OP
OP
madrat
Member
excellent thank you 
General Things that go bump at the back
- Thread starter madrat
- Start date
Currently reading:
General Things that go bump at the back
:hug:
Seems we have something in common!
I was very disappointed in mine but have come to tolerate it more on short-ish trips. Will certainly be considering modifications... but few people ever want suspension to be softer/longer travel than standard, so I'm not sure aftermarket parts will help... think I might need Ford Ka parts
-Alex
- Joined
- May 15, 2011
- Messages
- 3,769
- Points
- 568
I was very disappointed in mine but have come to tolerate it more on short-ish trips. Will certainly be considering modifications... but few people ever want suspension to be softer/longer travel than standard, so I'm not sure aftermarket parts will help... think I might need Ford Ka parts
Yes they will !
Since your 500 is 3 years old despite only having low mileage the rear shocks are not up to much. I had them replaced under warranty on the first 500 (in its 3rd year) and a set lined on for the 2nd before I sold it.
The Ka parts wouldn't suit. The OEM shock on the 1.4 is a different length to the 1.2.
Shocks are easy to change on the rear of the 500 and are nearly a DIY.
Choice comes down to a Twin Tube (std. type shock) or a performance orientated one.
You can replace the rear shocks with something similiar in a reputable make for £67. For a realistic price I'm included my local supplier & it comes to €130 for a pair.
If you plum for some 'proper' shocks on the rear (Koni) £200 + delivery will do and possibly the ones I'd go for.
FSDs are the ultimate but would only put them on the front. On the back I reckon they would last no more that 40K but you will have a life time guarantee - I have seen them for £495 on the MiTo but prices yo yo a bit.
From a test drive on standard shocks on a 155TB vs. adaptive shocks on a MiTo QV the difference was incredible. Could not feel the speed bumps and no crashing. Much more controlled. FSDs supposedly minic this setup.
So the issue you have can be significantly improved. I would stick with the standard springs already fitted on the 500 1.4 (they are already lowered by 10mm compared with standard).
Replacing the rear bumps stops with the Fiat coupe ones 'wraps it up'.
KYB Excel-G £27.62+vat
Equivalent KYB shock from my local supplier at €65
PR from Koni on a 500 transformed with Sports equipped kit
Panda forum and the success it had on the 100HP
Koni Sport Rear damper £101.38
Bilstein – high quality shocksbut possibly too stiff (beware of the complaints from this supplier)
Koni FSD kit £553
Fiat coupe bump stops (for the rear) £6 & £24
This post contains affiliate links which may earn a commission at no additional cost to you.
Personally I don't agree that FSD's wouldn't last longer than 40k miles. My dad has a set of red Koni inserts on his 504 for probably about 15 years and a few miles and they're still fine
Also, the Bilstein's you've linked to from Gazella (who personally I wouldn't buy from for reasons you've alluded to) won't be too stiff, B4's are just normal OE replacements unlike the B14 coilovers which would of course be stiffer. Seeing how cheap a set of B4's are does have me thinking about them
This post contains affiliate links which may earn a commission at no additional cost to you.
- Joined
- May 15, 2011
- Messages
- 3,769
- Points
- 568
Personally I don't agree that FSD's wouldn't last longer than 40k miles. My dad has a set of red Koni inserts on his 504 for probably about 15 years and a few miles and they're still fine
The problem with the Konis were touched on before on here.
Here is a thread on the other Abarth section where a poll was conducted for those who had problems.
You also have to ask yourself what aren’t the Koni FSDs only on the front and not on the rear on the North American A500 model.
This is a reality check on the design – they are not the best thing since sliced bread.
If you google for feedback on the Koni FSDs the general consensus is that they don’t last. They cannot be repaired – they’re replaced and it can take up to 2 months. Warranty is limited in that it only applies to the original owner of the shocks.
One of the benefits of the shocks is if someone bought them for a F500 they should work on a A500. That cannot be same of a replacement OEM shock. Unsure about other makes listed here.
The issue I understand is that the rear suspension travel on the 500 is too short to suit a Koni FSD with the MINIs suffering the same fate.
Also, the Bilstein's you've linked to from Gazella (who personally I wouldn't buy from for reasons you've alluded to) won't be too stiff, B4's are just normal OE replacements unlike the B14 coilovers which would of course be stiffer. Seeing how cheap a set of B4's are does have me thinking about them
Bilsteins do look good value but I would want the comfort of a Twin tube or an FSD. But on the back I might be able to do without it.
Last edited:
The B4's are twintube dampers.
The beauty of monotube dampers like the B14's is that they can be rebuilt over and over again and you can even have them revalved to make them softer or harder.
Fair point regarding the FSD's, I do remember it coming up before. I do seem to remember there being a revision to the dampers to cure the problems?
