Technical Fuel Vaporisation... and Ethanol fuel..

[Bigvtwin996]

Well some people have often experienced poor hot starting, often put down to fuel vaporization.... Given how hot other countries I for one wonder if this is really the case.......

However a comment in another thread regarding the move to 10% Ethanol fuel in the foreseeable future prompted me to do some geeky research along the lines of something I had heard....
We know the effects of Ethanol on fuel lines, but what happens when we move to 10%? I had heard that there were "anti Ethanol" additives, but these are quite expensive and could push up yur fuel price by up to 30%...

Reading on one of the Classic car sites.. something like the Association of British Classic cars or similar (I am sure some one will know the exact site)... I found an interesting little snippet (also a listing of the materials affected by the Ethanol addition)... The various additives to modern fuel lower the boiling point considerably, thus potentially causing potential vaporisation, so moving to 10% would aggravate this further....
However an interesting solution could exist.....
Not exactly legal in terms of fuel taxation...
10% addition of Kerosene, apparently raises the boiling point....
too much Kerosene has detrimental affects.....

If I can find the article I will post a link or if anyone else can please post...
Could be a useful thing to try....
Perhaps a long term Fiat 500 tester may have a look...

If people worry about Kerosene, remember many Air-planes fly on it and their engines are a bit more sensitive than Fiat 500s...

Here you go... a worthwhile read..
https://www.fbhvc.co.uk/fuels

 

[chris3234]

Only jet/turbine engines run on kerosene quite different to a fiat engine
Smaller piston and block type engines tend to run on avgas as it it a lot easier to ignite
Kerosene doesn't do well in spark ignition engines



Avgas also still uses tetraethyl lead and I'm sure you don't want that back in you car fuel

 

[Bigvtwin996]

...........
Smaller piston and block type engines tend to run on avgas as it it a lot easier to ignite
Kerosene doesn't do well in spark ignition engines
........

Which is why the recommendation is quite low......

And leaded car fuel is still available in some countries....

 

[F123C]

I remember reading about some of the research that the FBHVC had funded into the consequences of using various %ages of Ethanol in petrol some years ago. It was widely covered in the classic car mags at the time.

The plan to switch to 10% ethanol in petrol throughout Europe was actually on the cards to be adopted some (maybe 5-6) years ago, but iirc Germany vetoed this plan due to the possible political backlash from the many owners of cars that would be detrimentally affected in Germany - they decided to hold off for ~10 years so that the numbers of such cars would be significantly reduced due to normal attrition. That 10 years is almost up now....

This is something that is also of concern to members of a U.S. forum I belong to. (one really should not end a sentence with a preposition )Over there, some can access their local airfield and purchase leaded 'Avgas'. Others use one of the additives in their classic cars and many recommend products such as 'Stabil' for over-wintering of (particularly) small engines.(the carbs on small engines/motorcycles can get badly gummed up if ethanol containing fuel is left in over winter). Some have experimented with ways of removing the Ethanol from petrol but it needs to be remembered that what is left behind is then a lower octane fuel than the original petrol (gasoline) containing ethanol.

I find this resurrected idea of 10% Ethanol in petrol very worrying, given that many of the components that may be adversely affected are not being reproduced for so many cars in materials that are compatible with this version of petrol. Iirc, the FBHVC found that copper, brass, al.alloys and even terne-plate (used to make older fuel tanks) would be adversely affected to say nothing of the various seals, gaskets, packings etc. I'll even have to dump my n.o.s. of 'O' rings etc. and buy the 'new (dearer) versions.

It could also impact on enthusiasts' decisions to buy or indeed 'buy to restore' classic cars etc. in the future if there is a question mark over the future availability of suitable fuel.

Al.