Grande Punto Won't go into reverse w/out grinding only when hot

[nexusmick]

Hello to all, I am new to the forum so I thought I would take the dip and ask for some help...

This forum has given me some great tips/advice over the last year but I have now finally signed up as a new member as this site has given me the courage to tackle some jobs for myself.

I am having this issue, reverse gear grinding when my engine gets hot with my grande punto "07 plate" and was wondering if anybody has actually got to the bottom of this, I have seen other posts on this subject but am wondering where I should start with this, any and all help would be appreciated or is it a sign that my clutch is on it's way out. I have had this car for 5 years now so am unsure if it is still the original clutch as I have no documentation to say that it has ever been replaced by the previous owner/owners ?

Thankyou to anyone that may have some thoughts on this......

 

[nikrox]

Hi,and welcome ...
Whats the miles on the car?..only in reverse?..any play in the gearchange?..

 

[Bernievarian]

Hi (Mick ?) and welcome on board !!

First of all, a worn clutch would just show slipping tendancy and would just "ease" gear shifting. If the diafragm is worn (grooved), it could be harder to shift gears because the clutch would be "less" dis-engaged (not sure if the hydraulic actuator has a wear compensator).
Since it happens only in reverse, it could also come from the command cables (trying to engage two gears), have a look at the excellent video posted by Liam, it might apply to your car ...

BRs, Bernie

If someone here helped You fix -or better, understand- your issue, hit the thanks icon @ bottom right corner, it's free and makes us feel helpy ;-)

 

[DaveMcT]

Ive had two Fiat clutches which did not slip but the gears would not engage. Both were worn on friction plate and diaphragm spring.

If you have hydraulic clutch release, bleed the hydraulics. If it improves but goes bad again, you'll need a new master cylinder. If its a Panda or 500 you have to buy the hose and cylinder as a set. The slave is cheap so its best to change the whole lot as both ends will be worn.

 

[Liam1804]

Good advice there,

I was going to say do what DaveMcT Suggested and change the brake / clutch fluid and bleed the slave cylinder,

My Mrs Punto was grinding when going into reverse With clutch fully down, and also 1st gear was stiff,

the steps I took was the following,

1, Pop the cables off the gearbox and see if they Move freely, (mine were ok)
2, Adjust the Cable the same way they do in the video, - This helped a bit,

3, replace the brake / clutch fluid And bleed the slave cylinder, this is what I believe made the gear changes a lot smoother And it was a lot better, and also stopped the judder in 1st gear when pulling away

I also changed the gear box oil as well just because I didn’t no the history of the car,

The clutch is a lot better now, if Im to be honest I think changing the brake fluid and bleeding the system is what made the improvement.

Here’s the link to adjust the cable (Use Subtitles)
[ame]https://youtu.be/cl0cQR7ePjw[/ame]

 

[varesecrazy]

Clutch fluid

 

[nexusmick]

Hi,and welcome ...
Whats the miles on the car?..only in reverse?..any play in the gearchange?..

Sorry for late reply I am still getting used to the forum.

I have 104,000 miles on clock & does not seem to be any play in the gear change.

As I am not sure how long the clutch fluid has been in the car I suppose it would be a good start to replace that as I know I have not changed it in the five years I have owned the car.

 

[nikrox]

AFAIK it shares same cylinder as brake fluid..so.....I use an eezi bleed.

 

[Bernievarian]

Actually it shares same fluid reservoir as brake master cylinder ...

 

[nikrox]

So basically brake/clutch fluid are one and the same..so if your going to bleed the clutch do your brakes too...well I would..

 

[nexusmick]

Hi (Mick ?) and welcome on board !!

First of all, a worn clutch would just show slipping tendancy and would just "ease" gear shifting. If the diafragm is worn (grooved), it could be harder to shift gears because the clutch would be "less" dis-engaged (not sure if the hydraulic actuator has a wear compensator).
Since it happens only in reverse, it could also come from the command cables (trying to engage two gears), have a look at the excellent video posted by Liam, it might apply to your car ...

