General Strong UT

[M@nticore]

Does anyone else SEE a 16v engine on those pics? i don't, all i see is a metal plate on the head, for all all i know it could be the stock engine with exagerated claims.

dunno about you, but i see the intake at the radiator side and the exhaust at the rear and the standard ut's intake and exhaust sits on the same side. it's the same as the 1600 16v palio if you just look correctly!

 

[charlieboy]

Well, before we all got to arguing about whether the featured Uno is realistic with it's power figures or not, how about we say 'thank you' to M@nticore for taking the time and trouble to scan and post it for us?

yeah, i must say thanks, i enjoyed having a read of that!

charlie

 

[Louie Bee]

:yeahthat:.

Nice one Chas and M@nticore .

 

[smokeme]

dunno about you, but i see the intake at the radiator side and the exhaust at the rear and the standard ut's intake and exhaust sits on the same side. it's the same as the 1600 16v palio if you just look correctly!

I see that but for all i know it could be a simple 16v ne swap with the UT internals in it , the block can be sleeved down to size and the internals will fit. Much cheaper and simpler then fooling around with fitting the 16v head.

 

[Chas Uno]

Does anyone else SEE a 16v engine on those pics? i don't, all i see is a metal plate on the head, for all all i know it could be the stock engine with exagerated claims.

I'm not sure Smokeme. Seems a bit strange that the article only gives a few picture angles of the engine compartment, and it seems very unclear as to what exactly the engine is.

Also, I've never seen a 16V FIRE engine in the flesh so I don't know what it looks like, but it does seem surprising that they switched the sides of the exhaust and inlet of the cylinder head

The normal 8V FIRE engines have the exhaust at the front and the inlet at the back. But in those pictures it appears to have the exhaust at the back and the inlet at the front??????

I do agree with you though, that rather than going to all that trouble to fit the 16V FIRE head to the turbo's ohc engine block, it would make more sense to fit a whole 16V super FIRE engine after modifying its internals to turbo spec. Plus the 16V engine would drop straight into place based as it is on the 8V FIRE engine.

In fact, I'm begining to think that is what they did, and it might explain all the custom ECU's (rather than use the standard turbo ECU meant for a different engine) and the fact that they were so cagey in explaining how they got the 16V head fitted.

Anyone have a picture of a 16V super FIRE engine we can see?

 

[Aceuno]

We have had this discussion on the abarth uno turbo club sa before...for a long time!

And as we know this guy only raced once..where he got "12,5", appartly he breaks his sideshalfts on the dyno so he cant dyno it. No body can actually say the car is that strong cos we never saw it running!

The magizine where its was featured only writes what the owner tells them, so if you say " i have a 800cc 24valve with 1000hp" they would post it. Not saying the mag is bad, just they cant say the guy is lying.

The guy says he spent R200 000 on the engine.

I cant say that its not true but ja!

BTW the strongest Uno turbo in SA that i know of, is the yokohama sponsered uno and did a 12.4 recently and before that the recond was just under 13sec. He is making about 250kw.

 

[sumplug]

We have had this discussion on the abarth uno turbo club sa before...for a long time!

And as we know this guy only raced once..where he got "12,5", appartly he breaks his sideshalfts on the dyno so he cant dyno it. No body can actually say the car is that strong cos we never saw it running!

The magizine where its was featured only writes what the owner tells them, so if you say " i have a 800cc 24valve with 1000hp" they would post it. Not saying the mag is bad, just they cant say the guy is lying.

The guy says he spent R200 000 on the engine.

I cant say that its not true but ja!

BTW the strongest Uno turbo in SA that i know of, is the yokohama sponsered uno and did a 12.4 recently and before that the recond was just under 13sec. He is making about 250kw.

its not power that makes 1/4 mile times, but a large flat torque curve.

 

[M@nticore]

I'm not sure Smokeme. Seems a bit strange that the article only gives a few picture angles of the engine compartment, and it seems very unclear as to what exactly the engine is.

Also, I've never seen a 16V FIRE engine in the flesh so I don't know what it looks like, but it does seem surprising that they switched the sides of the exhaust and inlet of the cylinder head

The normal 8V FIRE engines have the exhaust at the front and the inlet at the back. But in those pictures it appears to have the exhaust at the back and the inlet at the front??????

I do agree with you though, that rather than going to all that trouble to fit the 16V FIRE head to the turbo's ohc engine block, it would make more sense to fit a whole 16V super FIRE engine after modifying its internals to turbo spec. Plus the 16V engine would drop straight into place based as it is on the 8V FIRE engine.

In fact, I'm begining to think that is what they did, and it might explain all the custom ECU's (rather than use the standard turbo ECU meant for a different engine) and the fact that they were so cagey in explaining how they got the 16V head fitted.

Anyone have a picture of a 16V super FIRE engine we can see?

The palio 1600 16v doesn't have a FIRE engine as far as i know, anyone may correct me if i'm wrong.

