Technical Corroded axle advisory on mot. I looked. Wish I hadn't. :o/

[sherbsville]

So yeah, the lovely @rmjbn1 advised I take some pics of the corrosion and post em on here.

Yeah. I'm scared. I poked some bits of it, and it's still solid underneath the rust.

Advice on what to do other than stop to having a nervous breakdown greatly appreciated.

Thankyou!

Ps They aren't in order, there are some right side mixed in with left side. Sorry.

 

[puntodeltathema]

I suspect it's not as bad as it looks. The flaky stuff may mostly be the plastic/paint coating applied at the factory though even if a bit of iron oxide comes off it's not necessarily the end of the line (MoT wise at least) until holes appear. I'd probably suggest giving it a jolly good wire brush to see if there are any real issues, then slapping on some underseal. Ideally one would remove the springs to do this but even cleaning and painting round them is better than no protection.

 

[John202020]

It's fine, wire brush and some rust proofer all good for the next few years?

 

[GettinBetter]

Yep, as per @John202020 it looks like surface rust. A good wire brushing with some electric tooling, and liberal coating of whatever you prefer, (oil/ grease/rust inhibitor).
I prefer to get under there with a spray gun full of oil and white spirit, every other year.

 

[Jockstrap]

Nothing to lose over.
As above wire brush, blunt chisel for chipping.
Dinitrol rust converter spray works well especially soaking inaccessible bits. I've then used it's underbody coat.
Give the spring seats a good chipping.

 

[rmjbn1]

Well I've seen worse, fingers crossed just surface rust which can be brushed off.
Agree with the above, now is the time it needs attention to protect it before it gets worse.
@sherbsville I understand getting under there and wire brushing might not be that easy for you, do you have anyone who could give you a hand?
If you want to start with a small area, I'd say these are the critical bits where the metal can start to get thin as rust takes hold:

Sorry for the alarming picture, but this is what can happen if left untreated. Maybe start with a wire brush on these points where the snap is in the picture and treat that first.

 

[The Panda Nut]

That is as they say, ripe for renovation but does not look so bad. Advisories like this are useful if they gee you up to do some necessary prevention work.

Undo the lower damper bolt and let the suspension drop. The spring should lift out. A rotary wire brush on an electric drill is what I use and a screwdriver to knock off stubborn bits of rust. I have just done the family Panda fleet with Bilt Hamber UB50. High pressure cans spray even upside down and you will need 1 can. I use about 2/3 of a can on each car and they look well protected forat least 1 to 2 years. You can reach the whole of the axle and suspension through the wheel arch. Put the springs back and then spray them too. Replace the lower damper bolt and lower teh car before final tightening. It is so worth the effort and that axle of yours should then give many more years with periodic TLC. I am unconvinced about Dinnitrol rust converter mentioned above, I have previously used the DInitrol rust converter but wouldnt now use again as after 3 years it seemed to have been of little benefit. Google the pros and cons and make your own mind up.

Hammerite kurust is I think a better converter that doesnt leave a sort of paint like finish like the DInitrol. Im normally a Dinitrol fan but find Bilt Hamber easier to apply and it looks better. Dinitrol Wax I applied to my new Panda 5 years ago has all but disappeared. It is a decent product though. Maybe i used the wrong grade.

There are plenty more views and suggestions on here to consult.

 

[jrkitching]

As others have said, that is typical of what you'd find on a 500 of that age, and nowhere near to failing yet. If you treat it now, it will likely last the remaining life of the car.

The question is how best to do that.

Firstly, forget about using any kind of brush on or spray on so-called rust converter; they simply don't work in this kind of application. Secondly, forget about using paint, or anything else which will harden. You won't be able to prepare the surface adequately with the beam in situ, moisture will get between the paint and the surface, and it'll continue to rust away under the paint. Whatever you use has to be non-hardening.

If you're going to have any chance of removing all of the existing corrosion, you're going to have to do the bulk of the work mechanically. Wire brushes may get off some of the worst bits, but to have any chance of reaching the crevices and corners, you'd need to sandblast it, and to do that, you'd have to remove the beam and strip everything off it. And if you're going to do all that work, you might as well go the whole hog and send it away to be hot-dip galvanised. (it has been done on this forum!)

Fortunately none of this is necessary. All you need to do is to stop it rusting any further, and the way to do that is to cover it with something that'll both stick to the surface and stop water from reaching it. There are a number of proprietary products that can do this; waxoyl, dinitrol, etc; but the cheapest and easiest is just old-fashioned grease.

Just buy a tube of the cheapest, stickiest grease you can find, and several pairs of grease-resistant gloves. Then after a nice warm dry spell (anyone remember those?!) crawl under the car and spread it over all those bits you've photographed. No need to dismantle anything and even if you're obsessively thorough, it'll take you less than an hour.

 

[AnthonyH]

Wirebrush and waxoyl will add life to everythling. But nothing to worry about from those pictures.

 

[Danoid]

See me keeping it alive

Post in thread 'Rear axle rust'
https://www.fiatforum.com/threads/rear-axle-rust.493354/post-4672396

Year later
Post in thread 'Rear axle rust'
https://www.fiatforum.com/threads/rear-axle-rust.493354/post-4733773

 

[rmjbn1]

Just buy a tube of the cheapest, stickiest grease you can find, and several pairs of grease-resistant gloves.

