False MPG Figures: Sun Article

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False MPG Figures: Sun Article

No way did that thing do 50+ MPG haha. That's brilliant.

notice how they're ALL driven by 7 ft rugby players :rolleyes:

maybe they're scooting them along :D

Seriously = it's a small car , on skinny tyres, with "relatively" well sorted engine + aerodynamics.( 5 speed box..?)

I should think it's possible with ALL the right approach..,:p

used to get @34 from a 2.0 cortina and @45 from a 903 panda on daily driving back in the 90's (y)

Charlie
 
I'm very concerned as I have just placed an order for the worst offender - the twinair trekking!

If it doesn't average high forties/low fifties on a run I will be disappointed, I don't expect the claimed MPG but I don't expect a .9 engine to be thirstier than the 1.2 it's replacing!

no problem,
my Punto TA does that..!!
Moultoneer get high 50's from his trekking,
as said - it's all down to YOU ( and your right foot);)

plenty of 500 TA owners can get into "single figures" if they put there mind to it

Charlie
 
My Panda has been averaging just under the 50mpg for over 4 years, but few local runs, mostly 10 miles or more, so warmed up and flowing well.
The Learner car, Fiesta 1.0 Econetic 125hp gave me 42mpg, worse than the 1.4 before it. The current 100np model, less highly strung, is now matching the 1.4 at 43.7mpg. All that technology, and expense, for no real gain, but more difficult to drive.

The figures quoted are from a repeatable test, so good for comparison, but we all drive on different roads, with different styles. Living is Dorset or the Lake District, with lots of hills is likely to give poorer figures than tripping around a flatter area like Norfolk after the rush hour. Watch the instantaneous figure as it warms up. All are frighteningly thirsty when cold, small petrols warm up and improve quickly, but diesels can take a long time. A small diesel on short commuter runs can be thirstier than a large petrol.
 
Those high mpg figures quoted are not real-world figures. The tech boys always use those little magic boxes you can buy on ebay for £10 to improve consumption - but that's a trade secret that they'll never tell you about.;)
 
My Evo 1.4T according to fiat urban should get 38MPG, if I drive it slow I achieve exactly that, heavy footed about 33.
 
Are those urban mpg figures in the article? They look more like cruising mpg figures. You have to watch how tests actually measure things. & I'm getting suspicious that the more complex EMS code and features gets, the more confused the fuelling-ignition system is -> the Robocop movie where they give him 300+ directives...

I heard about hybrid car owners saying they aren't getting quoted mpg figures either, but it also seems they don't know how to use the regen (which is a bit like playing a video game rather than driving a car), but worse, they don't plug them in. So obviously they're not going to be very efficient then.
 
I think this problem has only gotten worse in the last 5 years, as the eu emissions targets get ever more ridiculous. I have a 2008 Grande Punto 1.4 8v, the official combined figure for which is 47.9 mpg. On a reasonable length journey, I can get 45 mpg out of it, and in the past, I've somehow managed 50 mpg, so I can say that the official figure for that car is actually quite accurate. I can see the inaccuracy of current mpg figures only getting worse.
 
I heard about hybrid car owners saying they aren't getting quoted mpg figures either, but it also seems they don't know how to use the regen (which is a bit like playing a video game rather than driving a car), but worse, they don't plug them in. So obviously they're not going to be very efficient then.

Depends upon the vehicle, the Prius smashes official MPG figures, but was built from the ground up as a Hybrid, and a lot has been done to make it very aerodynamic, other hybrids, like the Jazz, Yaris and Auris Etc are normal cars with hybrid running gear added as an after thought, so their aerodynamics are what go against them in their cases.

Not sure what you're on about with plugging in, only PHEVs plug in, traditional hybrids don't, and they're still very fuel efficient! Plugging in has nothing to do with efficiency, efficiency it how it using the fuel its given and how far it goes on given fuel quantity.
 
Different cars have different characteristics, for example my Punto has quoted figures of 62mpg from the same test as all other cars, no stop start no other fancy gizmos to save fuel just an engine and a gearbox, it gets 62mpg, most of my driving is at around 50mph to and from work.

Our 1.6 Mini Cooper D has quoted figures of 71mpg but gets about 53mpg, mainly because the standardised test Uses the stop start, which we rarely use as we're rarely stopped. It also favours a higher touring speed of about 65mph so isn't at its most economic cruising at 50mph so the much newer supposedly more economic car looks terrible on paper.

Change the tables through put the mini on a mixture of 70mph roads and stop start traffic in towns then the mini would destroy the Punto on economy as the punto's mpg figure drop right off at 70mph and when stopped in traffic the engine carries on burning fuel.

So unless you daily drive to work mimics the mpg test then the test results are really only a guide
 
I don't know what a PHEV is, never heard of that term. I'm talking about the hybrids that have had complaints about their MPG, that plug in to recharge their batteries. Some people don't seem to realise they need to be plugged in. At a wall outlet. Or if they can find a charging station, there.

I don't know if you mean plug-in hybrids have nothing to do with efficiency in the tests? Because plugging them in generally does have everything to do with efficiency. The main point of plug-ins is because it is meant to cost less to run them, which of course depends on how much you pay for electricity. (as well as of course the whole problem with fossil fuels etc)
Offhand I can't remember every make-model and which ones are full electric, etc, but generally that is what makes them desirable, is that you get a huge amount of mileage for a tiny amount of money paid.

In any case, it was just an on-topic comment about related complaints about MPG. The point being sometimes people don't check what the quoted figures mean, or don't check how often and when they need to plug the vehicle in to recharge.
 
