Tuning turbo time!

[craigb244]

First in class and 6th overall (out of 22 which is a mix of autotest and autosolo)

What also dont help my video is my car is nearly silent.
and the rear arb nearly all the body roll so it looks like im on a gentle Sunday drive

 

[craigb244]

glowie manifold anyone? camera (quite rightly so) filtered out most infrared but it was a very deep cherry red.

effects of about a mile of WOT county lane driving

 

[fingers99]

You should see them on the dyno -- be interesting to put an ir thermometer on them, but often well past orange.

 

[craigb244]

You should see them on the dyno -- be interesting to put an ir thermometer on them, but often well past orange.

Yeah it will be on the dyno soon just a little more tweaking then ill get the map fine tuned.

I have a IR thermometer. I pointed it at my old 8v manifold after a good run and it said HI

 

[blu73]

You should see them on the dyno -- be interesting to put an ir thermometer on them, but often well past orange.

I have an IR thermometer, not thought of using it on my engine before... good call sir.

What brand is yours craig?

edit: just checked the specs on mine, -30 to +300 °C.. How hot do we think a cherry red manifold gets???

 

[fingers99]

Too hot for your thermometer! This looks worth bookmarking!

 

[blu73]

way way too hot

 

[craigb244]

I have an IR thermometer, not thought of using it on my engine before... good call sir.

What brand is yours craig?

edit: just checked the specs on mine, -30 to +300 °C.. How hot do we think a cherry red manifold gets???

not sure on the brand but it is an expensive one (its gun shaped thing with a laser on it)

cherry red of stainless is about 800 (bit higher then steel from fingers link)iirc.

I dont think our IR thermometers would even read at idle temps


you know when a manifold is truly hot when you start seeing ionization of the air around it

 

[craigk]

at least you wont be stuck for a cooker when electricity/gas goes

 

[blu73]

I dont think our IR thermometers would even read at idle temps

I will try sometime.. gotta admit i was a little disappointed when i checked the specs.. Its fine for checking AirCon running temps though which is what i have it for

 

[fingers99]

I will try sometime.. gotta admit i was a little disappointed when i checked the specs.. Its fine for checking AirCon running temps though which is what i have it for

An easy way to check for a misfiring cylinder, too, if you start from cold and can point it right at the top of the manifold.

I was talking to a Greek guy who'd charged an Alfa 1600 -- fuelling was so far off that he managed to melt two EGT sensors, and they're usually Inconel. Manifold and engine survived, though.

 

[craigb244]

lol dam right.... if im ever driving somewhere far im definatly going to wrap a few spuds in foil and leave wedge them in my manifold before i leave

 

[blu73]

Mmmmm oily potatoes.. proper man food

 

[craigk]

or maybe make up something to hold a chicken, and along with your potatos you would almost have a roast dinner

 

[craigb244]

Mmmmm oily potatoes.. proper man food

oi my car dont leak

it does work tho... when i was a kid (baaaaah) dad used to drop a couple on the exhaust manifold of hes rangerover (iirc) when ever we went on holiday.

I dont know if its genius or just been tight tho

 

[Karolis]

What lsd do you have craig?

Also, where are the news? You turbo makers have your own fanclub...

Sad for mukul, bad things

 

[craigb244]

What lsd do you have craig?

Also, where are the news? You turbo makers have your own fanclub...

Sad for mukul, bad things

quafie

no news as such.... car is running great. just been tweeking the fuel maps and trying to set up idle control which is being a pain haha

managed to damage my exhaust on a back road in town so now the car fills with fumes if I'm In traffic with the heaters on (think I have cracked my pigeon **** weld on the downpipe)

all thanks to a manhole that's was much higher the the road surface....

yeah really gutted for munkul. :-(

 

[Karolis]

I was thinking about all that big work made on standard pistons.

Why you didn't used a decompression plate? There's a concrete reason or you just wanted to try the "your way"?

For reducing compression on the 16v there are only two ways: custom pistons (big money) and decompression plate (less money). Also there's "your way" but it's a bit scary for all the people apart you

No "cheap" tricks like 16v pistons on 8v engine block.

Also, is there a lot of difference between 8v and 16v rods? All the 16v block should be more reliable for big power, but is there really so big difference?

I read somewhere that 16v rods are almost the same for the tjets, so they should be strong. Is the crankshaft strong too?