Last edited:
- Joined
- May 15, 2011
- Messages
- 3,769
- Points
- 568
In hindsight I might have been harsh about the FSDs. KONI may well have worked on it. Did enquire about getting the Fronts only before and they would have cost £200 each. So a kit at £550 is really the way to go.
On the KONIs you are getting a life guarantee. What put me off them before was that it was for the original owner and the registration number from your car had to be given. So if you switched cars the warranty was gone but then how are they to know.
I was mis-lead by the speel on the Gazella website where it gave the impression they were monotube. But you are correct they are Twin tube which is not necessarily a bad thing on the 500.
There's an explanation on here on the Mono & Twin but it does NOT apply to a 500 given the limited range. Some would refer to the B4s as not being 'proper' Bilsteins like the B6s & B8s which are mono-tube and are available on the MiTo but NOT the 500.
It would appear that aside from the B14s that you mentioned previously on performance kits on most cars the shocks are Monotube at the front and Twin Tube on the back. The GTX kit by AVO is just that but at £1000+ it's pricey but it includes the springs and all and was developed for the Abarth racing series so it would probably be 'too much' for a 500 or even a 1.4
What you can do is buy the rear shocks on their own from AVO for £70+vat. :idea: These are adjustable on the car
unlike the KONI Sports which are generally done OFF the car - that said noticed on the Panda section that someone managed to 'get their hand in' with the car up on the jack to adjust the KONIs.The Bilstein B4s to me see expensive for what they are. Good feedback on them being a quality shock and being 10-20% stiffer than an OEM. But I would be VERY tempted to go with the AVO. And these shocks are the EXACT same ones that come off the GTX kit.
If budget is tight a new OEM replacement shock at £25 is not to be sniffed at but this one is only for the 1.2 & MJ.
http://www.avouk.com/MotorsportFrameset-84.htm
Click RACE
Click GTX kits
Scroll down to GTX News
Hopefully someone on the FF will take the plunge on the AVOs and give feedback.
Attachments
Last edited:
Sorry, my bad. The B4's are actually monotube dampers :doh:In hindsight I might have been harsh about the FSDs. KONI may well have worked on it. Did enquire about getting the Fronts only before and they would have cost £200 each. So a kit at £550 is really the way to go.
On the KONIs you are getting a life guarantee. What put me off them before was that it was for the original owner and the registration number from your car had to be given. So if you switched cars the warranty was gone but then how are they to know.
I was mis-lead by the speel on the Gazella website where it gave the impression they were monotube. But you are correct they are Twin tube which is not necessarily a bad thing on the 500.
There's an explanation on here on the Mono & Twin but it does NOT apply to a 500 given the limited range. Some would refer to the B4s as not being 'proper' Bilsteins like the B6s & B8s which are mono-tube and are available on the MiTo but NOT the 500.
It would appear that aside from the B14s that you mentioned previously on performance kits on most cars the shocks are Monotube at the front and Twin Tube on the back. The GTX kit by AVO is just that but at £1000+ it's pricey but it includes the springs and all and was developed for the Abarth racing series so it would probably be 'too much' for a 500 or even a 1.4
What you can do is buy the rear shocks on their own from AVO for £70+vat. :idea: These are adjustable on the car
The Bilstein B4s to me see expensive for what they are. Good feedback on them being a quality shock and being 10-20% stiffer than an OEM. But I would be VERY tempted to go with the AVO. And these shocks are the EXACT same ones that come off the GTX kit.
If budget is tight a new OEM replacement shock at £25 is not to be sniffed at but this one is only for the 1.2 & MJ.
http://www.avouk.com/MotorsportFrameset-84.htm
Click RACE
Click GTX kits
Scroll down to GTX News
Hopefully someone on the FF will take the plunge on the AVOs and give feedback.
I think the Bilstein's on my 131 were B4's and lasted 15 years till the car was scrapped and didn't have any leaks or anything. Obviously they probably weren't working at peak efficiency though.
In hindsight I might have been harsh about the FSDs. KONI may well have worked on it. Did enquire about getting the Fronts only before and they would have cost £200 each. So a kit at £550 is really the way to go.
On the KONIs you are getting a life guarantee. What put me off them before was that it was for the original owner and the registration number from your car had to be given. So if you switched cars the warranty was gone but then how are they to know.
I was mis-lead by the speel on the Gazella website where it gave the impression they were monotube. But you are correct they are Twin tube which is not necessarily a bad thing on the 500.
There's an explanation on here on the Mono & Twin but it does NOT apply to a 500 given the limited range. Some would refer to the B4s as not being 'proper' Bilsteins like the B6s & B8s which are mono-tube and are available on the MiTo but NOT the 500.
