Another Dealer Quits

[PuntoHowTo]

Hi

I spent many years driving underspecifed Vauhalls and Fords and I dont want and absolutely wont buy a Vauhall Punto or a Peugeot Panda. Italian Cars are designed for Italian roads which are more taxing than UK roads hence the feel is so good and very different. French cars are OK but have a French feel and remmebering how dire their roads used to be its easy to understand why. The Stellantis buy out was no merger and any thoiught that Fiat will have any input is wishful thinking. The baby has not only been thrown out with the bath water but severely beaten at the same time. The new products will be what they will be. If Im going to drive something with less feel and NO Brio it will be Japanese as at lest then it will be well made and I can have one rather than two..

an interesting question is raised by this…. What would you buy going forward?

Assuming that any new fiat is just a rebadge budget French car, what new car brand would you choose instead?

 

[The Panda Nut]

Hi

an interesting question is raised by this…. What would you buy going forward?

Assuming that any new fiat is just a rebadge budget French car, what new car brand would you choose instead?

First though is to convert the Panda to an EV as there is nothinhgelse that appeals.
Second thought is Suzuki either the Ignis or the Bignis (I think this is the Vitara) Its the parts supply issues that scare me on these,
I may in the end have to fall back to my arch enemy the Germans, and go for their small offering.
The other thought is to get something old siple and road tax free,
Im 66 now and I will be making greater use of public transport I anticipate so the cr will just be needed to get to a terminus.

The day I have to stop driving a proper Fiat will be the day I have really given in to old age.

Hopefully an alternative to electric power will materialise. I have NEVER had anything battery powered that I would trust my life to yet.

 

[The Panda Nut]

and thinking about it, WHERES MY B BUSS PASS! Im an old codger and should get EVERYTHING free now.

 

[SB1500]

First though is to convert the Panda to an EV as there is nothinhgelse that appeals.
Second thought is Suzuki either the Ignis or the Bignis (I think this is the Vitara) Its the parts supply issues that scare me on these,
I may in the end have to fall back to my arch enemy the Germans, and go for their small offering.
The other thought is to get something old siple and road tax free,
Im 66 now and I will be making greater use of public transport I anticipate so the cr will just be needed to get to a terminus.

The day I have to stop driving a proper Fiat will be the day I have really given in to old age.

Hopefully an alternative to electric power will materialise. I have NEVER had anything battery powered that I would trust my life to yet.

I’ve drive two of the current Vitara’s. My sister had a high spec for that model year 2016 model with 4x4 drive. My mum was given a 2022 one last year for a week when her 208 was written off. Nice Panda-hybrid colour, ‘hybrid’ (but not a proper one) and awkward gearbox. It handled like my 2005 Panda (maybe not as bad with the leaning, but more leaning than I expected). Felt like a tall car as opposed to an ‘SUV’. It put me off wanting a ‘crossover’ although I’m hoping they’re not all like that.

 

[s130]

I was thinking Volvo but I've just seen their prices! Cheapest is £33K going to £97K

I think I might go for a Dacia. A Sandero starts at £14K. AUTOCAR BEST BUDGET CAR 2023. Other better and slightly more expensive avaialble. They also have 3 to 6 year warranty, ..... They even have 4 raod wheels

 

[The Panda Nut]

I was thinking Volvo but I've just seen their prices! Cheapest is £33K going to £97K

I think I might go for a Dacia. A Sandero starts at £14K. AUTOCAR BEST BUDGET CAR 2023. Other better and slightly more expensive avaialble. They also have 3 to 6 year warranty, ..... They even have 4 raod wheels

A decent enough drive and at least these are stiill honest albeit an old Clio.

 

[StevenRB45]

Slightly confused by one French platform share being acceptable and honest..but hey wherever these lines must be drawn.

 

[SB1500]

Slightly confused by one French platform share being acceptable and honest..but hey wherever these lines must be drawn.

I wouldn't touch them at their current pricing given the Renault DNA. Wouldn't even touch Nissan given their links, or low end Mercedes diesels. A decade ago the Sandero and others were great value that you could do worse than Renault parts.. but now absolutely no way for me. There definitely is a lot worse trash on the market now with MG and other Chinese brands incoming.

 

[StevenRB45]

I had a bill of sale for my 1998 Punto 11500 quid or there abouts.

Despite the fact it had the mechanical complexity of a knife and fork and the crash worthyness of a skateboard compared to a modern car in just pure inflation calculation it would be 26k now.

My dad bought a focus in 2005 for 16500, not the best one just a 1.6...adjusted for inflation that's nearly 32 grand.

This is just what cars cost..it's not a conspiracy..it's inflation if anything prices have dropped in the multi platform era given what you get for what you've paid relatively.

 

[porta]

I spent many years driving underspecifed Vauhalls and Fords and I dont want and absolutely wont buy a Vauhall Punto or a Peugeot Panda. Italian Cars are designed for Italian roads which are more taxing than UK roads hence the feel is so good and very different. French cars are OK but have a French feel and remmebering how dire their roads used to be its easy to understand why. The Stellantis buy out was no merger and any thoiught that Fiat will have any input is wishful thinking. The baby has not only been thrown out with the bath water but severely beaten at the same time. The new products will be what they will be. If Im going to drive something with less feel and NO Brio it will be Japanese as at lest then it will be well made and I can have one rather than two..