 

[M@nticore]

We have had this discussion on the abarth uno turbo club sa before...for a long time!

And as we know this guy only raced once..where he got "12,5", appartly he breaks his sideshalfts on the dyno so he cant dyno it. No body can actually say the car is that strong cos we never saw it running!

The magizine where its was featured only writes what the owner tells them, so if you say " i have a 800cc 24valve with 1000hp" they would post it. Not saying the mag is bad, just they cant say the guy is lying.

The guy says he spent R200 000 on the engine.

I cant say that its not true but ja!

BTW the strongest Uno turbo in SA that i know of, is the yokohama sponsered uno and did a 12.4 recently and before that the recond was just under 13sec. He is making about 250kw.

that is with big boost and nitrouse, the fastes turbo alone is 13s and the owner is Jose from jedi motorsport

 

[uno_jens.]

150 kW at the wheels sounds about right at 1 bar.. with the 16v and 102 octane..
That CR of 7.7 is still the same? With another head?

But whats amaze me is that everything is exactly 150kW and so on..
even the chipmarket claims 30 bhp in gain, exactly 30 bhp?

The time 13.1 is good, and the speed 176 km/h. The speed tells alot more than the time..
But what about the gearbox? driveshafts? hmm

The tourqefigures like 650 Nm is often missunderstanding like this Cherry turbo:

 

[Dunc Uno Turbo]

^^^^ that is VERY misunderstanding! just over 200bhp but 950 tourqe wise, fook me!

Dunc

 

[Chas Uno]

What is even more confusing about that graph, is that going by the shape of the power/ torque curves they look like they are the wrong way round!

The alleged 'torque' graph has the characteristics of a POWER curve (starting low, then a sharp rise, peaking, then tailing off at high revs), and the 'power' graph looks more like a torque curve (fairly flat, gradual increase, then a gradual tailing off plus much lower down than a power curve).

Something doesn't seem right there?

And 950 Nm or torque from a 1.3/ 1.4 turbo engine? I doubt it! Again, it's the equivalent of over 500 lb/ ft of torque. To put it in perspective, some (standard) American muscle cars from the late 60's were only just getting that kind of figure. And they did it from 7 PLUS litres of V8 power, 4 barrel carburetors (or in some cases THREE twin barrel carbs)...

Methinks the curves are correct, but the numbers marking the Y axis of the graph are totally wrong.

Dunc, do you have a rolling road graph of your turbo we can compare this with?

 

[sumplug]

What is even more confusing about that graph, is that going by the shape of the power/ torque curves they look like they are the wrong way round!

The alleged 'torque' graph has the characteristics of a POWER curve (starting low, then a sharp rise, peaking, then tailing off at high revs), and the 'power' graph looks more like a torque curve (fairly flat, gradual increase, then a gradual tailing off plus much lower down than a power curve).

Something doesn't seem right there?

And 950 Nm or torque from a 1.3/ 1.4 turbo engine? I doubt it! Again, it's the equivalent of over 500 lb/ ft of torque. To put it in perspective, some (standard) American muscle cars from the late 60's were only just getting that kind of figure. And they did it from 7 PLUS litres of V8 power, 4 barrel carburetors (or in some cases THREE twin barrel carbs)...

Methinks the curves are correct, but the numbers marking the Y axis of the graph are totally wrong.

Dunc, do you have a rolling road graph of your turbo we can compare this with?

power and torque curves always cross each other at certain revs. so torque for example, will cross through the power curve at say 5200revs[made up figure as an example]. so that graph is bullsh*t.

 

[uno_jens.]

For an example:
922Nm at 3490 rpm
would give : (922*2pi*3490*1.36)/60000 = 458 hp at 3490 rpm

and in reverse 208hp at 5300rpm would give :
(208*60000)/(5300*2pi*1.36) = 275 Nm

The curves crosses each other at 7022 rpm.

rpm = (60000*hp)/(2pi*1.36*Nm) ~7022

 

[uno_jens.]

I am not saying that he with the 16v don´t have 650 Nm because how could I know?

But the output from some rolling road give some strange figures like my example.

 

[sumplug]

according to the graph, he's got 922Nm at 3490rpm of torque.
922 x 0.738 = 680 lbft of torque !!!!
bull sh*t

 

[Dunc Uno Turbo]

yeah, that graph is totally wrong, somethings gone A Wal there lol

Dunc

 

[SteveNZ]

Its a rolling road, the torque figure cannot be taken at face value. There are many gear ratios to alter the torque figure. A computer program then works out the power curve.

If you have a dyno plot showing actual ENGINE torque and/or power, it wil be the same as the graph above but just scaled back by a computer program.

Numbers from a rolling road are not important, you are looking for the shape of the curves. You are also looking for a differences before and after modifications.

 

[Aceuno]

Correct me if im wrong, the graph given is for the v8 not the uno?

 

[sumplug]

Correct me if im wrong, the graph given is for the v8 not the uno?

now that would make a lot of sense