General Calling all start 'n' stop owners!

[multispoke]

Our 500 is now 14mths old and they still can't get stop/start to work properly. The main dealer Arnold Clarke, Grangemouth are now blaming us saying it's the way we drive it. It is currently in the 'garage' and yesterday they called to say they found 4 faults, today it is now 'we dont use the car enough'. We know all about the 'holding on biting point' and putting clutch right down to floor. It's had an array of new sensors fitted and a new battery. We now drive around with only the radio on so as not stress the poor electrical system. I am currently trying to establish whether the correct alternator has been fitted. Fiat are being very cagey about this so I am having to phone different dealers, so that I can check our one. Our main problem is the continual 'stop start unavailable':bang: we have had it come on whilst cruising on the motorway having done 30 miles and it just popped up.Last time it was in the garage in April it didnt help that they scratched the rear quarter and chipped the drivers door. Here's a thought put a higher output alternator on to compensate. We are raging with way we are being treated over this, Fiat need to get these early cars sorted and fast and take ownership of the issues

Forgive me if I raise this as a possible cause - it may have already been addressed. How about a full overnight charge with the battery out of the car. Although you would need a 'replacement' battery since 500s don't like to have no battery disconnected for any lenght of time because it can cause the flashing mileage problem (or it did the 'older' ones).

 

[306maxi]

Forgive me if I raise this as a possible cause - it may have already been addressed. How about a full overnight charge with the battery out of the car. Although you would need a 'replacement' battery since 500s don't like to have no battery disconnected for any lenght of time because it can cause the flashing mileage problem (or it did the 'older' ones).

'That' 'doesn't' 'exactly' 'solve' 'the' 'problem' 'though' 'does' 'it'? 'That' 'is' 'if' 'the' 'battery' 'or' 'alternator' 'is' 'to' 'blame'

 

[TheRealCornBeef]

Can anyone confirm that Fiat had Alternator spec issues on 09/10 plate 500's with stop/start. Just off the phone to a dealers parts department and there are lots of updates and changes to specs and outputs and he was able to tell me that there was some vehicles fitted from factory with non stop/start alternators. I hasten to add they wont release specs to me:bang:

 

[TheRealCornBeef]

Fiat have done that and then put a brand new battery in to passify the wife.
Me thinks if the Germans couldn't get it to work properly what chance have the Italians with their track record on electrics. LOL

 

[306maxi]

Can anyone confirm that Fiat had Alternator spec issues on 09/10 plate 500's with stop/start. Just off the phone to a dealers parts department and there are lots of updates and changes to specs and outputs and he was able to tell me that there was some vehicles fitted from factory with non stop/start alternators. I hasten to add they wont release specs to me:bang:

What you see in this thread is more or less the extent of recorded issues with S&S on this forum. I don't seem to remember alternators being an issue, but it's worth a readthrough.

D4nny8oy and t14086 are very knowledgeable when it comes to S&S so I suspect they'll be able to offer at least a little help

 

[multispoke]

'That' 'doesn't' 'exactly' 'solve' 'the' 'problem' 'though' 'does' 'it'? 'That' 'is' 'if' 'the' 'battery' 'or' 'alternator' 'is' 'to' 'blame'

I find this particularily rude - but at this stage what else can we expect of an individual with zero interpersonal skills.

There was an informed reply from a very respected member of the forum who went into how when a new car is delivered the battery is not fully charged. If a new battery has not been 'prepared' as in not been given a full charge from day one it will never perform properly. For those with 'smartphones' there would be an information booklet about a full charge overnight so that the battery has been learned what charge it is capable of holding / giving.
I would be giving this opinion from having worked in a US multi-national for a number of years as a Manager in a technical capacity whose business was to supply batteries to its own particular phone and to other suppliers such as siemans and philips.
I accept that there is an issue with the S&S hence the reason for 'delicately' asking the question.

 

[306maxi]

I find this particularily rude - but at this stage what else can we expect of an individual with zero interpersonal skills.

There was an informed reply from a very respected member of the forum who went into how when a new car is delivered the battery is not fully charged. If a new battery has not been 'prepared' as in not been given a full charge from day one it will never perform properly. For those with 'smartphones' there would be an information booklet about a full charge overnight so that the battery has been learned what charge it is capable
of holding.
I would be giving this opinion from having worked in a US multi-national for a number of years as a Manager in a technical capacity whose business was to supply batteries to its own particular phone and to other suppliers such as siemans and philips.
I accept that there is an issue with the S&S hence the reason for 'delicately' asking the question.

