Technical Further Dualogic Query

[DavyP]

Hi,all.
I've seen on here ,somewhere, how to clear air from the clutch actuator, but can't find it at the moment. The contributor suggested a method of changing the hydraulic oil ,by disconnecting the return pipe and pumping the clutch actuator with the gearbox in Man and the ignition 'on' but engine not running. The thing is, according to the M20 gearbox manual ,the return pipe is a preformed rubber tube, and ,no doubt, it will probably be damaged when removing it , as the connectors have a push on locking type connector.
I can't see Fiat selling these pipes, as I presume the smallest part sold will be the whole selespeed unit. Has anyone replaced this pipe with any other tubing ? and ,more importantly ,pipe diameter? and did it work?
Thanks in advance for any info.

 

[Bergi]

Hi, it may have been me who suggested that simple and effective way to change the synthetic ATF fluid. I have had the return pipe off and on without damage, its softish rubber and is not under any fluid pressure. If you needed to you could re secure it with a screw type jubilee clip.

Bergi

 

[kompica]

Hi, it may have been me who suggested that simple and effective way to change the synthetic ATF fluid. I have had the return pipe off and on without damage, its softish rubber and is not under any fluid pressure. If you needed to you could re secure it with a screw type jubilee clip.

Bergi

Hello
Please could you mark me return pipe on picture?

Is it easy to remove return pipe without braking reservoir pipe?

Is it possible to pump fluid out through the cap on top and how?
i tried with 5-6mm pipe but i couldnt push pipe down, its was stuck on top?

Thanks

 

[koalar]

Disconnect return pipe and open the door

You can't properly fill the system without software

After the system has primed by opening the door the level should be at minimum

 

[kompica]

Disconnect return pipe and open the door

You can't properly fill the system without software

After the system has primed by opening the door the level should be at minimum

View attachment 463286

I try first with that method to disconnect return pipe at the bottom of pump.
I try to unscrew pipe with wrench 11 but it was stucked and i couldn't move it 1mm. I used wd40 and didnt help.

Then i try to remove reservoir and to unscrew one torx screw that hold reservoir.
Then i tried to move reservoir pushing it down and I couldnt move it. I didnt use to much pressure as i am scared to brake reservoir.
Is there any other screw beside that one torx that hold reservoir ?

Could i change it to remove pipe on top and film container?

Or from that tiny whole on top to pump out by pump and pipe?


Thanks for help

 

[koalar]

If you can't undo the pipe with a proper quality brake flare spanner

It's probably a job best left to a mechanic, before thing gets rounded and turns a simple job into a nightmare

 

[kompica]

If you can't undo the pipe with a proper quality brake flare spanner

It's probably a job best left to a mechanic, before thing gets rounded and turns a simple job into a nightmare


View attachment 463289

Didnt know that type of wrench exist.

I had in mind to cut the middle of wrench (o-type) with a grinder and than try to undo pipe.

But now when i know that it could be bought here its better to buy.

I found little different type of wrench Here in local shop and attched picture Here. Is it good that type of wrench or better to buy something Like you send ?

I couldnt find here in Croatia, Rijeka any mechanic that Work anything with dualogic or similar gearbox.

Official mechanic here change only whole unit.

Thanks for help
Regards.

 

[koalar]

Didnt know that type of wrench exist.

I had in mind to cut the middle of wrench (o-type) with a grinder and than try to undo pipe.

But now when i know that it could be bought here its better to buy.

I found little different type of wrench Here in local shop and attched picture Here. Is it good that type of wrench or better to buy something Like you send ?

I couldnt find here in Croatia, Rijeka any mechanic that Work anything with dualogic or similar gearbox.

Official mechanic here change only whole unit.

Thanks for help
Regards.

