Technical Seicento 1.4 16v Project

[randomizered]

https://www.fiatforum.com/panda-classic/98552-1368cc-16v-classic-panda-100hp.html

ditch the carb and dizzy if you ask me....its not a standard car anymore so why keep it?! Just a pita.

 

[EvilJaxx]

Aaron,

Dont know if you remember but back in this thread somewhere we had a small discussion about the Panda 100HP vs Suzuki Swift Sport...

Nothing major said but you mentioned that it felt a level higher than the Panda 100HP and not just a grand more expensive.

Well I took your word for it and left it at that and also decided to take one for a test drive which happened about 2 days ago at my local Suzuki dealer.
I had the car for about 4 hours and it was a pre re-registered Silver Swift Sport with 1845 miles on it so I would say run-in.

I gave the car a good thrash about and within 4 hours had consumed £15 of fuel (I had to put that in myself) ... So about the car!? It wasnt anything over expected and I have to say comparing it with a Panda 100HP in many ways I feel that the Panda comes out ontop!

The handling and performance was on par with the Panda 100HP and both feel amazing but that then asks the question why is the Swift insurance group 9D (I know its a 1.6 16v but its added weight of 1105 Kg makes it alot heavier than 975 Kg of the Panda 100HP) bearing in mind I have a GSR kit on mine. I must also add when you really hang the swift sport into country road bends the back end feels rather unpredictable and I cant help but feel that the Goodyear Eagle F1's are the only thing keeping it in shape... What happens when they wear down abut
Brakes where less snatchy than the Panda 100HP which I liked... Alot! Clutch good, same bite position as the Panda 100HP but the 5 speed gearbox was a let down with long gears which gave a boring feel of power delivery although same as the 100HP hold revs at 4000 RPM and full throttle gives a lovely push back!

Away from the obvious, the interior was, reasonable with some nice touches, although I was not keen on the "sports" seats as they where too flat and didnt hold me in place much. The chrome rim around the dials is such a NO NO NOO!!! Looked so cheap but I loved the 6'Oclock rev guage!

Overall both these cars are great little warm hatches (supermini's) and to grade both Id be thinking something along the lines of;

Performance: Swift Sport 7/10 Panda 100 7/10
Brakes: Swift Sport 9/10 Panda 100 7/10
Suspension/Handling: Swift Sport 9/10 Panda 100 9/10
Style Exterior: Swift Sport 8/10 Panda 100 8/10
Style Interior: Swift Sport 6/10 Panda 100 8/10
Seats: Swift Sport 5/10 Panda 100 7/10

I feel the major problem with the Swift Sport is simply, its a £10,000 car (like the Panda 100HP) with a £11,500 price tag and over expensive insurance make it harder to get for younger drivers!!

Regards

Adam

 

[J333EVO]

Not a bad appraisal, though having been in both I would say the Swift is the nicer car inside, and as for handling well the report from Performance Tuner mag is that the Panda didn't even handle as well as the Ignis far too much understeer and the Swift is supposed to be have moved on from the Ignis being a newer model. You say the rear end moved but that what makes a good car balanced, these days of predominately understeer safe cars that get produced are in all, boring, I'd say that you were probably going in too deep lifting off and then scaring yourself as rear moved, but that's what made so many small French hatches and even the MK1 Golf so much fun to drive and leave there rivals in there wake, the rear end communicated to you what it was doing rather than just watched the front wheel scrub wide and then follow round the arc of the bend.

I think the Swift Sport looks better outside too, much more purposeful as it sits lower and squatter and the twin exhausts & 17" multi spoke alloys look ace, don't get me wrong the Panda looks great, but it has 5 doors which is never going to look as sporty on a small car, more like a grown up town car than sleek city slicker, and well in red one of these cars does look like Postman Pats van, albeit the coolest postie van about

The Panda gets lots of criticism for its very poor ride quality, the long termer in Top Gear and EVO have cited this in almost every issue saying that speed bumps are approached with tight buttocks as the car bounces over them rather than ride them, seems like too hard springs not enough damper to me.

I think both cars are brilliant warm hatches, they just go about there objective differently.

PS insurance ratings are decided on repair costs of a bonnet, wing, cross member and headlamp to access how much to repair the most common accident damage in UK corner to corner bump IIRC, along with other criteria like performance, desirability to thieves etc

In any case, both of them are a bit slow compared to the Seicento 16V, 108bhp 810kgs as weighed by us gives 134bhp per/ton :devil:

The next true performance Fiat hot hatches are going to be the Abarth versions of the Punto and 500, I can't wait for those, I know Emma's dad is eagerly waiting as he sees the Punto Abarth as being a possible replacement fro the Ibiza Cupra R.

 

[EvilJaxx]

Nice reply... As for the handling I doubt it was me getting scared but more getting use to ESP

I guess its simply a matter of opinion on which is better but in my eyes there was a lot wrong with the Swift that wasn’t on the Panda 100HP and then there where things on the Swift that felt better than the Panda but mainly styling factors as you mentioned the low ride, exhausts and alloys are an improvement over the Panda but I really disliked the interior!

Anyway not to matter anymore as the Panda 100HP goes next week (maybe) as I am going for an HGT Punto Swift slayer

Cheers

 

[foxyemx]

Little update on my seicento, gone a bit wheel mad recently with two bargain buys for both cars in one week
But i'm so glad with the results!

emz

 

[jamie86]

Stop using up your neighbours drive









Looking good btw

 

[CinqyAbarth]

those wheels on the seicento are lovely, i was watching them. Such a nice Seicento.

