Technical Third Party immobiliser problems

[Didge3]

My '94 Punto 90 (pre CODE system) came with a third party immobiliser when I bought it, I wasn't a particular fan of it but it seems to work, until now :bang:

I have no idea why, worked last time I started the car (about a week ago) but now nothing!
It works with a fob that you put in a little slot in the dash, it beeps and then you can remove the fob and start the car, if you don't put the fob in it'll let you switch the ignition on but when you turn the key to the start position nothing happens, it seems to work by interrupting the connection to the starter I'm assuming

Anyway, today it decided not to work I put my fob in, it beeps, turn key in ignition and it acts as if I haven't used the fob, no response from the starter.

Unfortunately I have no documentation of this immobiliser so I don't know where to start. I was pulling off random pieces of dash today working my way back from the fob slot in the dash etc.
It comes down from the fob into the O/S fusebox area just down to the right of the steering column, there are several black wires which splice into other wires in that area, those wires also lead up to the ignition barrel but only splices into 1 wire there, from there it goes down and into the centre console area.

This is where I need some input, in the centre console behind the ashtray etc i have a black box with lots of black wires going into it (so far all the wiring that comes from the immob fob slot is black), this also appears to be where the 'beep ' comes from when I put the fob in. Its sat very snug in there however and I can't really see how its attached but it won't budge, can anyone confirm this is not standard in a Punto?

Thanks....

 

[renaultvation]

Our 94 Punto 90 (pre CODE system) also came with an aftermarket immobiliser, but ours is located to the right of the steering column behind the drop-down cover. Again the wires are all the same colour (orange), but only attached with scotchlocks. It was a simple matter to remove, although I kept the power to the unit so that the dash display still flashes its little red light to give the impression that it still exists, but there is no contact with the ignition circuit. On this basis I think it is safe to assume that the box you have found is not original equipment.

 

[Didge3]

Well did a bit more digging this morning, pulled some of the centre console apart



Amazing what you find in a very cheap 21 year old car....



A lighter, lots of cigarette butts, chewing gum, some sort of receipt which is actually dated '94 and 19 pence, can knock that off the price I paid for the car



Heres my little black box of annoyance anyway, it is definitely the thing that beeps when you insert the immobiliser fob, its also filled with this weird black goop looking stuff
As you can see it has lots of black wires and nothing written on it so I can't find any info on what each pin/wire does... I feel like it will be a lot of tracing to find out where all of this goes :bang:

Would you say its worth a try to switch the ignition on and then apply 12v directly to starter solenoid and see if it fires? That way I would know if it also interrupts fuel/ignition or if its (hopefully) just interrupting the signal to the starter (which I'm doubting since it has about 20 wires... )

 

[blu73]

Its pretty standard stuff for security devices to have all wires same colour... makes it much harder to circumvent said system if you are trying to steal the car.

I must say at this point, you put the thing in and it beeps like usual but car doesn't start. Before you go ripping at these wires and stuff are you sure that its not still working and your problem isn't just the starter itself has died, or a dodgy earth connection or something like that. Much easier stuff that taking immobilsers out. I'd start with earths, if they seem ok then i would manually supply the starter with 12v from the battery and see if the motor still works and also the solenoid clicks as it should. I would also test the battery, like a drop test not just that it has 12v. Only after eliminating all that I would start messing with the immobilser.

 

[Didge3]

Its pretty standard stuff for security devices to have all wires same colour... makes it much harder to circumvent said system if you are trying to steal the car.

I must say at this point, you put the thing in and it beeps like usual but car doesn't start. Before you go ripping at these wires and stuff are you sure that its not still working and your problem isn't just the starter itself has died, or a dodgy earth connection or something like that. Much easier stuff that taking immobilsers out. I'd start with earths, if they seem ok then i would manually supply the starter with 12v from the battery and see if the motor still works and also the solenoid clicks as it should. I would also test the battery, like a drop test not just that it has 12v. Only after eliminating all that I would start messing with the immobilser.

This is what I did this morning. Decided to rationalize things and not jump to conclusions about the immob. First I checked the wiring to the battery terminals, engine earth strap, wires to starter motor etc, everything seemed fine. I then put a multimeter across the battery and turned the key to start, 0 drop in voltage so obviously the starter isn't trying to pull any current... Starting to think its the immob again, I also noticed usually fob goes in, beep from immob and the light stops flashing until the immob is reactived again when you switch the car off, currently it remains flashing all the time.
So more and more pissed off, switched the ignition on, and bridged the starter and solenoid connections, after sh*tting myself at just how loud the start motor is when you're lying underneath it on the second attempt BAM starts up :slayer: :worship:

So I'm currently guessing the way my immob interrupts the connection to the starter isn't working, I can see 2 wires it interrupts going into the back of the ignition switch and another wire it interrupts in the fuse box area, all the other wires I have no idea

I'll try and reconnect the ones I know and see what I manage to achieve

 

[Didge3]

Some rewiring later and...

[ame]https://youtu.be/jBexquJeyU8[/ame]

 

[blu73]

well done chap, so i assume it was the immobiliser and now it is avec pas immobiliser?

 

[Didge3]

You assume correctly.