BRs, Bernie

If someone here helped You fix -or better, understand- your issue, hit the thanks icon @ bottom right corner, it's free and makes us feel helpy ;-)

I do remember a few years ago my wife was stuck in reverse and I had to change one of the command cable/linkages but as it was the one for the reverse gear I should be able to rule that one out but as there are two could that be a possible cause as maybe I should have replaced the pair together ?

 

[nexusmick]

Ive had two Fiat clutches which did not slip but the gears would not engage. Both were worn on friction plate and diaphragm spring.

If you have hydraulic clutch release, bleed the hydraulics. If it improves but goes bad again, you'll need a new master cylinder. If its a Panda or 500 you have to buy the hose and cylinder as a set. The slave is cheap so its best to change the whole lot as both ends will be worn.

I have had a quick look at the master & slave cylinders but did not notice any leaks, as I have had this punto for 5 years I suppose putting some new fluid in would not do it any harm ? She is on 104,000 miles so was also thinking of changing the gearbox oil too as I don't know wether it has ever been done during the life of the car....

 

[nexusmick]

So basically brake/clutch fluid are one and the same..so if your going to bleed the clutch do your brakes too...well I would..

I was only thinking today that I will probably want to bleed the brakes as I am going to get some new fluids and start replacing due to age & mileage and not knowing the full history of the car....

 

[nexusmick]

Hi (Mick ?) and welcome on board !!

If someone here helped You fix -or better, understand- your issue, hit the thanks icon @ bottom right corner, it's free and makes us feel helpy ;-)

Hi Bernie, thank you for your post. I can't seem to see or find the "Thanks icon you are referring to, all I can see is "like", "Quote", "multi-quote" & "reply". Am I being dense as I am new to the forum or is my eyesight beginning to fail me in these later years ?"

 

[Bernievarian]

Never get it fully understood myself, sometimes the "thanks" icon is there, sometimes not ... I believe it depends where the original post was from, or in what section, anyway it doesn't matter that much !!

Cheers, Bernie.

 

[nexusmick]

Never get it fully understood myself, sometimes the "thanks" icon is there, sometimes not ... I believe it depends where the original post was from, or in what section, anyway it doesn't matter that much !!

Cheers, Bernie.

Ok that is good with me, but anyway just so you know, thank you for the help in the replies you give and I for one, appreciate any help that anyone can give, so once again, thank you for your invaluable knowledge that you provide.....!

 

[nexusmick]

Ok clutch fluid changed and bled but reverse gear still grinding when engine up to temp. Will try and get onto bleeding brakes next. I hope it is not the clutch, my skillset only goes so far.

 

[nexusmick]

Good advice there,

I was going to say do what DaveMcT Suggested and change the brake / clutch fluid and bleed the slave cylinder,

My Mrs Punto was grinding when going into reverse With clutch fully down, and also 1st gear was stiff,

the steps I took was the following,

1, Pop the cables off the gearbox and see if they Move freely, (mine were ok)
2, Adjust the Cable the same way they do in the video, - This helped a bit,

3, replace the brake / clutch fluid And bleed the slave cylinder, this is what I believe made the gear changes a lot smoother And it was a lot better, and also stopped the judder in 1st gear when pulling away

I also changed the gear box oil as well just because I didn’t no the history of the car,

The clutch is a lot better now, if Im to be honest I think changing the brake fluid and bleeding the system is what made the improvement.

Here’s the link to adjust the cable (Use Subtitles)
https://youtu.be/cl0cQR7ePjw

Thank you for this video, I have watched it over again and I think my crunch in reverse problem could be the fact that when I replaced the gear control linkage I don't think I adjusted it correctly by putting it in the service position, I think I just popped the linkage on and left it as is, so am now wondering if this could be the problem. I will take another look at the car and try to adjust it as the video describes.

 

[florindt]

I had the same problem with the reverse gear and very dificult to select first gear so I changed the slave cylinder without sorting it, then I changed the master cylinder without success. Also changed the dot 4 fluid and no change. After I got the clutch changed it goes into reverse and first gear so smoothly.