It's the same spanner as for the brake system

Comes under several names, brake flare spanner or wrench being the most common

Quality matter here, picture above was just an example

You want I nice tight fit as the unions are quite soft and are easy to round

Cheap eBay or china probably isn't the way to go, from memory LASER branded ones are okay in the cheaper range

I have acquired several over the year there's 0.1mm variation in size

 

[kompica]

It's the same spanner as for the brake system

Comes under several names, brake flare spanner or wrench being the most common

Quality matter here, picture above was just an example

You want I nice tight fit as the unions are quite soft and are easy to round

Cheap eBay or china probably isn't the way to go, from memory LASER branded ones are okay in the cheaper range

I have acquired several over the year there's 0.1mm variation in size

I Will try to find Here better quality then unior. If i dont find i Will buy unior and try.

Thanks for advice

 

[kompica]

It's the same spanner as for the brake system

Comes under several names, brake flare spanner or wrench being the most common

Quality matter here, picture above was just an example

You want I nice tight fit as the unions are quite soft and are easy to round

Cheap eBay or china probably isn't the way to go, from memory LASER branded ones are okay in the cheaper range

I have acquired several over the year there's 0.1mm variation in size

I made by myself two brake flare spanner by cutting with grinder middle of wrenches.
One longer wrench is China, and other shorter is professional Porsche. Return Pipe width is 5.8mm and i cut 6mm.

When i get time and good weather i Will try it.

Many thanks

 

[DaveMcT]

I have an imperial flare nut spanner that's a perfect tight fit on Panda brake pipes. My metric often slips so only gets used for quickly spinning down the threads.

 

[kompica]

I try to unwind return pipe with brake flare spanners that i made and didnt managed to unwind. Wrench 11 was big and and slip down.

Next time i Will try to grind standard wrench 10 to fully fit without any space.

 

[jackwhoo]

Grinding a slot in a 12 point ring spanner is unlikely to work - it didn't for me.
A 6 point flare nut spanner has thicker stronger sides to prevent spreading

 

[kompica]

Grinding a slot in a 12 point ring spanner is unlikely to work - it didn't for me.
A 6 point flare nut spanner has thicker stronger sides to prevent spreading

If i find somewhere 6 point spanner i Will buy it and try.

But easiest way for me to change fluid would be to Open cap on top od reservoir.
Pump out cca 0.5l and fill with pump 0.5l New fluid. Close cap, shift gears few minutes and then after deppresurizing do the same with another 0.5l.

But problem is that i cant push pipe down to bottom. I try many times with different width pipes and all stuck right under the cap.

Is it safe to drill the hole in that filter under the cap and suck fluid out?

Thanks

 

[koalar]

Just buy the correct spanner

You then have it for life

Your making things difficult for yourself

Brake flare spanners are thicker and wider all round, to stop them spreading

Most combo or ring will be too weak once they are cut open

This

Vs

We are heading down a path, that has the potential of turning a simple job into a nightmare in my opinion

 

[kompica]

Just buy the correct spanner

You then have it for life

Your making things difficult for yourself

Brake flare spanners are thicker and wider all round, to stop them spreading

Most combo or ring will be too weak once they are cut open

This


View attachment 463780



Vs


View attachment 463781


We are heading down a path, that has the potential of turning a simple job into a nightmare in my opinion

I bought correct spanners and when i get time i Will try it.

Thanks for help.

 

[kompica]

I have changed robot oil Today. Brake spanner 11 fit perfect and i have unwind without problem.

Then i drain out 0,4l by opening door. And fill 0.4l New CS speed fluid.

Then i shift speeds few minutes n,r,1 to mix fluid and wait for fluid to fill reservoir another 4 hours then i repeat same procedure. Drain 0.4 from reservoir and fill 0.4new fluid and close cap.

Then i made clutch drain 3 Times and end of Line calibration with alfaobd.

Its not necessary because there was no error when i change fluid and gearbox work but i do anyway as its recommended to extend robot lifetime.

Then i made test drive around 20km and all was ok.

I am satisfied that i made by myself

I Will change fluid every 20 000 km with same procedure.

 

[koalar]

Well done on sorting it