General Cold/Damp Morning Engine Start Issues

[madvicks]

Hi there,

First time poster! Long time Fiat owner.

Last month or so as the mornings have been colder and damper I am finding my 06 Dynamic 1.2 is reluctant to start. Normal ignition procedure (clutch in, no gas) results in the car initially starting and then when the key is released as goes to the MAR position on the ignition the car stalls. Repeated action results in a stall again. The only way to get the car to start is to put my foot on the gas, the engine catches, but sounds throaty and you can feel what I can only describe as a "hic-cough" coming form the engine. After a few seconds engine idles nicely.

Once started on a cold morning and then turned off and then started later, the engine starts as normal.

Normal engine starting is fine with no issues. I checked in the handbook in case there was any cold weather procedures and nothing.

Car is parked outside on the drive as in my avatar.

Any advice? Comments at all?

Thanks in advance!

 

[izzy eckerslike]

Sounds like the choke or whatever its called now not functioning perhaps.
On old carburettor vehicles like my campervan you pull out a knob to enrich the mixture for cold start, on modern injection vehicles its automatic but maybe its not working for some reason

 

[T14086]

There was a similar issue for 1.2 mk2 puntos which was sorted by software update but not sure if this applies to panda.

 

[D4nny8oy]

I was just checking T- it doesn't, despite it being of the same age and engine...:bang:

Assuming it is the same, the problem is caused by the battery voltage dropping below the limit required to power-up all the injection system when the starter motor is cranking. This is made worse if the vehicle is out in low temps overnight and the battery is consequently unable to operate at it's best. Holding open the throttle slightly aids starting, or continuing to crank (throttle closed) for around 8-10 secs will also eventually get it running.

This applied to the last of the Mk2b's when Fiat started to fit them with the Grande Punto-style 1.2 with the altered cam cover (screw-type oil cap) and corresponded to a change of fitting smaller starter motors which demanded more from the battery. Before the update was released it was found fully charging the battery helped, and in worst cases we retro-fitted the earlier type starter motors.

Ensuring the battery is in good condition helps in the meantime, but I'd recommend contacting the dealer when you can in order to fix this and put your mind at ease (Fiat may have an ECU update which hasn't been officially announced yet).

 

[madvicks]

Thanks ever so much!

I shall put a call into the dealer but quite frankly, I cannot bear them to touch my little car. They thrape the cars they have to Hell.

I'll charge the battery this weekend, wondering if I should hold out until half-term (5 weeks) so I can watch what they do to my car.

You guys rock!

 

[T14086]

Thanks ever so much!

I shall put a call into the dealer but quite frankly, I cannot bear them to touch my little car. They thrape the cars they have to Hell.

I'll charge the battery this weekend, wondering if I should hold out until half-term (5 weeks) so I can watch what they do to my car.

You guys rock!

but the 2 above people that helped you work at garages

 

[madvicks]

Oh, I know that and appreciate their help and am not lumping all mechanics as there are some very good ones out there. Sincerest apologies for that impression.

It is just at my local dealer, well, they open your door, lean on it and have a 20 minute chat whilst leaning on the door or standing on your frame and that's one of the better things they do. Hence, I need to go there and watch them.

Apologies again.

 

[T14086]

they open your door, lean on it and have a 20 minute chat whilst leaning on the door or standing on your frame and that's one of the better things they do.

20mins!......just a quick chat then

 

[madvicks]

LOL! Yeah....

That's nothing though. I should have bad vibes from day one. My alarm that was supposed to be fitted by the dealership wasn't, I had to have the dealer's alarm company come out to my house to fit the alarm. Seeing your new car in pieces on the second day of ownership is not recommended!

They took over 3 weeks (any several phone calls and two in person appearences) to order me a set of rear mud flaps and some interior mats.

And then when we took my mom’s Seicento in to have the handbrake looked at, I have no idea what they did but the handbrake was stuck on, we had to take it to another Fiat garage to get it sorted (all of this costing) as the original dealership said that the handbrake was working when they left it.

Real fly by nights…!

This being my first “I bought it myself car”, I am a tad protective!

My Panda has replaced my Cinq, which I inherited from my mom who got it from my dad (who has a Punto ’97 SX – we are a real Fiat family!), which I loved. We have had all the Fiat cars from new but the dealerships have kept closing and passing on to other franchises/businesses. This one is the worst; I have never experienced anything like it.

I had been travelling to Oldbury or Stourbridge from Solihull (which is over an hours journey) rather than going to the dealership 15 minutes down the road.

Hence the reticence in taking the car there.

Just want a nice local Fiat dealership where the mechanics know their stuff. *Sigh*:bang:

Nobody on here is local are they?

 

[madvicks]

Hi again,

Has anyone else had these issues at all?

I have spoken to Fiat Helpline and my dealership again. The dealership essentially told me to buzz off, and Fiat have told me to email them with the details.

Reading between the lines, if I want it fixed, I need to buy a new starter motor myself and have it fitted and maybe I might get the money back from Fiat UK.

Begs the quesiton what is the point of having a 2 year manufacturer's warranty and a 3rd year dealer warranty?

Thanks in advance!

V
XXX

 

[D4nny8oy]

Are any of these dealers near to you by any chance?

https://www.fiatforum.com/grande-punto/127473-dealer-ratings-2007-results.html

I understand your reluctance to have to leave your car there, but allowing them to experience the fault themselves may be the only way it will get fixed. If they manage replicate the fault but can't fix it, they can involve Fiat's Technical dept. and if need be have a Technician come-out and perform some more thorough tests.

Like me and T said above- the circumstances sound exactly like a issue the late Punto's had, yet the Panda was never officially affected.

I would hope they've gone down the route of checking the battery/charging system, cleaness/tightness of all starter motor cables and earth points and checked the voltage drop during cranking.

Sorry if it's not much help.

 

[madvicks]

Apologies for the old thread, but since it is an important update, I felt the need to.

Finally, got some sense out of a dealership. Fiat "helpline" (I use the term loosely) were a bust. Not interested. Spoken to another few dealerships locally and not so, and he checked on the info D4nny8oy gave me, apparently, I am safe from a new starter motor and a software upgrade will sort it!

I quoted check "Service Bulletins for Panda>Electrical Section>Poor cold starting" to them, they checked and voila. <--- Thanks to D4anny8oy for the information to be checked on. You are a real gem!

 

[equaliser]

Have you had the software update done yet? My 07 Panda 1.2 refuses to start every so often although I can't pin it down to anything like bad weather, temp, it's more annoying than anything. It normally starts first turn but if it doesn't you look like a complete wally and the panic starts!