I also know that the 8v and 16v cranks are different, is it true?

 

[fingers99]

For reducing compression on the 16v there are only two ways: custom pistons (big money) and decompression plate (less money). Also there's "your way" but it's a bit scary for all the people apart you

There is a third way -- shorter rods. This would also allow (in a seriously reconfigured, built to blast, engine) bigger ring lands.

Also, is there a lot of difference between 8v and 16v rods? All the 16v block should be more reliable for big power, but is there really so big difference?

The 16v block is no more rigid except for the brace on the mains. The rods are, if anything, spindlier and less rigid than 8v ones and especially the 1108 ones (but then, so are most things). Everything leads me to the conclusion that the material is the same.

I read somewhere that 16v rods are almost the same for the tjets, so they should be strong. Is the crankshaft strong too?

People who have been inside the T Jet and the n/a 1.4 tell me they're very different. The T Jet is said to be safe to 200bhp. Munkul will tell you that the rods in the n/a engine certainly are not. All the predictions were that the rods would go first. I've heard that the crank is different, but this information is slow to filter down -- it represents money to those who know.

 

[craigb244]

I was thinking about all that big work made on standard pistons.

Why you didn't used a decompression plate? There's a concrete reason or you just wanted to try the "your way"?

For reducing compression on the 16v there are only two ways: custom pistons (big money) and decompression plate (less money). Also there's "your way" but it's a bit scary for all the people apart you

No "cheap" tricks like 16v pistons on 8v engine block.

Also, is there a lot of difference between 8v and 16v rods? All the 16v block should be more reliable for big power, but is there really so big difference?

I read somewhere that 16v rods are almost the same for the tjets, so they should be strong. Is the crankshaft strong too?

I also know that the 8v and 16v cranks are different, is it true?

There is a third way -- shorter rods. This would also allow (in a seriously reconfigured, built to blast, engine) bigger ring lands.




The 16v block is no more rigid except for the brace on the mains. The rods are, if anything, spindlier and less rigid than 8v ones and especially the 1108 ones (but then, so are most things). Everything leads me to the conclusion that the material is the same.



People who have been inside the T Jet and the n/a 1.4 tell me they're very different. The T Jet is said to be safe to 200bhp. Munkul will tell you that the rods in the n/a engine certainly are not. All the predictions were that the rods would go first. I've heard that the crank is different, but this information is slow to filter down -- it represents money to those who know.

Right.... The reason I went machined pistons is because i cant afford forged(as i said id get some ive i needed some but just cant justify that kind of money on a crappy old fiat that will never be a winner in anything ) and also I love engineering. If you haven't noticed I always attempt stuff just to prove to myself i can do it (whats the fun in buying off the shelf?)
how many people can say they machined there own pistons im sure people would be far more impressed by that then someone saying "yeaahhh i had mine custom made by *insert expensive tuning company* for £800.
and hey... they cost me maybe 80p in electricity to make and about 2 hours of my time and they (so far touch wood) have done over 1000miles and one event and are still holding up


reason I never went for decompression plate is the fact you loose the squish band which is VERY important for efficiency. and a good squish band really can massively reduce the chance of detonation (think of it like clapping you hands. the air (fuel mixture) is squashed between a ring on the piston and head and forced into the center which causes a massive amount of final mixing and turbulence which stops hot spots.

also I forces the mixture away from the piston rings which again protects a known weak spot of any engine.


Shorter rods also loose the squish and lead to higher con rod angle which means more force on the rods and higher side loading on the pistons and cylinders.

I have fiat log on the t-jet engine (Cant release it im afraid) and it has a full strip down of the engine including differance between it and superfire 16v engines (these are the newer 16v engines with the alloy block extension)

And I can say that the T-jet uses the same rods as the 1.2/1.4 16v n/a engines

main internal differences are
Valves... exhaust are sodium filled inlets.... normal
pistons.... obviously.
Crank.... forged.


I agree with fingers that the mk1 16v blocks are no stronger then the 8v blocks (they just had a little crappy ladder across the mains.)

But the new 16v bottom ends will be massively stronger. that half alloy thing is a really big solid lump of alloy that braces the whole bottom end. not just some weedy alloy brace.

just look at amount and size of the bolts that hold it externally to the bottom of the block!