I like that. The cheapest and simplest solution and I'm sure as effective as anything.

If I didn't want to have the car up on stands for a couple of days attacking it with power tools I would definitely do this.

I smear old engine oil over mine and pour some into the pans every oil change.

 

[jrkitching]

I smear old engine oil over mine and pour some into the pans every oil change

That's even cheaper, and just as effective, though somewhat messier. Be careful if you have an asphalt driveway as petroleum products destroy asphalt.

Also it's more important to use the right PPE if doing this, since used engine oil is a known carcinogen.

I do this over the sump after every oil change.

 

[The Panda Nut]

Wirebrush and waxoyl will add life to everythling. But nothing to worry about from those pictures.

Im a recent convert to Bilt Hamber and say its worth a little extra money. There are a few on here who recommend it, and having tried all the other stuff I decided to take the plunge. It seems only available on the internet but buying direct was very quick and easy. The cans are air pressurized to a higher pressure than aerosls like DInitro etc., and bless these people for thinking of this idea!! I agree with JRKitching re the grease, its would be the cheapest way. I would add a prewash with used engine oil first though to soak into crusty bits. Yes, I know old oil is carcinogenic, but rubber gloves and washing up liquid will more or less eradicate this risk.

I think the Jenolite or Hammerite (same stuff) seems to workwell as it does appear to just soak into rust unlike the Dinitrol which just encapsulates it. If you chisel off any lumps after application and crush them, it seems to have soaked in.

Its easier to get the suspension arms and bearings with a spray and BH specifically says its good to go on everything so Ive done the brake backplates and pipes and connections. and the damper bushes which appear to like it too. They look rejuvenated om the 2019 car.

Getting into the rear arm cavities and soaking the rusty bolts makes them look new too.

The main thing is do something and it will arrest the problem.

What I find striking is how different the rate of corrosion is in the pictures from various posts, and indeed on my fleet. My 100HP was nearly 10 when I sold it and the axle was in very good order, about the same as My Mrs' 2014 car is now. It needed doing, but as a very early preventive. The 2016 car still looks like new, our 2017 looks a bit worse than the 2014 (it started life in Havant near the sea in Hampshire) and my 2019 is clearly a ruste,r in need of regular TLC. Its OK, but only because its pampered.

The weather in Italy clearly means they dont even give corrosion a single thought, apart from the bodywork where they have really gone OTT after their bad reputation from teh 60's and 70's. Than heavens for that!

 

[The Panda Nut]

nice warm dry spell

LOL

My SOlar system says most months this year 5% down and 3 months 25% down on sunlight!! from last years level.

 

[steveras57]

Agree with the above seen far worse!
Set aside a dry day off get under there with a drill and wire brush attachments( dont forget the goggle's) once cleaned up a dose of rust converter such as "Kurerust" followed by "waxoil" stone chip paint or even oil as suggested should see you good for a few years at least! take your time with the prep work dont rush and use good quality products and jobs a good un!

 

[sherbsville]

omg thankyou all soooooooooo much. I need to re read it all a few times to absorb the info. Taking bits off it really scares me, also I don't know how hard physically it is to undo stuff, but I think it is something I should try down the line. I know years ago I had a car and the springs rusted, so they should come off, but idk if I can.

For now I need to get the rust off, and coat it with something. So the consensus seems to be:

wire brush and screwdriver to get the gunk off, but get a brush to go on the drill, as my arms will fall off if i try by hand. (Which I was gonna try lol).

Maaaaaaaaybe use a rust remover on bits I can't reach? The springs maybe? I know this is stupid, as never used it, but if i do, does that need to be rinsed off? If I don't take em off, how to I clean the remover stuff off? Edit: Thankyou, asnwered right away. I need a convertor, yay!

Paint or spray with something that doesn't harden. A specially made product, grease, or used oil. I'm gonna do an oil change soon (eeeek), so will have oil. I just bought some lith moly grease. Is that ok? I didn't know there were different types of grease until the other day.

Also, as a total novice, do I need to lift the car or take the wheels off? Both things scare me, but I bought a lifting set from halfords, so have the stuff. Just not the nerve.

Thankyou all so much for all the responses.

 

[steveras57]

Dont use a rust remover use a rust converter !turns the surface rusty metal into an iron oxide thats stable and firm and good to paint over!

 

[sherbsville]

Dont use a rust remover use a rust converter !turns the surface rusty metal into an iron oxide thats stable and firm and good to paint over!

omg I didnt even know they were different, thankyou!

 

[AnthonyH]

Also, as a total novice, do I need to lift the car or take the wheels off? Both things scare me, but I bought a lifting set from halfords, so have the stuff. Just not the nerve.

I'm about 1 year into DIY mechanic-ing. It can be nerve wracking at first, but then that'll give way to frustration because making progress is slow. Its better if you have a spare car to drive while you do maintenance tasks.

You'll want to raise the car but the wheels could stay on.

 

[sherbsville]

I'm about 1 year into DIY mechanic-ing. It can be nerve wracking at first, but then that'll give way to frustration because making progress is slow. Its better if you have a spare car to drive while you do maintenance tasks.

You'll want to raise the car but the wheels could stay on.

aaaaw thats brilliant, thankyou so much. Was feeling kinda dumb with all the questions, even tho everyone is so lovely.