 thousand mile intervals. As you say if there is a reasonable history of oil changes then with luck, like with any other car it will be good. The head may change OK if its not been hammered to death after gasket failure but if it has, it will be problematic. So I agree with you.
Fiat used to say 18,000 mile service interval but reduced it to 9,000 around 2016 ish. I shall do mine at a maximum of 6000. I also allow turbo cool down if its been towing a lot of weight or after a long run, but in my view this is just sensible if you want to keep the car a long time.I like the TA as its quite diesel like pulling with great strength from lower revs, but others (AlD for 1) clearly like to rev the nuts off them and make them fly. I find thats an expensive way. But of course great fun in the short term.

 

[jrkitching]

Is the TwinAir as problematic as I'm seeing? I've god 4 Pandas now, and I've been looking at a TwinAir with a blown head gasket - just curious, but from what I'm seeing that looks like new engine time? Yikes. The technology of the TA is mighty impressive, as are the power figures but it looks like it's a wholly disposible item? Just curious!

Buying a TA with a known major problem from copart isn't for the feint hearted; but if the price is right, you've strong mechanical skills and the good luck fairy is on your side, it could work out well.

I guess it's all down to your skills, facilities and appetite for risk. The scarcity of decent overhaul documentation for this engine would be my biggest concern personally.

And some of the parts that may be required aren't cheap.

 

[porta]

I like mine…it gets serviced with the right, approved, fluids, filters…as for the multiair was there any progress on the guy that was stripping one to see if he could source serviceable parts, there’s got to be a way

 

[varesecrazy]

I like mine…it gets serviced with the right, approved, fluids, filters…as for the multiair was there any progress on the guy that was stripping one to see if he could source serviceable parts, there’s got to be a way

You mean taking a Twinairs
"Uniair module"
apart to see what is actually wearing?

As I said a while back,
the Multiair (4cyl) was a prime candidate for "recon units",
but in the 10 years this has looked a viable business, I've yet to come across one..

The 4 cyl got serious attention from member BurrowsDeano

Who summised the units were sound and it was a Gasket failure as the most likely cause.
Instead of a £1000 Multiair unit and Gaskets, the "standard fix"..

Only the Gaskets were changed, with the same result


Somebody on here recently (@Tropicalmike?)
Took a failed Uniair apart and saw evidence of wear..

 

[porta]

You mean taking a Twinairs
"Uniair module"
apart to see what is actually wearing?

As I said a while back,
the Multiair (4cyl) was a prime candidate for "recon units",
but in the 10 years this has looked a viable business, I've yet to come across one..

The 4 cyl got serious attention from member BurrowsDeano

Who summised the units were sound and it was a Gasket failure as the most likely cause.
Instead of a £1000 Multiair unit and Gaskets, the "standard fix"..

Only the Gaskets were changed, with the same result


Somebody on here recently (@Tropicalmike?)
Took a failed Uniair apart and saw evidence of wear..

Yes sorry…I’m all confobbulated

 

[nikcoleman]

Buying a TA with a known major problem from copart isn't for the feint hearted; but if the price is right, you've strong mechanical skills and the good luck fairy is on your side, it could work out well.

I guess it's all down to your skills, facilities and appetite for risk. The scarcity of decent overhaul documentation for this engine would be my biggest concern personally.

And some of the parts that may be required aren't cheap.

Doing my checkist: Buying from CoPart, veteran, price is right, check, strong mechanical skills, oh oh, running out of talent here, good luck fairy, very much so. Therefore on consideration lol I may pass on this Panda that I absolutely do not need....

https://www.copart.co.uk/lot/52471555/clean-title-2015-fiat-panda-cros-wolverhampton

 

[Bonefish Blues]

A Panda dies to give life to others...

 

[The Panda Nut]

Yes sorry…I’m all confobbulated

Just as long as your Uniair isnt we are all good!

 

[The Panda Nut]

Doing my checkist: Buying from CoPart, veteran, price is right, check, strong mechanical skills, oh oh, running out of talent here, good luck fairy, very much so. Therefore on consideration lol I may pass on this Panda that I absolutely do not need....

https://www.copart.co.uk/lot/52471555/clean-title-2015-fiat-panda-cros-wolverhampton

As a fellow addict I say go on buy it, youn really do need it.....

 

[Bonefish Blues]

As a fellow addict I say go on buy it, youn really do need it.....

These may be needed.

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