Panda 2012+ Panda raid, what do you think?

[porta]

Looks class.

What tyres are fitted?

The only proper off road tyres in Panda size that I've been able to find so far are Ziarelli Mud Power, which look good and I've heard ok things about, but wow are they expensive to get hold of in the UK.

There are many more options than ziarelli, (but you can get them inported for £70 a tyre try eBay)
Maxsport
Sarek
Evogravel
Insa
And there’s a Colway copy that I can’t remember the name of

 

[The Panda Nut]

Here's something I wrote on Dual mass flywheels 10 years ago:-

One of the major issues all the manufacturers have is the dual mass flywheel (DMF) which seems to need to be replaced every time that you need a clutch and that puts the price of clutch replacement up to around £1000 which on a car that has probably done in excess of 100,000 miles will probably make it uneconomical to repair. So the first thing to understand is what a dual mass flywheel is designed to do. The dual mass flywheel is an aid to making the gear change on your car lighter and more positive while also making the engine and gearbox smoother and quieter. So how does it work, in order to make an engine smoother you need to increase the mass of the flywheel but as you do this the mass of the gear train effectively becomes less as a proportion of the total mass that is in motion and you will get noise, rattles and vibration from the gear train, in order to get around this you would traditionally have increased the mass of the gear train which in turn would mean that the synchro's (the brake that matches the speed of the gears that are about to be engaged) also had to become stronger and therefore the gear change becomes heavier and more agricultural. To get around this you have to increase the mass of the gear train without increasing the mass of the gears, this is done by splitting the flywheel into two separate masses (hence the name 'dual-mass flywheel'), one mass that is attached directly to the engine and one mass that is attached directly to the input shaft of the gearbox, these two halves are then separated from each other by a damper which stops the natural vibration of a large high capacity, high compression engine being transferred to the gearbox.

So how much trouble are dual-mass flywheels and when are they worn? Well if you own a Peugeot 407 2.0l diesel you may well find that you need a new one every 20000 miles or less while on Alfa Romeo's they seem to last well part 100,000 miles without trouble, I can almost feel the engineers amongst you bristle at this next comment but bare with me, and even with this sort on mileage on them they can often go again (not best practice) as long as there is only slight tangential rotation in the secondary mass relative to the primary mass, however, if there is any free play axially it should be replaced, however on later cars they have a fully floating dual-mass flywheel with internal clutch adjustment and that is almost impossible to assess the wear on it. These late flywheels also need special tools to stop them from adjusting up while you are doing gearbox repairs so beware!

Large high compression engine.... like tge TA LOL. Thats a great explanation.
Youbdid my Panda last week and the only thing I can see wrong with its old dmf is slack in the axial damper. Not loose orvfailed, just not a smooth action loose in the midle and damped aftervabou 5 degrees rotation. My car is however back to A1 its as smooth as silk and I am happy. Double thanks!!
Do you have any explanation for the mooing noises that accompanied reversing up the ramp into my garage. My clutch release looked ok but I cant see any other cause of this noise.

 

[The Panda Nut]

We have found that with the race cars that removing the DMF will kill a gearbox in one or two races!

Is this the racing bit or do you think it would do a road car?
In any event Im glad my dmf is done. Cross it only lasted 32k but I can tell you the effect of a new one is profound.

 

[The Panda Nut]

However... Im not sure a Panda is going to do much raiding... May be a kiddies birthday party raid. Quite the thing for raiding steep hills in snow though!

 

[DaveMcT]

I have a 2009 (169) Panda Multijet 70bhp with the original solid flywheel, strangely spaced 5 speed gearbox and 145,000 miles. It's quite raw to drive but pretty cool.

My brother has a 2012 (312) Panda Multijet complete with DMF flywheel and better considered gear ratios. This is smoother to drive and I would love to have the gears in my multijet. I also much prefer the 75 mapping as it's not got such a nasty flat spot below 2,100 rpm.

Both will eventually get mapped (give or take 100bhp). That said, I'm not so sure how long my gearbox (with solid flywheel) would last.

 

[Herts Hillhopper]

However... Im not sure a Panda is going to do much raiding... May be a kiddies birthday party raid. Quite the thing for raiding steep hills in snow though!

You might be surprised…
Take a look here (older 169 4x4, ‘gently’ modified: https://www.instagram.com/thepanda4x4

 

[The Panda Nut]

You might be surprised…
Take a look here (older 169 4x4, ‘gently’ modified: https://www.instagram.com/thepanda4x4

 

[The Panda Nut]

You might be surprised…
Take a look here (older 169 4x4, ‘gently’ modified: https://www.instagram.com/thepanda4x4

I know they can do stuff but I wonder how much damage gets done. I have given mine a workout when we were cut off by floods cutting through a green lane to get home. I was staggered it ploughed through nearly up to the top of the wheels liquid mud at one point. That was a mile a 2 wheel drive would not have got through. Not too good for long life of the main family car though so Im not making a habit of it.

 

[Jamie KC]

So its been lifted 30mm, widened by 60mm, the tyres are proper mud tyres and it has a winch, just in case. Working on a snorkel ATM.

Widened meaning wheel spacers I assume. Is there any advantage to using wheel spacers on one of these on the road?

I'd imagine the slightly wider track may mean extra stability, which the 4x4 isn't known for in standard trim (mine rather lolls from corner to corner when driven enthusiastically along the lanes!).

Any disadvantages to tyre wear or steering feel?

 

[Herts Hillhopper]

I had a chance to see this in the flesh this morning... certainly looks very purposeful
Sadly it wasn't the loan car while my 4x4 is being serviced though...
I might take more of a look later when I go to get mine back

 

[Bonefish Blues]

Widened meaning wheel spacers I assume. Is there any advantage to using wheel spacers on one of these on the road?

I'd imagine the slightly wider track may mean extra stability, which the 4x4 isn't known for in standard trim (mine rather lolls from corner to corner when driven enthusiastically along the lanes!).

Any disadvantages to tyre wear or steering feel?

You can fit 185s, rather than the 175s of the regular 4x4s (10mm spacer)

 

[Jamie KC]

You can fit 185s, rather than the 175s of the regular 4x4s (10mm spacer)

Nice. I've found 16mm options, but don't want to go that wide as the studs I have allow for 10mm. Anyone know if the 10mm spacers are available as hubcentric? On some cars 10mm isn't deep enough to get a hubcentric spacer for...