Technical Changing my first Timing belt

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Technical Changing my first Timing belt

StanZlatan

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Intro: So the change is going to occur soon ( i dont announce date so the devil wont hear) and will be done by friends who started business a few years back. They are ok i think and they maintained sport cars back in bulgaria but on a few occasions i noticed they can learn a thing or two like any mechanic.

Question 1:
I have read here of people who changed their timing belt by themselves at home. Is this serious and possible? My guys tell me we have to disconnect the motor and empty the radiator when we do it as we change also the pulley and the water pump and a few other things. So is there a trick on the fiat panda to do it a much easier way when you change the timing belt and the water pump etc?

Question 2: Recently a delivery driver have changed the motor and was complaining that not the belt but the pulley broke. So my question is what is your opinion does the belt tear in your life span or more likely the pulley or some other part of the timing belt process that breaks the motor?
 
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Judging by some of the posts we've seen on here, it often goes horribly wrong if a non-marque specific independent garage attempts it.
Yeah i really dont need advices like his belitelling me. Who know how small his dick is.
Anyway i will manage with or without help here but that us why this forum is. To make the tasks a bit easier. I am thankful to all who helped me answer my questions so far and I know I will answer as well if i knew the answers.
 
I have changed multiple timing belts, on a range of marques, but mostly Fiat. The right tools are important, whether that is cam locking tools, tensioner tools etc.
I admit that I have not done a current Fiat engine for about 12 years and that was on a 2005 car with a base 1.2. I’m now not sure I’d tackle one as I no longer have access to those tools and I’m certainly not as confident as I once was
 
If you've done any other belt then it's realtively straight forward. Then there are some issues depending on the engine. Namely there are NO timing marks and the official way has a dodgy slacken the cam sproket method (then lots of ecu errors).

I went for the approach, lock everything, swap the belt (and pump and pulley), then everything is as before, and that worked for me.

The locking kit is worth it, and tensioner tool is worth it's weight in gold for setting it.

The engine mount needs to come off and you need to clean up the waterpump sealant. Between the timing belt and sump, the timing belt was by far the easier of the job.

And get it wrong and it'll need a new head or engine - probably that's where the concerns comes above.
 
Do your homework first and then ask questions. There's a good guide for it, just have a look.

Don't worry. It's just an engine. If you fcuk it all up, you can get a new one. :unsure:
 
Hi,

Timing belts should be changed together with any tensioner rollers , guide rollers, water pump turned by the belt because if any of the components fail the crank to camshaft timing will be wrong and engine will be seriously damaged.
 
I've done quite a few of these on the small FIAT petrol engines and during my working life I've done hundreds, maybe thousands, of timing belts on different makes of car. For an experienced mechanic the early FIRE engines - those with timing marks, so, on the Panda up to around 2011 - are amongst the simplest there are. The later engines, which have no timing mark on the camshaft pulley are best done using a kit of locking tools. I have a set like this: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/334804517903?hash=item4df3e7840f:g:rF4AAOSwzNNjGzjn&amdata=enc:AQAIAAAA0FiGGG9ih/s+LHR8u8Wxf/2AZSLyTL8OPL8TOztzkutgaIAs0+SSS22fAVPQIiZcutl5WWKcyUyEfXZ3tuKyf9dIoll+qAt2mPk2ailSqJo+WK1aCDgvLrpInM7yMWtvISJEu7QOo+DqtKnNfMqyVuEHcsapYiX/RUeWKxAdYohkx+RBcdQD8X43hmDwWiyrd2OY7uotItOnpDhbJy9fT9FwV5hHV3C9wamk2i5OEdojHmXPHrZboApfieisAo+D1Pgc8GeUhdATF5kfkyyDlwg=|tkp:Bk9SR8Lgh9e2Yg which works well but doesn't do the 1.4 twin cam engine.

If your car is post 2012 (I guess it is as you're in this section of the forum?) then it's going to be an interference engine so if you fit the belt wrong it's very likely the valves and pistons will crash into each other and wreck the engine. Also, particularly with this later VVT engine, there are many posts on the forum from amateur mechanics who have "got it wrong" with this VVT engine. Also from people who have had the belt change done by a wee garage with little fIAT experience and have ended up with poor running problems. For those reasons alone I wouldn't recommend this as a good engine to do your first belt change on and I'd strongly recommend getting it done by someone who knows these engines.

Andy Monty posted an excellent guide on the forum - mentioned by eeeno above - and to save you the trouble of searching for it you can find it here: https://www.fiatforum.com/guides/1-2-8v-evo-2-engine-cam-belt-replacement.732/ With your engine being a VVT you'll need to read PAGE 2 (see it linked to, in red, half way down the page).

If, after all this, you do decide to have a go yourself then you'll need more than a few cheap spanners and be aware one of the engine mount bolts is quite difficult to get at and they can be pretty tight. Also, when you're finished, take all the spark plugs out - so there's no compression in the engine so it will be smooth and easy to turn over - and, with a spanner or socket on the crankshaft bolt, turn the crankshaft through a minimum of two revolutions, very slowly so the flywheel has no inertial effect, and feel for any resistance. Just in case you've got it wrong and a piston is contacting a valve. Don't even think of even touching the ignition key until you're sure it's turning over freely! Also it's important to turn it over slowly. If you turn it fast, as is easily done with a socket and ratchet handle, the flywheel will have enough effect to bend a valve before you realize it's done it.

And, lastly, it's worth mentioning that, if you have slackened the camshaft pulley, as is recommended, you may well need to do a "Phonic Wheel Relearn" - which is basically an ECU reset - to teach the ECU the new angular relationship between the crankshaft and camshaft sensor signals. You'll need the dealer's diagnostic gear or Multiecuscan: http://www.multiecuscan.net/ (which is what most of us use) to do this.

Hope that was all of help? I think, on the later engines, it's the sort of job to only do if you either have experience or a good, knowledgeable friend to stand by and help if needed.

Edit. Good luck with however you decide to do it. I wish you well and hope it all goes well. Please do let us know what you decide and let us know how it all turns out won't you?
 
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Just to make it more difficult for you to decide, Ha ha, Here's some experimenting I did when I did Becky's belt - 2010 panda 1,2 (so this has a "freewheeling" ie. unmarked, cam pulley, but it's not VVT - https://www.fiatforum.com/threads/beckys-timing-belt-the-ongoing-saga.459903/

I would only recommend "mucking about" like this if you really, REALLY, know what you're doing and so are able to dig yourself out of trouble if you end up in a "hole". Some may find it interesting though so I'll now put on my hard hat and await the comments of outrage?
 
I've done quite a few of these on the small FIAT petrol engines and during my working life I've done hundreds, maybe thousands, of timing belts on different makes of car. For an experienced mechanic the early FIRE engines - those with timing marks, so, on the Panda up to around 2011 - are amongst the simplest there are. The later engines, which have no timing mark on the camshaft pulley are best done using a kit of locking tools.
Oops! Just realized that's not strictly true, the bit about engines up to 2011 having camshaft timing marks. Mine is a 2010 and has no cam timing marks. It's going to be the much earlier engines, like the one in my Felicity (the purple Panda you can see in my avatar picture) which had marks on both crank and cam pulleys.
 
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