What could I buy that's more reliable than a 500?

[jrkitching]

But this is what a warranty is for.

I disagree. The aim should be to deliver the vast majority of cars with zero defects - the warranty is there to reassure customers and deal with exceptional cases which should happen only very rarely.

I remember visiting Honda in Japan as a newly qualified engineer in the '70's, and that was their philosophy 40 years ago.

They were amazingly forthcoming in sharing their knowledge with us (we were after all in competition with them). When I expressed my surprise at this, they said they weren't concerned at all. Their logic was that they'd seen our factories and talked with our workers, and even if we went straight home and started to implement what we'd been shown, it'd be at least ten years before we got to where they were at the time, and by then, they'd be ten years further on.

It was a hugely sobering experience at a time when BL were still a major player.

...and how its dealt with that matters imo.

I'd certainly agree with you there. Judging by what gets posted here, it seems to me that Fiat get this wrong with monotonous regularity.

...just like I would a new build house for example.

Don't get me started on that one.

If new cars were built like new houses, you'd be lucky to still have all four wheels on it by the time you'd driven off the forecourt .

Frighteningly new houses are one of the few things you can buy that aren't covered by the Sale of Goods Act.

I've recently bought an almost new house and am spending much of my time right now replacing all the guttering. A quick search on the internet quickly established that at least 25% of all houses sold today experience a major problem with guttering within the first five years.

I've heard it said that some developers deliberately make a poor job of repairing defects in an attempt to discourage the buyer from reporting any more.

 

[wellfan]

Its the nature of the issue and how its dealt with that matters imo.

That is the problem. A relatively simple procedure such as changing the oil and filter seems to be beyond them. Almost all of my experiences with Fiat service have been shockingly woeful.

 

[RussH]

My Father had a 1994 E300 (having previously owned other Mercs). It was the last one he bought - at 6 years old it had rust bubbling up on both front wings and the bottom of the doors, build quality was not great . The engines were OK but ancient and thirsty and the auto box was agricultural. You don't see many 90's Mercs arond now that aren't complete rust buckets.

There aren't many 1990s cars that don't suffer with rust, even galvanized Audis.

You're wrong about the diesel engines though. Pretty legendary and will run at 500bhp all day long or do mega miles, or both even. Auto box agriculture? They're just old school torque converter technology. They'll easily do 500k plus miles as well. I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree.
If you'd talked about 1998ish onwards mercedes you'd be correct.