Technical Punto Jerking

[smokeme]

dukeboxer was actually right, so far it was always erratic fuel pump pressure or erratic pump voltage (typical fiat bad grounds )

another possible cause is a faulty tps sensor

 

[kellyprescot]

I have had my mk 2 W reg punto (45,000 miles) now since jan this year, and it has given me and my mother (We share) nothing but trouble.

4 days after a bought it off a private seller, the clutch went while parked up on a car park (thank god!). Ended up having the clutch/brake fluid running all over the car park, as i believe something had snapped?

Then, in may, i started experiencing some juddering with the car, although it was not too bad back then. I noticed that it was when the car ws cold and on less than half a tank.

Then, about three months back, the engine temp warning light starting coming on and off. Also, the heating was not working and the fan would stay on for about 3 mins after turning the engine off. After my grandad topped up the water and oil and every other fluid going, and bleeding the radiator because of possible airlock, it seemed to be driving really well. But a week later the warning light was back on.:bang:

Then, about two months ago, on a dual carriage way, i noticed that my car would not go about 60 mph. Even with my foot to the floor. Got to a roundabout and had to stop, when my car stalled and completely lost power. Believing my driving had caused it to stall, i tried re starting, only to find my car would not turn over and was making a horrible coughing sound when turning the key! I had to get pushed by two police officers, who then kind of kick started the car.

After getting a mechanic to have a look, he said the head gasket and water pump had gone. He replaced the water pump, head gasket, and thermostat. We now have it back, and since breaking down, it has not been the same. It revs without touching the pedal, and the judering is so bad, you have to strap yourself down with the seatbelt and hold on for dear life!

If anyone could shed any light on what is happening with my poor car, i would be very grateful.

 

[Car nut]

When they put your new water pump back in and cambelt on they have set the timing up wrong they did it to me its one tooth out. The should sort FREE of CHARGE.

Mechanics are fecking useless :slayer:

Best place for a Punto is in the classifieds there a money pit i got rid

 

[smokeme]

I have had my mk 2 W reg punto (45,000 miles) now since jan this year, and it has given me and my mother (We share) nothing but trouble.

Don't complain about a car that you buy and have no maintenence done on it.. Don't eat, drink or take a dump for a week and then tell me about how YOU feel

4 days after a bought it off a private seller, the clutch went while parked up on a car park (thank god!). Ended up having the clutch/brake fluid running all over the car park, as i believe something had snapped?

Blown slave cylinder, a great example of lack of maintenance.. Fluid should be changed every 2 years otherwise it gets contaminated with water and will blow the slave or master cylinder..

you were lucky it wasn't the brakes that failed

Then, in may, i started experiencing some juddering with the car, although it was not too bad back then. I noticed that it was when the car ws cold and on less than half a tank.

Classic example of a pouros intank fuel hose or a clogged fuel pump strainer..

Then, about three months back, the engine temp warning light starting coming on and off. Also, the heating was not working and the fan would stay on for about 3 mins after turning the engine off. After my grandad topped up the water and oil and every other fluid going, and bleeding the radiator because of possible airlock, it seemed to be driving really well. But a week later the warning light was back on.:bang:

For people that know little about cars, the user manual specificly states when the temp light comes on STOP the car and take it to a mechanic.. overheating the car will lead to a blown headgasket/warped head and eventually a scrap engine..

A car does NOT have water anywhere, unless it's replacing washerfluid for the glass..

Then, about two months ago, on a dual carriage way, i noticed that my car would not go about 60 mph. Even with my foot to the floor. Got to a roundabout and had to stop, when my car stalled and completely lost power. Believing my driving had caused it to stall, i tried re starting, only to find my car would not turn over and was making a horrible coughing sound when turning the key! I had to get pushed by two police officers, who then kind of kick started the car.

If the car won't turn over DON'T try to push start it, reason was a hydrolock due to a blown headgasket.. Best of chances you got a warped head, worst case a bent rod..

After getting a mechanic to have a look, he said the head gasket and water pump had gone. He replaced the water pump, head gasket, and thermostat. We now have it back, and since breaking down, it has not been the same. It revs without touching the pedal, and the judering is so bad, you have to strap yourself down with the seatbelt and hold on for dear life!

