Technical Air conditioning non functional...

Currently reading:
Technical Air conditioning non functional...

Thanks M. It was a glimmer of hope but I just checked the date of registration and I don't think I'd qualify unfortunately as it was first registered on 3rd March ... which is just 3 weeks before the lockdown began. I think I've just been unlucky here! Some you win and...

Typical :( well, I wish you all the best my friend and hope you get it sorted.

Slightly off topic but I was actually looking at the cost of an air con recharge moments before I saw this thread and noticed it’s around £130 for the new type of gas, I think once mine runs out I’ll just open the windows instead haha :D
 
Typical :( well, I wish you all the best my friend and hope you get it sorted.

Slightly off topic but I was actually looking at the cost of an air con recharge moments before I saw this thread and noticed it’s around £130 for the new type of gas, I think once mine runs out I’ll just open the windows instead haha :D
Give it a year or two or should be cheeper
About 2 year back it was £3+ for 5kgits now £366 looking online


The older gas on the other is set to skyrocket as the manufacturer in of it is being heavily limited
 
Thanks for checking C. I have a valid comparison and mine is very low. I suspect something is not right... I'll find out a bit more on Tuesday I suppose. But interesting to note how much it changes when the system starts up.
 
AndyRKett probably built that video

Seems likely.... (y)

Firstly though
by both flicking the Schrader valve on the low pressure side of the system and checking the readouts on ECUscan, I established that there is still some pressure in the system

NO!!! Never EVER !! do this, aside from the fact it is technically (and actually) illegal. It is also extremely dangerous and can if done incorrectly result in a gas embolism which can be fatal. Also R1234yf is flammable so you can end up with a nasty fire. You knew the clutch wasn't kicking in and you had MES to tell you how low the pressure was, this would have been sufficient to identify the problem. You can also scratch the ball in the valve and cause a leak from the valve resulting in a leak where there wasn't one and need to replace expensive pipework.

You can turn the pump by hand with the engine off and check on MES to see if the reading on MES changes, even if its only a few mb then its enough to know there is still some pressure in the system (i,e no big hole anywhere and the sensor is not 100% accurate)

So what to do.

If your car has R1234yf then you are indeed looking at a more expensive bill. however normal proceedure to "regas" the sytem is to suck out all the gas and any air, then hold the system at a vacuum for about 30 minutes. If after 30 mins there is no loss of vaccum then the system is usually deemed to be sealed. So you pump in the gas, a bit of oil and maybe some dye, then do a "sniff" test with a probe that can detect the gas if it is leaking out. This is all par for the course and is not some highly expensive fault finding proceedure.

So what you do is just book it in for a regas if they gas it and give the car back then all is good.

If you don't get it done the pump will usually, eventually seize up, like an engine that is left for years unused.

The seals in the rest of the systems will degrade and leaks will be enevitable rather than a maybe.

and to be honest if the car is just our of warantee i'm assuming it's 3 years old or older, and its probably just about due a regas, its highly unlikely that a standard regas would be covered under warranty, especially if its a fiat warranty as they are tight as a ducks......

You may need to phone around to find a garage that does R1234YF but it is worth doing, and is best to look for a quality independent aircon specialist rather than pay main dealer prices.

My final word is that if you choose not to get it done, then remove the pollen filter otherwise the filter will trap moisture which the aircon would normally remove from the air, the car will become foisty and mold can develop, if not on the car interior, on the filter which then gets blasted into your face by the cabin fan. (y)

You can get top up sets for R1234yf but you need to be topping it up before it stops working, once it has stopped working then the pressure has dropped to far to say if system has just lost efficiency because of low gas, or if its because of a leak, as an explanation to this. The gas might leak out at 12 bar, but the pressure drops to 1.2 bar and the gas can no longer push its way out past a weak seal.
 
Last edited:
Andy, thanks for the very comprehensive run through and yes absolutely, 1234yf would not be good for anyone. I didn't realise mes monitored system pressure at that point, until I viewed the Punto refill video. I certainly understand 1234 converts to some pretty nasty substances, in the event that it were to ignite. Per reports, Daimler Benz seem to have had a real issue with its flammability when originally tested, for whatever reason.

Interesting idea about turning the pump by hand. I wonder if doing so would be enough for mes to register a difference...perhaps? I might have a quick look again today.

I am hopeful that a refill of the system is a successful cure for a good long while and that the scenario does not end up with it returning to something near its current state a week later after £130 changing hands. Hopefully not and hopefully the vacuum test would highlight anything. Nothing ventured, nothing gained. But I read tales of pretty hefty expense if it does entail further diagnosis and repair and I wonder then if its a question of weighing it up... I take your point about the cabin filter and the multitude of problems that can develop through disuse.

A long time ago I bought a fairly leggy 4 year old Mondeo mk2 from a well know dealer, which had one months warranty and I realised pretty quickly the AC was inoperative. But I had quite a stressful battle with them via trading standards, to get a new condenser fitted which they eventually did, accepting the warranty terms. But it was not cheap for them!
 
Update - I did have quick look at it again, just about managing to read the laptop screen through the windscreen whilst spinning the pump, in the right direction and... no it didn't change the reading on mes. It's not looking great as the static pressure seems to have dropped again to 1.06 to 1.09 bar, but in different atmospheric / temperature conditions from when first checked, if that were to make any difference.
 
realistically the car is quite new and unless you have notably hit something puncturing the condensor then the likelihood is it needs a regas.

Yesterday was warm but its cold and miserable today. yesterdays pressure may have been because of the system being warmer, which to some degree does indicate that the system may well be fully sealed.

ironically I cut my teeth on aircon systems in early mondeos, I fitted Aircon to my 1993 mondeo LX which didn't have aircon at all, then later pinched the bits out of a Ford cougar to install the climate control system found in later mk2 mondeos. All worked very well. but because of this experiance, I never buy a car without aircon now.
 
Thanks for the words of encouragement, Andy.

I'm pretty impressed with your abilities to fit an AC system from scratch on the Mondeo! I'm also kicking myself for not monitoring the AC on my car, particularly the compressor engagement. Can't remember exactly when I could be sure it was last working to any extent but with the relatively newness of the car, I never suspected it would become a problem so early on...
 
An update, if anyone is interested. Some people don't follow these thread stories through to conclusion. I decided not to go with Kwik Fit but instead contacted my local garage Galvin Garages (Glasgow) who put me in touch with a company called Direct Cooling (Lanarkshire) who come to your door to examine your vehicle (£40 for a diagnosis or £145 for a refill of 1234)... In short, it wouldn't hold pressure, the condenser is leaking. The engineer connected what seemed to be a compressed air cylinder via gauges into the a/c system pushing pressure to 120 psi and squirted what seemed to be a detergent around the system I guess to check for bubbles, but he and I could both hear a slight bubbling noise from behind the grill where the condenser sits and afterwards, I removed a studded plastic top panel from above the radiator/condenser and could see a multitude of these colourful soapy cellular bubbles sticking to the back of the condenser. Engineer said he would lay bets on it being condenser in most cases and it seems quite exposed there sitting behind that big grill. So, will not be cheap but might be easier than you think to remove bumper/grill assembly for access and condensers seem to start around £75 plus delivery. Back in touch with my garage when I'm ready then..

(The long silver line in the first photo is the top of the condenser) IMG_20200609_170516.jpegIMG_20200609_170500.jpeg
 
Back
Top