It would appear that aside from the B14s that you mentioned previously on performance kits on most cars the shocks are Monotube at the front and Twin Tube on the back. The GTX kit by AVO is just that but at £1000+ it's pricey but it includes the springs and all and was developed for the Abarth racing series so it would probably be 'too much' for a 500 or even a 1.4
What you can do is buy the rear shocks on their own from AVO for £70+vat. :idea: These are adjustable on the car
The Bilstein B4s to me see expensive for what they are. Good feedback on them being a quality shock and being 10-20% stiffer than an OEM. But I would be VERY tempted to go with the AVO. And these shocks are the EXACT same ones that come off the GTX kit.
If budget is tight a new OEM replacement shock at £25 is not to be sniffed at but this one is only for the 1.2 & MJ.
http://www.avouk.com/MotorsportFrameset-84.htm
Click RACE
Click GTX kits
Scroll down to GTX News
Hopefully someone on the FF will take the plunge on the AVOs and give feedback.
Only had my car a week, and a loan car for another week (another story) but I am finding the rear suspension pretty bad.
You have all experienced this I'm sure, when you drive a little quick over a speed bump, the car hits the bump stops which then rebounds the back end skyward.
I've never had this in any other car. My Caravelle deals with the same bumps fine and the C1 flies over them like a well sorted motocross bike.
So I'm thinking of changing the rear dampers, the front end seems pretty much ok. These avo ones look like they could be worth trying?
Edit:
Just spoke to avo, and they have stock and I've placed an order. they'll be here tomorrow.
I'll drop them to my dealer who has my car and they can bung them on whilst the are messing with my fuel tank.
Last edited:
- Joined
- May 15, 2011
- Messages
- 3,769
- Points
- 568
Maxi - you were right the first time.
The B4s are twin tube since they are 'sold' as OEM replacements.http://www.balancemotorsport.co.uk/sitepage/Bilstein.html
From a simple B4 damper on an original Fiat Panda to…the monotube principle in the yellow Sport B6 and B8 dampers as well as the B14 and B16 coilovers. Bilstein B4 dampers are gas assisted original equipment quality shock absorbers.
This is the first time that I've seen the TA listed. The Bilstein part number of Bil 0146124 is same across the 500 models.
http://web1.carparts-cat.com/default.aspx?230=1&34=0,100121&36=854&35=0&32=2723&14=4&10=BF823102EFEC569FE040A8C0143E25D0018004&12=130
Only getting a chance to reply now (see you've put the order in) but I had a quick look at the competitor shock - the Koni Sports and checking a supplier web site it lists them as only having a 3 year manufacturer's warranty (applies to the FSD) which is different to the 'life time' that I was lead to believe.
From a test drive back to back on a TA & 1.4 I felt that the TA could warranty a slightly lower set of springs like the ones on the 1.4 which are 10mm lower. Realise that Eibach reputedly make the best springs but I wouldn't be happy to drop 35mm on the back. Noticed Koni are also offering springs now. I would be tempted to fit the 1.4 springs even though the OEM stuff is slated for quality. Since the TA & the 1.4 weight the same at 930kgs I still can't understand why they weren't fitted given the performance aspirations of the TA. Shorter bumps stops should also help (covered earlier on).
On a request on the AF on the best 'value' shocks for the MiTo what came back was the FSDs were the preferred choice and supposedly worked the best.
J333EVO first mentioned the AVOs on the FF some time back and mentioned that whatever teething issues they had they got them sorted out. Here's fingers crossed that they'll work out for you but at £140+vat+delivery they are IMHO worth taking a chance on.
Last edited:
loveshandbags
Yes, it's strange that given the "sporty" aspirations of the Twinair model they fitted standard lounge and pop suspension.
The 16's on the plus model make the car look like its jacked up. Maybe I should get some all terrain tyres.
As you say, the avo dampers are cheap at the price and are adjustable on the car as the adjuster is at the bottom. Got to worth a try. BTW the warranty is 2 years on them.
Yes, it's strange that given the "sporty" aspirations of the Twinair model they fitted standard lounge and pop suspension.
The 16's on the plus model make the car look like its jacked up. Maybe I should get some all terrain tyres.
As you say, the avo dampers are cheap at the price and are adjustable on the car as the adjuster is at the bottom. Got to worth a try. BTW the warranty is 2 years on them.
Last edited:
Well, got the dampers today.
In my laboratory controlled experiment I have found that the damper is a lot harder to compress with the dial turned all the way to harder than when turned all the way to the softest. There are about 12 settings.
Coming to work today, I turned a 90 degree left hander pretty quickly as that's the way I drive to conserve fuel by not using the brakes. This road I turned into had many "tracks" from various trenches dug up by water works, electric company, gas company, and just about anyone else who cares to destroy the surface. As I whizzed around the rear end rode over each track jumping an inch or so each time. I reckon the back end must have moved a good 6 inches.