If anyone could shed any light on what is happening with my poor car, i would be very grateful.

headgasket was a result of the overheating..
water pump is the result of using water, it's supposed to use coolant...
thermostat is also the result of using water..
timing belt should have been done at the same time as well..

reving without touching the pedal is a symptom for a few different problems, most likely in your case is an intake leak somewhere which will also cause juddering..

----------------------------------------------
To everyone else...

Most common cause of judder on the mk2 punto is..

Bad idle stepper motor..basically creates an intake leak, usually noticed up to 2500rpm as bad judder..

warped flywheel..judders almost everywhere, most noticiable in high load/low throttle situations..

 

[sidewinder77]

Hi,
I seem to have developed a problem that belongs here.

A few weeks ago I had a full service, at a garage highly recommended on here, on my 00 W 1.2 Punto, I also had new front brakes (pads and discs) and some new exhaust.

Since then I started with a problem of a slight misfire while the car was idling a trip back to the garage, apparently this was caused by the spark plugs/leads arcing some adjustment seems to have sorted this.

However now if you accelerate hard(ish), particularly up a hill the engine seems very lumpy/jerky, in all gears. I am going to take it back into the garage but would appreciate some tips as to what I should be looking for.

From reading this thread the main (possible) culprits seem to be things like the throttle position sensor, ecu, idle control valve, fuel sensor, ignition coil is this it or are there more to have on the list (I may have mentioned some things twice by different names, my knowledge of car parts is slightly shakey)?

Any tips/possibilities gratefully appreciated, the car is needed for commuting!

 

[DaveMcT]

Why bother faffing. Take it back to the garage who did the service. Dont wait or you might screw up the exhaust cat.

 

[sidewinder77]

I am taking it back asap, I just find it useful if I myself have a vague idea of what the possibilities might be.

 

[kellyprescot]

The mechanic who fixed the blown head gasket is coming back tomorrow to replace the thermostat because apparantly the one he fitted is faulty . And yet he still gave me the car back.

And the car has had a service and we did have the car checked when the engine temp warning light came on, though the mechanic we saw said just to top up the coolant (water as he ACTUALLY called it) and bleed the radiator. Which we did. Solved the problem for all of A WEEK. I'm beggining to think mechanics are money grabbing leeches who liike to act smart and pretend they know what they are talking about.

Going to tell him tomorrow to fiix it pronto or he aint getting no more money offa meee!!

 

[smokeme]

The mechanic who fixed the blown head gasket is coming back tomorrow to replace the thermostat because apparantly the one he fitted is faulty . And yet he still gave me the car back.

And the car has had a service and we did have the car checked when the engine temp warning light came on, though the mechanic we saw said just to top up the coolant (water as he ACTUALLY called it) and bleed the radiator. Which we did. Solved the problem for all of A WEEK. I'm beggining to think mechanics are money grabbing leeches who liike to act smart and pretend they know what they are talking about.

Going to tell him tomorrow to fiix it pronto or he aint getting no more money offa meee!!

there ae mechanics and pretenders

 

[micky69]

You thought about checking the clutch? Looking at other replies no one has mentioned the clucth. Although your car isn't that old have you done alot of miles? my stilo JTD 53 plate has had it's 2nd clutch at 79,000m . . . mine was jerking on and off, over revving etc.... new clutch... been okay since!!!

 

[Cinqster355]

Old thread ressurection...

I wanted to post up as this is a long thread so I wanted to reward readers with a definitive solution to the jerking issue. I have had 2 MK2 1.2 8v Puntos, my current car is a 2004 MK2b and that jerked badly.

Symptoms to clarify - Decelerating in lower gears would result in jerking, accelerating you could feel the car hesitating, not miss firing just struggling to rev hard, something was holding it back.

Solution after changing the usual items like plugs and leads etc (those did not cure it), £10 Ebay secondhand throttle body, the faulty item was the throttle position sensor but it was cheaper to buy the whole thing secondhand rather than a new TPS for £15.99.