I was merely making light of your recent tendency to needlessly punctuate.

I understand where you're coming from and I see the logic you're trying to use, but here we've got someone with a car which is within warranty and you're suggesting a method which involved him possibly buying a car battery charger and another battery and having to do work on his car when it's under warranty. It's an unnecessary and ridiculously circuitous way of sorting a problem which the dealer needs to look into themselves, whether or not the dealer charges the battery or replaces it is another thing of course, but the owner got a car with a warranty for a reason and they shouldn't have to be doing this sort of repair work on their car and spending money for battery and charger.

Also, sealed lead acid batteries do not suffer from memory effect as you seem to suggest.

 

[multispoke]

It's very important for newcomers to feel that they make a contribution to a 'problem' and not fear be ridiculed. I thought carefully about posting the original rely. I would appeal to you to show some sensitivity in your responses. If you find that by me underlying the key words is offensive in anyway - I will gladly change the key words to a different colour since the lack of paragraphs (& URLs !) seems to be a trait of mine

 

[TheRealCornBeef]

Fiat Tech have confirmed our driving 'Style' is correct and suitable to stop start(1.5hr test drive with him), they have confirmed that the battery is fully charged, they have replaced numerous sensors, they have increased timeout parameters and loaded 'The' latest software update. And it still don't work.Dohhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

 

[306maxi]

Fiat Tech have confirmed our driving 'Style' is correct and suitable to stop start(1.5hr test drive with him), they have confirmed that the battery is fully charged, they have replaced numerous sensors, they have increased timeout parameters and loaded 'The' latest software update. And it still don't work.Dohhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

Doh!

 

[PandaLounge]

Having pretty much trawled this thread and having read through the OH I have been met with the dreaded Start&Stop light and triangle today.

6 months in and without a single hiccup today I reversed the car out of the garage and the system has shutdown.

This appears to be a common fault with some cars that when cold and reversing it baffles the S&S.

TBH I think its an excellent piece of kit. As said up until now its never let me down. It even is clever enough to know when I'm parking and "advises" me that S&S won't be available.

Now, however, like so many on this thread a completely unexplained fault has appeared. Having driven to work with the fault I fully expected it to clear on the way home, but it is still very much there.

My driving style has not changed from day one and as far as I am aware I use the system as required, hence no previous faults.

It is booked into Fait next week as although not a major problem and still very much drivable the S&S light and Triangle are getting on my tits being constantly illuminated.

Hmmmm

Steve

 

[TheRealCornBeef]

Doh!

Had a fantastic chat with 2 Smart car owners about their Stop/Start!! It works in the cold, it works when you've left the car for a fortnight and within 2miles of getting going again stop/start is available. They have not had change the way they drive, (don't leave hand on gear leaver, don't hold on biting point, it don't shut down when reversing, it don't shut down whilst cruising along the motorway or perish the thought turn the wipers on or put any other auxilary(excluding heated rear window) device). They also don't have to charge the battery or keep it on a battery maintainer.

Here's a thought:idea:!! Fiat, go buy a Smart car, strip it down to see how it's supposed to work then copy it in a legal way, Bingo

So today is the 14th day our 500 has been in the garage, they called on Friday to say we could collect it, we asked ' Is it fixed?', 'Er, no, we can't fix it' came the reply, 'So why would we come and pick it up then?' we asked, silence. So it all starts again

 

[itimjim]

This is happening to me on a brand new 500 Lounge 1.2. Bit annoying, but it does clear. I'll probably talk to them about it, when it needs its first service in about 12 months.

I find it happens quite often when I'm going slow under partial clutch, like when reversing slowly, or starting off from the lights behind another car slowly.

 

[T14086]

Here's a thought:idea:!! Fiat, go buy a Smart car, strip it down to see how it's supposed to work then copy it in a legal way, Bingo

Lets compare the amount of Fiats with stop/start sold compared to smart cars, it's obvious the ratio of faults will be higher. From what I have researched the smart car stop start system has it's fair share of problems.

Have you had a field engineer out to look at your car?

 

[RogerWilco]

Lets compare the amount of Fiats with stop/start sold compared to smart cars, it's obvious the ratio of faults will be higher.

Why would the ratio be higher??

 

[TheRealCornBeef]

Lets compare the amount of Fiats with stop/start sold compared to smart cars, it's obvious the ratio of faults will be higher. From what I have researched the smart car stop start system has it's fair share of problems.

Have you had a field engineer out to look at your car?