If you really want to know, and compare makes, go on the recall databases for UK, Europe, USA and Asia…I think youd be surprised…one thing is for sure, if it’s Italian, it would be all over the press, not so much with Toyota and VAG
What will happen with Stellantis is unclear, Fiat have a long modern history of saying one thing and doing another

 

[The Panda Nut]

If you really want to know, and compare makes, go on the recall databases for UK, Europe, USA and Asia…I think youd be surprised…one thing is for sure, if it’s Italian, it would be all over the press, not so much with Toyota and VAG
What will happen with Stellantis is unclear, Fiat have a long modern history of saying one thing and doing another

Particularly when related to putting 90HP motors on Pandas of which there are very very few, and, in spite of all the advertising blurb NONE in the waze models - I suspect this relates to anything after mid 2018.. In their case I accept it may well be a case of absolute total incompetance as much as deceit. just wish more people would challenge them and demand compensation or they are likely to carry on in the same vein. I think Fiat dont really exist anymore just people doing as instructed from France now. All hopes of Italian flair seeing the light of day long gone.

 

[s130]

A decent enough drive and at least these are stiill honest albeit an old Clio.

I was not aware of the Clio heritage. Thanks for the info.

 

[PuntoHowTo]

and thinking about it, WHERES MY B BUSS PASS! Im an old codger and should get EVERYTHING free now.

My parents are quite a bit older than you but regularly use theirs well worth it for the cost of parking in Norwich now and how crammed some of the car parks get, not to mention all the roads they keep closing off.

You make me realise the closest thing to the panda 4x4 now is the Suzuki Jimmy which is a very capable little car but sits at about £28k

I had a bill of sale for my 1998 Punto 11500 quid or their abouts.

I had the original paperwork for my Punto Evo which was a top of the range model with leather interior, duel zone climate control cruise control and the sporting model with 17 inch wheels and factory tinted glass, and that was £12,500 in 2011, goes to show how cheap cars had become and that we were likely taking that for granted.

 

[StevenRB45]

I had the original paperwork for my Punto Evo which was a top of the range model with leather interior, duel zone climate control cruise control and the sporting model with 17 inch wheels and factory tinted glass, and that was £12,500 in 2011, goes to show how cheap cars had become and that we were likely taking that for granted.

To be fair the person who specced my mk1 was the wife of the owner of a Benfield dealership.

As a result there were quite a few options and it was the most expensive one you could get other than a GT.

But yes, you have an idea in your head of what an £x cars looks like and manufacturers have actually done reasonably well to keep prices down and when we complain they aren't built like the used to be...in real terms how could they be?

 

[PuntoHowTo]

To be fair the person who specced my mk1 was the wife of the owner of a Benfield dealership.

As a result there were quite a few options and it was the most expensive one you could get other than a GT.

But yes, you have an idea in your head of what an £x cars looks like and manufacturers have actually done reasonably well to keep prices down and when we complain they aren't built like the used to be...in real terms how could they be?

I think my Punto Evo was a demonstrator so high spec and maybe sold a bit cheaper with a few miles on it.

In talking about the Jimny I started looking at them on eBay and now I want this tiny G-wagon to drive around london and confuse all the kids who stand out taking pictures of fancy cars

2023 Suzuki Jimny SUZUKI JIMNY SIERRA JC 1.5 AUTO NEW 23-23 EURO 6 ULEZ SUV 4WD | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for 2023 Suzuki Jimny SUZUKI JIMNY SIERRA JC 1.5 AUTO NEW 23-23 EURO 6 ULEZ SUV 4WD at the best online prices at eBay! Free delivery for many products.

www.ebay.co.uk

 

[SB1500]

Citroen's new van looks like it borrowed the fancier-Fiat 500 headlight parts.... Maybe Fiat is teaching them how to find its retro / old self and style..

 

[PuntoHowTo]

This has popped up in the news today with both the Panda and the Fiat 500 appearing in the 20 most unreliable small cars of 2022. This is by Which who do not just look at the most recent models but cars of generations going back, So it is notable that more recent models tend to score as the most reliable.
however what is not in Fiat's favor is that both the Panda and the 500 are both pretty old models so it stands to reason they won't have had updates and redesigns to fix common problems and failure points.

20 most unreliable used small cars

The right small car can make a very affordable used buy, but choosing the wrong model could land you with sizeable repair bills as time goes on

www.whatcar.com

 

[StevenRB45]

Winner!!!!

Although some interesting scoring going on C3...26% went wrong, Fiesta in second nearly half went wrong.

Although absolutely no surprise that older cheap cars score worse, 7-15 years of shoe string service followed by bitter complaint when it comes back.

 

[PuntoHowTo]

Winner!!!!

Although some interesting scoring going on C3...26% went wrong, Fiesta in second nearly half went wrong.

With the Fiesta

"Fortunately, the majority of these were fixed in less than a day, and cost less than £200 to put right, however a few cars racked up repair bills in excess of £1500."

For the C3

"Although only 26% of respondents’ cars went wrong, a quarter of these were off the road for more than a week, and nearly half of faults (48%) cost between £201 and £750 to put right."

So its based on the severity of the fault and time taken to repair as well as the cost.

The fiesta is such a massively common car parts are probably available in your local news agent, where as the citron had a lot of engine options and spec differences with typically french cost cutting, probably led to delays in getting parts and silly little things going wrong which ended up taking an engine out to change something simple?

Of that era a lot of those Citroen C3s would have been the 1.4 hdi.

 

[StevenRB45]

Having thought on it..I seem to recall pretty much every engine fitted to that car would be a grenade at the age these cars currently are.

PSA/Ford 1.4 and 1.6hdi + 10 years of bad maintenance..boom. 1.1 and 1.4 Tus with poor maintenance and a stiff breeze..boom. 1.4 and 1.6 prince engines...ahaahaha no no respite there. The only Puretechs fitted would have been due timing belt 3 years ago.

So probably entirely deserved or at least a true reflection of how well people maintain them.