 

[J333EVO]

Stop using up your neighbours drive

Pics were taken at Emma's Dads house, so the drive is all his, thought you mau have spotted that due to the very different back drop in th epic from our house

 

[jamie86]

Pics were taken at Emma's Dads house, so the drive is all his, thought you mau have spotted that due to the very different back drop in th epic from our house

So it is should of noticed there weren't any burning cars and gangs of hoodies in the pic with houses everywhere

 

[charlie_chinq]

very nice mate, good work.

 

[elaborazioni rossogialle]

Last year i got hold of a 1368 16v complete engine and gearbox for a project. It is believed to be a first in the UK, putting this engine into a seicento sporting.
For those who don't know this is the same engine used in the brand new panda 100hp fire engine, but my particular engine was taken out of a stilo with only 8k on the clock.

So since buying the engine i've been slowly finding parts needed to make this work, i've bought....
1. Supersprint stainless steel manifold
2. Emerald ecu
3. Inlet manifold off a Mk1 punto 16v
4. Throttlebody off a MK1 punto 16v
5. 15" compomotive Mo alloys.
6. Punto GT complete front & rear brake setup.
7. Induction kit.
8. Water temp gauge by Raid
9. Oil temp gauge by Raid

The plan is to convert the fly by wire to the cable operated system, hence the need for MK1 punto 1.2 16v parts. My dad (Jon) has made up a plate to mount coil packs on, as shown in pics below.

We are also using the 6 speed gearbox, and converting it to cable operated from hydrolic.

The 1.4 engine is in that was the easy part, but not connected up yet (hence the mess lol). The challenge will be to sort all the wires to connect to the emerald ECU.
Pics of the progress so far.....

The Car- Seicento Abarth 51 plate.

The Engine 1368 16v done only 8K

Before

Engine coming out 21/01/07

Its out

emma.

hi there!!!
hi from salonica greece!
i want to do your project (seicento 1368 16v -engine starjet)
now is a 1242 16v with 86 hp
but....i want a help!
your manifold supersprint is with code 814401
for the models fiat
1) punto sporting mk2 με τον 1242 16v with engine FIRE and 80 hp and...
2) punto sporting mk2b with the engine 1368 16v FIRE and 95 hp
also
3)bravo-a 1242 16v FIRE
and
4)stilo 1368 16v FIRE

at the supersprint site i find a different code for the engine 1368 16v STARJET
FOR THE MODEL grande punto 1.4 16V year 2006 (STARJET)
the code manifold is 815401
for the model panda 100hp with the engine 1.4 16v year 2007 (STARJET)
the code manifold is 815501

3 different codes...3 different manifolds...
for my seicento project...i want to know the right code (manifold)
thanx
and sorry for my english real bad!!!

 

[elaborazioni rossogialle]

and another question...

...the engine is it the same for the models fiat?
(grande punto & panda 100ps)
so why 2 different codes for the same engine?
(815401 & 815501)

 

[jug]

hi there!!!
hi from salonica greece!
i want to do your project (seicento 1368 16v -engine starjet)
now is a 1242 16v with 86 hp
but....i want a help!
your manifold supersprint is with code 814401
for the models fiat
1) punto sporting mk2 με τον 1242 16v with engine FIRE and 80 hp and...
2) punto sporting mk2b with the engine 1368 16v FIRE and 95 hp
also
3)bravo-a 1242 16v FIRE
and
4)stilo 1368 16v FIRE

at the supersprint site i find a different code for the engine 1368 16v STARJET
FOR THE MODEL grande punto 1.4 16V year 2006 (STARJET)
the code manifold is 815401
for the model panda 100hp with the engine 1.4 16v year 2007 (STARJET)
the code manifold is 815501

3 different codes...3 different manifolds...
for my seicento project...i want to know the right code (manifold)
thanx

3 different codes are for 3 different applications, but all 3 fit the same 1368 16v head. i would imagine you can use all 3 on your sei, but i personally would want to use the one that makes it easiest to join the sei exhaust to the manifold.

which do you think woud be easiest to use?

this is 814401

this is 815501

this is 815401

to me, the last 2 look the same, but the first one 814401 is shorter and noly has 1 lambda hole. i would expect 814401 would be easier to use on a sei.

 

[ChrisUK]

and another question...

...the engine is it the same for the models fiat?
(grande punto & panda 100ps)
so why 2 different codes for the same engine?
(815401 & 815501)

The Panda 100hp is different to the Grande engine. Its the same basic engine but the GP has a Phase variator on the inlet camshaft (similar to the 1.8HGT / Alfa Twinspark engines) although its for economy rather than performance and a EGR system which makes it emit lower emissions and make it more economical.

 

[randomizered]

814401 has two lambda holes as well....to confuse matters more I have one fitted to mine, as does emma. You can see the bosses in the photo.

The grande is called the starjet isn't it? See Dave's thread on teh differences, as he bought one.

Cheers,

Kristian

 

[jug]

814401 has two lambda holes as well....to confuse matters more I have one fitted to mine, as does emma. You can see the bosses in the photo.

i can only see one in the photo, i must be blind

 

[randomizered]

The SS photo is wrong. Looks at emma's photo, 2 bosses on it

 

[jug]

The SS photo is wrong. Looks at emma's photo, 2 bosses on it

yeah you're right. the one in emm's pics looks exactly the same as the pic for the 815401 & 815501, so i bet all 3 are the same.

 

[elaborazioni rossogialle]

so??? is better for my starjet (grande punto) engine the manifold code 814401 ???

fiat idea (the engine where i fount) have the same engine starjet like grande punto isn't it? (code 815401)

 

[jug]

so??? is better for my starjet (grande punto) engine the manifold code 814401 ???

all 3 are the same so it makes no difference.

fiat idea (the engine where i fount) have the same engine starjet like grande punto isn't it?

yes, same engine.