Errr yes, the FOURTH Field/Fiat Tech should be coming this week as it is now week 3 that the car is still in the dealers workshop and we are at a total of 15 weeks that the car has been in the workshop since we took delivery of it with the same problem. Running out of patience now and will be, very soon going down the legal route under Sale of Goods Act, not fit for purpose:bang:

 

[loveshandbags]

Had a fantastic chat with 2 Smart car owners about their Stop/Start!! It works in the cold, it works when you've left the car for a fortnight and within 2miles of getting going again stop/start is available. They have not had change the way they drive, (don't leave hand on gear leaver, don't hold on biting point, it don't shut down when reversing, it don't shut down whilst cruising along the motorway or perish the thought turn the wipers on or put any other auxilary(excluding heated rear window) device). They also don't have to charge the battery or keep it on a battery maintainer.
Here's a thought:idea:!! Fiat, go buy a Smart car, strip it down to see how it's supposed to work then copy it in a legal way, Bingo

So today is the 14th day our 500 has been in the garage, they called on Friday to say we could collect it, we asked ' Is it fixed?', 'Er, no, we can't fix it' came the reply, 'So why would we come and pick it up then?' we asked, silence. So it all starts again

Fiat have done that and then put a brand new battery in to passify the wife.
Me thinks if the Germans couldn't get it to work properly what chance have the Italians with their track record on electrics. LOL

There's a bit of a contradition in your postings. On the one hand you're asking Fiat to strip down a Smart (a German Mercedes - albiet a small one) to see how the stop start system works and then you say the 'Germans couldn't get it to work properly'.

 

[idreamelectric]

Hello everyone

I bought my '10 reg Fiat 500 1.2 Lounge three weeks ago, directly from Fiat. 50% of the time I start my car I have the S&S failure. I have studied this thread and thought about every possible reason for it failing due to my error, but:

* I never ride my clutch. It was the golden rule when I was learning.
* The engine is not cold. It's June (albeit in England!).
* I do not believe I am putting any unecessary strain on the battery.

Like some people here, I find that turning the engine off and on again tends to fix it. However, a mechanic once told me that turning an engine on is a huge strain on the battery in itself, and generally not good for a car.

It worries me that the first post in this thread was nearly two years ago and Fiat seem no closer to solving the problem, even in newer cars like mine (less than one year). Part of me wonders whether ignoring the problem will be less of a hassle than trying to fix it, as the dealer is over an hour away.

If I had read this thread when I was looking for a car I probably never would have bought it, not because it's particularly difficult to live with the problem - it's not, really - but because I worry about being able to sell it on.

Anyway, I will call dealer on Monday and see what they say.

Lauren

 

[306maxi]

all 500's are fitted with s&s now so if there were inherent probles with the system this thread would be far far far longer

 

[Super Uwe]

Hello everyone

I bought my '10 reg Fiat 500 1.2 Lounge three weeks ago, directly from Fiat. 50% of the time I start my car I have the S&S failure. I have studied this thread and thought about every possible reason for it failing due to my error, but:

* I never ride my clutch. It was the golden rule when I was learning.
* The engine is not cold. It's June (albeit in England!).
* I do not believe I am putting any unecessary strain on the battery.

Like some people here, I find that turning the engine off and on again tends to fix it. However, a mechanic once told me that turning an engine on is a huge strain on the battery in itself, and generally not good for a car.

It worries me that the first post in this thread was nearly two years ago and Fiat seem no closer to solving the problem, even in newer cars like mine (less than one year). Part of me wonders whether ignoring the problem will be less of a hassle than trying to fix it, as the dealer is over an hour away.

If I had read this thread when I was looking for a car I probably never would have bought it, not because it's particularly difficult to live with the problem - it's not, really - but because I worry about being able to sell it on.

Anyway, I will call dealer on Monday and see what they say.

Lauren

Hi Lauren,

Firstly, welcome to the forum. You must have taken a long time going through this thread!

I have a late '59 plate 1.2 Pop which doesn't have Start and Stop; my personal feeling is that I am glad I don't have it, but at the same time I am not in a position to say whether it's good or not. There are of course a fair few posters on here who think it's a great system.

I can understand your dilemma with the dealer being an hour away, in my opinion I think it would probably be worth your while taking it to the dealer so that they know you are having trouble and it is at least officially logged. I guess you can decide when you speak to them

If the worst comes to the worst and you have to disable it every time you drive off, the only thing I can say is that the 1.2 will still prove to be very economical anyway. Not the best I know but it's at least worth knowing!