Technical The end is nigh for bumble?

[The Panda Nut]

Some great suggestions already given. I don't think it sounds terminal or big component either. If its only going to net £400 drive it intil it stops which It likely won't until its a lot worse and then sell it for scrap which should net £100+ or break it for spares, although Ive been there many times and never made any money... Just a load of work. If its really a monor milage player try some Molyslip oil additive for under £10 it might change things for the better and / or make something change and give you an indication. Bestof luck with this

 

[Popitinpete]

'Morning Pete. Just noticed your post here and wondering if you've anything more concrete by way of a diagnostic which has led you to believe it's the oil pump. I ask because what you describe here, especially as you've covered another 30,000 miles since you first noticed it, isn't what I'd call a typical symptom of oil pump problems. For instance, have you connected an oil pressure gauge and monitored the pump performance directly? I'm not saying your conclusion is wrong, just puzzled as to how you've got there.

Hi , I sort of put two and two together really because it's temperature related , from cold nothing , really hot nothing , normal running about nothing , it's that turning it off from warm/hot and restarting about 45 mins later that the clicking/tapperty sound comes on and only on certain revs about 1500 rpm, and lasts for less than a minute , then silent.
I found out when on one of my many tracking adjusting missions ( I sent you a message about this yesterday, another ancient thread) I was adjusting the o/s/f track rod just at the right time , about 45 minutes after I had returned from a journey, the usual time it happens , whilst under the car I could hear the tapping very clearly behind the bottom crank pulley, I stopped what I was doing and did the classic long screwdriver stethoscope trick on the oil pump housing and it was very loud , 100% oil pump backlash noise , nothing else . I let it tick over for a bit ( I adjust the tracking , try it down the road , then adjust as necessary hence the car was running at the time) and sure enough the pump quietened down and when checked with the stethoscope it was lovely and smooth. No I've not done a pressure check mainly because it's not really an oil ' pressure' problem, it's done 30k miles since , oil light goes straight out with no flickering, and the oil is still the colour of honey when I change it so I'm not worried about black death blocking the pick up pipe.
Incidentally our other panda owned from new , 2009 , full service history 40k miles 1.1 eco does the same but only very slightly, I get to drive this to Tesco's once a week to keep things moving and it's up to temperature by the time we get there , 45 minutes later , I started it up , played with the revs , say 1500 rpm and it did the same.... albeit a lot more quietly than mine , but it did it and this engine has 40k miles from new.
I believe it's the tolerances at certain temperatures making the noise and when hot/ warm oil starts getting pumped through the pump and the heat from the friction close those tolerances, ergo , the noise stops.
Could a few more people try this please, see if it's a ' thing' we just don't notice .....

Many thanks

 

[Popitinpete]

, I sort of put two and two together really because it's temperature related , from cold nothing , really hot nothing , normal running about nothing , it's that turning it off from warm/hot and restarting about 45 mins later that the clicking/tapperty sound comes on and only on certain revs about 1500 rpm, and lasts for less than a minute , then silent.
I found out when on one of my many tracking adjusting missions ( I sent you a message about this yesterday, another ancient thread) I was adjusting the o/s/f track rod just at the right time , about 45 minutes after I had returned from a journey, the usual time it happens , whilst under the car I could hear the tapping very clearly behind the bottom crank pulley, I stopped what I was doing and did the classic long screwdriver stethoscope trick on the oil pump housing and it was very loud , 100% oil pump backlash noise , nothing else . I let it tick over for a bit ( I adjust the tracking , try it down the road , then adjust as necessary hence the car was running at the time) and sure enough the pump quietened down and when checked with the stethoscope it was lovely and smooth. No I've not done a pressure check mainly because it's not really an oil ' pressure' problem, it's done 30k miles since , oil light goes straight out with no flickering, and the oil is still the colour of honey when I change it so I'm not worried about black death blocking the pick up pipe.
Incidentally our other panda owned from new , 2009 , full service history 40k miles 1.1 eco does the same but only very slightly, I get to drive this to Tesco's once a week to keep things moving and it's up to temperature by the time we get there , 45 minutes later , I started it up , played with the revs , say 1500 rpm and it did the same.... albeit a lot more quietly than mine , but it did it and this engine has 40k miles from new.
I believe it's the tolerances at certain temperatures making the noise and when hot/ warm oil starts getting pumped through the pump and the heat from the friction close those tolerances, ergo , the noise stops.
Could a few more people try this please, see if it's a ' thing' we just don't notice .....

Some great suggestions already given. I don't think it sounds terminal or big component either. If its only going to net £400 drive it intil it stops which It likely won't until its a lot worse and then sell it for scrap which should net £100+ or break it for spares, although Ive been there many times and never made any money... Just a load of work. If its really a monor milage player try some Molyslip oil additive for under £10 it might change things for the better and / or make something change and give you an indication. Bestof luck with this

 

[Popitinpete]

I didn't do one because it's not a pressure problem , this isn't my first rodeo, working on cars for nearly 50 years , 35 of those professionally, I own and restore classic cars and bikes , please don't judge people without in-depth knowledge of their credentials first , no hate by the way, but I don't like being told what I ' should have done a long time ago' you have no idea what steps I've taken and are only guessing at best. Still no hate by the way.

Definitely do an oil pressure reading. Should have done that long time ago.

, I sort of put two and two together really because it's temperature related , from cold nothing , really hot nothing , normal running about nothing , it's that turning it off from warm/hot and restarting about 45 mins later that the clicking/tapperty sound comes on and only on certain revs about 1500 rpm, and lasts for less than a minute , then silent.
I found out when on one of my many tracking adjusting missions ( I sent you a message about this yesterday, another ancient thread) I was adjusting the o/s/f track rod just at the right time , about 45 minutes after I had returned from a journey, the usual time it happens , whilst under the car I could hear the tapping very clearly behind the bottom crank pulley, I stopped what I was doing and did the classic long screwdriver stethoscope trick on the oil pump housing and it was very loud , 100% oil pump backlash noise , nothing else . I let it tick over for a bit ( I adjust the tracking , try it down the road , then adjust as necessary hence the car was running at the time) and sure enough the pump quietened down and when checked with the stethoscope it was lovely and smooth. No I've not done a pressure check mainly because it's not really an oil ' pressure' problem, it's done 30k miles since , oil light goes straight out with no flickering, and the oil is still the colour of honey when I change it so I'm not worried about black death blocking the pick up pipe.
Incidentally our other panda owned from new , 2009 , full service history 40k miles 1.1 eco does the same but only very slightly, I get to drive this to Tesco's once a week to keep things moving and it's up to temperature by the time we get there , 45 minutes later , I started it up , played with the revs , say 1500 rpm and it did the same.... albeit a lot more quietly than mine , but it did it and this engine has 40k miles from new.
I believe it's the tolerances at certain temperatures making the noise and when hot/ warm oil starts getting pumped through the pump and the heat from the friction close those tolerances, ergo , the noise stops.
Could a few more people try this please, see if it's a ' thing' we just don't notice .....