If you have the same issue, changing just the T.P.S. is a simple job, no special tools needed (they are available but not really needed), a drift or blunt flat blade screw driver and a small hammer, gently tap the old one out and fit the new one (after disconnecting the battery).

My car now runs 100%, complete cure :slayer:

 

[fingers99]

There is not one problem which causes (clumsily phrased) "jerking". Therefore, there is not one definitive solution.

If only life were that simple. Throttle Position Sensor should come up on a code read.

 

[Cinqster355]

There is not one problem which causes (clumsily, phrased) "jerking". Therefore, there is not one definitive solution.

If only life were that simple. Throttle Position Sensor should come up on a code read.

Agreed, some of this thread talks about clutches, those posts are confusing a jerking with a judder (they are not the same, I know, my car did both at one point until I replaced the totally fubar clutch) ! LOL. There could and will be other reasons but its not easy if you dont have a reader but a good sense of what it could be, oh and the fact I read the old posts!

Anyway its important to weed out the posts and highlight the ones that have success like my repair, that being almost the cheapest way to go and was a cure in my case.

 

[ralphnz]

Is the TPS the thing that talks to the accelerator pedal or is that the stepper motor?

 

[smokeme]

Is the TPS the thing that talks to the accelerator pedal or is that the stepper motor?

wow, you dug up a very old thread..


yes TPS is what gives the ecu the position of the throttle butterfly.


as for the thread, the most common issue of the jerk/misfire its a blown coil pack that takes out the coil drivers in the ecu.. needs a repaired ecu and new coil pack, just one or the other and it ends in failure again.


anyone that is good at soldering can easily change the transistors in the ecu, very cheap repair to diy, expensive to send out. Some are lucky and just have a bad connection but most its a blown transistor(s). only real trick is opening the ecu without damage.

 

[Mr Clock Radio]

I have something similar.
16V 1242cc.
Sometimes, between 10,000 and 25,000 rpm, at any speed or gear, accelerating or slowing, there is no power and engine firing is lumpy.


For example, from standstill, push the pedal quite hard, expecting fast acceleration - and nothing, almost like wind is out of the sails. Holding the pedal where it is or pushing it further down doesn't get it out of the flat spot. Engine Failure comes on and engine symbol stays on.


Have removed lamda sensors and same problem - and same errors on dashboard.


New plugs/air filter and leads. Checked all hoses for leaks.


Taking foot off pedal and then back on pedal and coaxing it up to 25000rpm ,and then BOOM - off we go.


Any ideas?

 

[flisko]

fastest way to see whats bothering your car is to plug it to a computer and check for errors, and you can go from there, unless you got another car just for spares you can start replacing most obvious parts coil packs, spark plugs, ht leads

 

[smokeme]

I have something similar.
16V 1242cc.
Sometimes, between 10,000 and 25,000 rpm, at any speed or gear, accelerating or slowing, there is no power and engine firing is lumpy.


For example, from standstill, push the pedal quite hard, expecting fast acceleration - and nothing, almost like wind is out of the sails. Holding the pedal where it is or pushing it further down doesn't get it out of the flat spot. Engine Failure comes on and engine symbol stays on.


Have removed lamda sensors and same problem - and same errors on dashboard.


New plugs/air filter and leads. Checked all hoses for leaks.


Taking foot off pedal and then back on pedal and coaxing it up to 25000rpm ,and then BOOM - off we go.


Any ideas?

first step in you case is getting those codes read.

 

[Mr Clock Radio]

OK. Well after a few drives to warm and back, the lunging and flat spots have gone. The Lamda Sensors are still out. It looks like one or both is faulty.
It feels altogether quite normal, it just doesn't have quite such a torquey kick.
I've read somewhere that if the ECU is reset you need to drive it slowly for half an hour, revs below 4k - so the ECU can 'relearn' the sensor settings.


Is this true?


My question is, has my ECU relearnt using current settings - and not using faulty numbers from the possible faulty Lamdas?

 

[h2ypr]

Slight resurrection of this thread.

I've read all the posts (139 I think) and there is some interesting thoughts.

I've cleaned my throttle body with no effect (maybe slightly better throttle response).

I'm gonna try and clean the map and idle control valve. This car was sitting for a while so imagine it's needing a good clean.