That is not good! if I was really caning it at high speed (this corner was about 20-25mph) who knows have far I could upset it?
I know this is a complaint with the Panda too.
I'm hoping these dampers will go some way to curing this hopping?
I'll start a new thread with my thoughts on them once I get me own car back and put them on as I've gone way off topic here.
In my laboratory controlled experiment I have found that the damper is a lot harder to compress with the dial turned all the way to harder than when turned all the way to the softest
. There are about 12 settings.Coming to work today, I turned a 90 degree left hander pretty quickly as that's the way I drive to conserve fuel by not using the brakes. This road I turned into had many "tracks" from various trenches dug up by water works, electric company, gas company, and just about anyone else who cares to destroy the surface. As I whizzed around the rear end rode over each track jumping an inch or so each time. I reckon the back end must have moved a good 6 inches.
That is not good! if I was really caning it at high speed (this corner was about 20-25mph) who knows have far I could upset it?
I know this is a complaint with the Panda too.
I'm hoping these dampers will go some way to curing this hopping?
I'll start a new thread with my thoughts on them once I get me own car back and put them on as I've gone way off topic here.
Last edited:
Yeah the rear end can be quite skittish. I was on a private road the other day doing quite some speed and there was a left hander coming up with a bit of a mini crest in the road on a downhill stretch, back end went light end started to come aroundWell, got the dampers today.
In my laboratory controlled experiment I have found that the damper is a lot harder to compress with the dial turned all the way to harder than when turned all the way to the softest
Coming to work today, I turned a 90 degree left hander pretty quickly as that's the way I drive to conserve fuel by not using the brakes. This road I turned into had many "tracks" from various trenches dug up by water works, electric company, gas company, and just about anyone else who cares to destroy the surface. As I whizzed around the rear end rode over each track jumping an inch or so each time. I reckon the back end must have moved a good 6 inches.
That is not good! if I was really caning it at high speed (this corner was about 20-25mph) who knows have far I could upset it?
I know this is a complaint with the Panda too.
I'm hoping these dampers will go some way to curing this hopping?
I'll start a new thread with my thoughts on them once I get me own car back and put them on as I've gone way off topic here.
I've had the back end skip around like you described which isn't too bad when you're only doing 20 mph it's no biggie. If you're a keen driver I suggest that you go for a drive on a nice bit of quiet b road with some straights and bumps where you can exceed the speed limit and experience just how bad it is before you change the dampers. Thankfully at speed it doesn't seem to skip quite as violently as it does when you're going slowly but it is unnerving nonetheless.
- Joined
- May 15, 2011
- Messages
- 3,769
- Points
- 568
...the Bilstein's you've linked to from Gazella (who personally I wouldn't buy from for reasons you've alluded to) won't be too stiff, B4's are just normal OE replacements unlike the B14 coilovers which would of course be stiffer. Seeing how cheap a set of B4's are does have me thinking about them
Double checked the prices on the B4s and if you could price match Gazella prices it would be a bargain judging by the list price. Ideal for those who don't want to fine-tune adjustments.
Well, got the dampers today.
In my laboratory controlled experiment I have found that the damper is a lot harder to compress with the dial turned all the way to harder than when turned all the way to the softest
Had a good look at that shock and it looks truely orgasmic.
Attachments
Am I reading this wrong or does it say 8500 euros?
That must be a mistake, are they missing the decimal point?
Yes. 85 euros
If anything the prices on the gazella site are a bit high?Double checked the prices on the B4s and if you could price match Gazella prices it would be a bargain judging by the list price. Ideal for those who don't want to fine-tune adjustments.
Had a good look at that shock and it looks truely orgasmic.
- Joined
- May 15, 2011
- Messages
- 3,769
- Points
- 568
Individual prices of £85x2, £71x2 = £312+vat = £374.40
Gazella price is £275. I'm assuming that it includes VAT.
If the VAT is included that's a saving of £100 if you manage to get them.
Those prices on the Bilstein site are in Euros rememberIndividual prices of £85x2, £71x2 = £312+vat = £374.40
Gazella price is £275. I'm assuming that it includes VAT.
If the VAT is included that's a saving of £100 if you manage to get them.
- Joined
- May 15, 2011
- Messages
- 3,769
- Points
- 568
Those prices on the Bilstein site are in Euros remember
In that case you'd be mad to buy off Gazella :doh: given that the Euro rate at the moment is €1 to £0.804.
Another good price and with the strength of Sterling these seem cheap...
http://seekpart24.com/bilstein/shock-absorber-19184104?c=100121