I don't know what a PHEV is, never heard of that term. I'm talking about the hybrids that have had complaints about their MPG, that plug in to recharge their batteries. Some people don't seem to realise they need to be plugged in. At a wall outlet. Or if they can find a charging station, there.

I don't know if you mean plug-in hybrids have nothing to do with efficiency in the tests? Because plugging them in generally does have everything to do with efficiency. The main point of plug-ins is because it is meant to cost less to run them, which of course depends on how much you pay for electricity. (as well as of course the whole problem with fossil fuels etc)
Offhand I can't remember every make-model and which ones are full electric, etc, but generally that is what makes them desirable, is that you get a huge amount of mileage for a tiny amount of money paid.

In any case, it was just an on-topic comment about related complaints about MPG. The point being sometimes people don't check what the quoted figures mean, or don't check how often and when they need to plug the vehicle in to recharge.

PHEV is a Plug-in Hybrid Vehicle. Only about half a dozen on the market, and very few owners seem to have quibbles with them. Their MPGe figures are very much circumstantial upon individual circumstance, the main one being how much you plug it in.

However a PHEV will still have a max MPG figure for being used as a HV (hybrid vehicle) only. This is where the fun starts.

My Prius Plug In averages about 80/85MPG real world, but I'm only doing about 15% of my mileage in EV (Electric Vehicle) mode, most is done in HV. This will return about 66MPG in the winter to 80MPG in the summer with no plugging in. This is well short of the 134.5MPGe figures given, but I expected this as I'm a high mileage user and I've bought the car for other long term reasons.

Take the Outlander PHEV though, 148MPGe claimed, but in with HV only use averages about 35mpg! MPGe figures (which is what you're referring to) will all depending upon the % of EV driving you do vs HV. You'll either fall short, or potentially smash it, I know one Prius PHEV driver that is getting over 200MPG average!

Don't get traditional hybrids and PHEVs confused though, they're vehicle different vehicles that'll give very different performance figures.

Traditional hybrids tend to fall short in the winter as the design of the Atkinson engine, as its fuel economy is very much based upon its thermal efficiency at max operating temperature. Run it in the winter with heater on full in the car and in stop start traffic and it'll only be sitting at about 50C rather than 90C.

Even Hybrids will vary from manufacture and upon if they're series or parallel hybrid systems (thats an interesting read in itself).

I do agree though, far to many never seem to do even basic research when spending thousands of pounds on a car, which is stupid if you ask me, but each to their own.
 
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You heard few quibbles, I heard more quibbles, personally I can't afford to try any of them so I don't know myself. I'm not against electrics, I was just referring to what I have heard. eg, people saying their i8 isn't getting quoted figures, people saying plugging them in is such a chore some folks won't even bother - this seems to be a tactic though to introduce induction charging. So nightmare sci-fi cities can make everyone's 'dreams' come true..
 
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You heard few quibbles, I heard more quibbles, personally I can't afford to try any of them so I don't know myself. I'm not against electrics, I was just referring to what I have heard. eg, people saying their i8 isn't getting quoted figures, people saying plugging them in is such a chore some folks won't even bother - this seems to be a tactic though to introduce induction charging. So nightmare sci-fi cities can make everyone's 'dreams' come true..

you can buy hybrid vehicles or plug in hybrid vehicles, there is usually quite a premium for the latter option and in some cases a need for a special charging station to be installed at your home to charge it.

people who buy plug in hybrids don't generally, not bother to charge them as they specifically bought them for that reason.
inductive charging is very inefficient and slow, fine for your electric tooth brush you don't use for 23hrs 55mins a day but not a technology they're going to roll out to cars any time soon.

PHEVs are far better suited to those who drive maybe 3-4 miles to and from work every day at 30mph then the occasional jolly to the coast at the week end, basically spending most of their life on battery but with an engine to back up any longer journeys again it goes back to how the car suites the lifestyle of the owner
 
And then you have the Vauxhall Ampera...

No you don't, cause nobody bought one (well not many, who wants to spend £35,000 on an electric Astra?)

Same technology is in the BMW i3 and i8 but although they're not any cheaper (especially the i8) they are more likely to be worth more than a sausage roll and a day old news paper three weeks after leaving the show room (y)

The main inherent fault in all vauxhalls is they're worthless not helped by the hire car industry buying corsa and insignia models in batches of 500
 
No you don't, cause nobody bought one (well not many, who wants to spend £35,000 on an electric Astra?)

Same technology is in the BMW i3 and i8 but although they're not any cheaper (especially the i8) they are more likely to be worth more than a sausage roll and a day old news paper three weeks after leaving the show room (y)

The main inherent fault in all vauxhalls is they're worthless not helped by the hire car industry buying corsa and insignia models in batches of 500

I do like the idea of the ampera, but I'm unsure as to whether the engine is actually mechanically connected to the front wheels or not. I once read that it was nothing more than a generator, another time I read that it does sometimes actually drive the wheels.
 
I do like the idea of the ampera, but I'm unsure as to whether the engine is actually mechanically connected to the front wheels or not. I once read that it was nothing more than a generator, another time I read that it does sometimes actually drive the wheels.

It's a "range extender" so an all electric vehicle with electric motors powering the wheels at all times, but they have dropped a petrol engine in which powers a generator for when the battery is depleted, this then supplies electricity to the wheel motors until the battery is recharged
 
It's a "range extender" so an all electric vehicle with electric motors powering the wheels at all times, but they have dropped a petrol engine in which powers a generator for when the battery is depleted, this then supplies electricity to the wheel motors until the battery is recharged

I get it now, lol! Do you reckon more manufacturers will launch cars like the Ampera?
 
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