Technical Battery issue?

[L2cifer]

Hello all, my punto is having issues starting. Turn the key and the starter doesnt want to budge and the clock goes to 00:00. Been doing this for a while and the car is worse if it's not been used for a couple of days.

Other times I've been able to start it with a small amount of accelerator applied.

My thoughts are that the battery has gone because once you've got the car started it'd be fine for the rest of the day but i'm concerned it could be a power drain.

What are everyone's thoughts?

 

[Ziggy122]

Hello all, my punto is having issues starting. Turn the key and the starter doesnt want to budge and the clock goes to 00:00. Been doing this for a while and the car is worse if it's not been used for a couple of days.

Other times I've been able to start it with a small amount of accelerator applied.

My thoughts are that the battery has gone because once you've got the car started it'd be fine for the rest of the day but i'm concerned it could be a power drain.

What are everyone's thoughts?

When you turn the key - yolu get a click and the car doesn't attempt to start
and the dash resets

That actually sounds like a fault when i fried the earth return cable rolleyes

Anyway some basic tests
AWhat is your battery voltage when its sat?
BWhats the battery voltage when the engine is running?
CWhat is the battery voltage with the electrical stuff on (heaters fans lights stereo etc) at idle?
DSame as above, but this time with about 2k to 3k rpm?

A Should be between 12.2 (low) to 12.6v (charged)
B should be 13.8v + If battery is dead its more likely to be 13.8, but 14v+ if its healthy
C Should remain about 13v, but i know the 60a alternator dont have enough juice, i've seen as low as 11.5v (serious sucking)
D Should be happily sitting 13v + (i'd expect 13.5v really)

Next for starting, get a negative jump lead, attach it to the engine mount posts, and then the other end to the NEGATIVE BATTERY TERMINAL
i say it in big letters because, you put that sucka on the positive, You'll create a heavy short

Anyway with the mount to negative terminal, does the car start with ease?

Ziggy

 

[L2cifer]

Fantastic suggestions Ziggy thank you! I'll give them a try this evening when I get home from work.

 

[disgusted]

+ once you've done that, make sure that you fully charge the battery AND if you only do short journeys, remember to charge it every now and then.

It's all down to physics.


Tip from an old'un.

 

[L2cifer]

Humm the punto does only do school runs a couple of times a week and the shops and back so maybe it just needs a charge every now and then. The battery is only a couple of years old at the most. It's a banner battery too.

 

[Ziggy122]

The 8v engines battery is small

Very small

The alternator is small too, only 60amps

Newer punto's come with 85+ amp alternators, which dont retro fit im affraid

Short runs does no car any good, they barly get out of ""automatic choke"",
Same for the battery, the huge drain cranking a cold engine to the alternator kicking in and actually charging the battery at a fast rate doesn't happen
You do 5mins down the road, the alternator isn't spun at a fast enough speed, dont happen enough

So you have a few options
you use a trickle charger to help top the battery up
or put a charger on it once every so often

but you have to disconnect them before running, which is a PITA

Ziggy

 

[AndyRKett]

If the battery is only a couple of years old then its probably not knackered

 

[L2cifer]

Heya chaps, so far i've only done the first test which was

A: 12.21V - 12.19V
B: 13.88V - 13.87V
C: 13.39V - 13.36V (rear heated window on, full beams, fan on 4 with full heat).
D: 13.47V (no matter how high we reved it above 2kish.

The battery seems to be saying it's charged to the charger rather quickly, it was only on quick charge around 20 mins before saying full and last time i did full charge it only took around 2hrs max.

Is it normal that electric windows and such work fine despite the car not being able to start? I did also check the boot light wasn't always on .

When you turn the key - yolu get a click and the
Anyway some basic tests
AWhat is your battery voltage when its sat?
BWhats the battery voltage when the engine is running?
CWhat is the battery voltage with the electrical stuff on (heaters fans lights stereo etc) at idle?
DSame as above, but this time with about 2k to 3k rpm?

A Should be between 12.2 (low) to 12.6v (charged)
B should be 13.8v + If battery is dead its more likely to be 13.8, but 14v+ if its healthy
C Should remain about 13v, but i know the 60a alternator dont have enough juice, i've seen as low as 11.5v (serious sucking)
D Should be happily sitting 13v + (i'd expect 13.5v really)

Ziggy

 

[L2cifer]

updated the above post

 

[Ziggy122]

Those voltages look okay

To me it says the alternator is working fine

But 12.2 isnt a good starting voltage
And taking 20mins to charge says it possibly on the way out

12.6v is a fully charged
12.3 is 50%
11.9 / 12v is a flat battery

However i have to admit my punto battery starting voltage is never great
12.3 is common

------

Your electric windows lights and all that should work with a low battery but dimmer / slower

Ziggy

 

[L2cifer]

Humm what you think I should do? I was thinking of getting a new battery because the running voltage was only 13.9V when running?

 

[atom0007]

It's all down to physics.

That's what the apple said

 

[Ziggy122]

Humm what you think I should do? I was thinking of getting a new battery because the running voltage was only 13.9V when running?

13.9 is only 0.1v off 14v

if the battery is low it wont pump 14v+ into it, it'll be lower as its charging up

Ziggy

 

[L2cifer]

Humm okay, seems like i'm back to the drawing board as to what the problem could be then.

I think i tested for current draw correctly earlier but nothing was registered on my multimeter making me think perhaps I didn't do it right.

I disconnected the negative terminal, placed my negative multimeter probe on the wire and the positive on the negative battery post but as i said nothing was shown at all (had the meter on amps).

I still need to test the earth connectivity.

 

[Ziggy122]

Noooo
When looking for a paracitic drain

you put the multi meter on ma Draw, 1 amp is 1000ma btw

You need to disconnect the Negative i think (cant remember now)

And then put the positive probe on the m.meter on the battery negative
then put the negative probe on the m.meter on the negative clamp

it should then give you a reading

Bear in mind, when you first reintroduce power, it will probably pull more then it should as the ECU boots up and goes into standby

So after initial spike, it should ease down

Ziggy