General Stop/Start not working

[steveras57]

What I dislike about the S/S, and hence turn it off, is that I approach a set of traffic lights from a distance, and moderate my speed so that the lights have a high probability of changing before I get there. However, more often than not the lights are still red when I get there, only to change ~2 seconds after I have stopped. But by then the engine has cut out, only to start again almost immediately. This happens enough to make me turn it off.

I agree! only trouble is i cant stand the bleeding orange lamp shining at me all the time! would drive me nuts would have been better if fiat had made the system so the light is on when the systems ACTIVE!

 

[GettinBetter]

No, nor me. Also the dash lights have no dimming facility (unless you know otherwise). When night driving I like the internal lights (all of them) as low as possible.

On my previous car I stuck a piece of tape over the main beam warning lamp, as it was like a headlamp shining in my face.

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

I've just got a new 500 and have problems with stop/start. Sometimes it works, sometimes not. There are no warning lights showing. Been back to dealer and they reckon a battery issue and say running it should resolve. But I've just done 40 mile journey. Outwards, worked fine. Homewards, nothing. Does not make sense as would have thought battery would be charged?

Our cars are well known for doing this. Probably most commonly due to the battery condition monitor being "unhappy" with the state of charge of the battery - The stop start is disabled if the system thinks the battery voltage is low enough that a start can not be guaranteed.

This may simply be due to the engine not having been run for long enough to get a good charge into the battery but it can also be an early indication that a new battery is soon going to be needed. Although these are the two most common reasons there may be other less easily diagnosed faults to find. perhaps one of the simplest things to do is get the battery tested with a modern battery condition tester. This is a procedure which takes just minutes and our local Halfords does it for free. Although I trust our local Halfords, I dare say some organisations might use it as a selling opportunity so ask to observe and see the result. Most of these testers come up with a "Pass" or "Fail" on the screen along with all the actual numerical values. So if you don't understand the numbers on display just look for the "Pass" or "Fail" on the screen (in the event of a Fail, better quality testers will often have the lettering displayed in red but more budget testers will not have a colour screen. Our Halfords are very happy for you to observe). These testers are not just a multimeter but sophisticated testers which pass a small current through the cells to ascertain internal resistance and thus test the condition of the cells. They give a pretty definitive and reliable result.

 

[Johnrambo18]

Our cars are well known for doing this. Probably most commonly due to the battery condition monitor being "unhappy" with the state of charge of the battery - The stop start is disabled if the system thinks the battery voltage is low enough that a start can not be guaranteed.

This may simply be due to the engine not having been run for long enough to get a good charge into the battery but it can also be an early indication that a new battery is soon going to be needed. Although these are the two most common reasons there may be other less easily diagnosed faults to find. perhaps one of the simplest things to do is get the battery tested with a modern battery condition tester. This is a procedure which takes just minutes and our local Halfords does it for free. Although I trust our local Halfords, I dare say some organisations might use it as a selling opportunity so ask to observe and see the result. Most of these testers come up with a "Pass" or "Fail" on the screen along with all the actual numerical values. So if you don't understand the numbers on display just look for the "Pass" or "Fail" on the screen (in the event of a Fail, better quality testers will often have the lettering displayed in red but more budget testers will not have a colour screen. Our Halfords are very happy for you to observe). These testers are not just a multimeter but sophisticated testers which pass a small current through the cells to ascertain internal resistance and thus test the condition of the cells. They give a pretty definitive and reliable result.

But it's a new car so the battery must be A1...

 

[steveras57]

No, nor me. Also the dash lights have no dimming facility (unless you know otherwise). When night driving I like the internal lights (all of them) as low as possible.

On my previous car I stuck a piece of tape over the main beam warning lamp, as it was like a headlamp shining in my face.

you can dim the speedo illumination level via the menu buttons next to the unit! i think you have to have the lights turned on to access the sub menu ! cant change the led warning lamps though!.

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

What I dislike about the S/S, and hence turn it off, is that I approach a set of traffic lights from a distance, and moderate my speed so that the lights have a high probability of changing before I get there. However, more often than not the lights are still red when I get there, only to change ~2 seconds after I have stopped. But by then the engine has cut out, only to start again almost immediately. This happens enough to make me turn it off.

Luckily for us our old 169 model Panda (2010) doesn't have stop start! but my boy's 2012 Punto does. the car was bought used and the stop star never worked. About 2 years later the car started failing to start when left for a couple of days or when the weather was very cold. Bought a new battery and the stop start has worked ever since - until a few months ago when the Blue and Me failed and is now putting a parasitic overnight drain on the battery.

I really dislike stop start for a number of reasons. Of course, as you mention, it can be caught out but I also feel for the flywheel ring gear and starter pinion. I also wonder about the advisability of it's use on turboed engines where any reduction in oilflow to the turbo must be detrimental. So I always disabled it on the Ibiza and now I'm doing the same with my new Scala. The Scala has given me another one to disable on start up - Lane Assist!

 

[steveras57]

Our cars are well known for doing this. Probably most commonly due to the battery condition monitor being "unhappy" with the state of charge of the battery - The stop start is disabled if the system thinks the battery voltage is low enough that a start can not be guaranteed.

This may simply be due to the engine not having been run for long enough to get a good charge into the battery but it can also be an early indication that a new battery is soon going to be needed. Although these are the two most common reasons there may be other less easily diagnosed faults to find. perhaps one of the simplest things to do is get the battery tested with a modern battery condition tester. This is a procedure which takes just minutes and our local Halfords does it for free. Although I trust our local Halfords, I dare say some organisations might use it as a selling opportunity so ask to observe and see the result. Most of these testers come up with a "Pass" or "Fail" on the screen along with all the actual numerical values. So if you don't understand the numbers on display just look for the "Pass" or "Fail" on the screen (in the event of a Fail, better quality testers will often have the lettering displayed in red but more budget testers will not have a colour screen. Our Halfords are very happy for you to observe). These testers are not just a multimeter but sophisticated testers which pass a small current through the cells to ascertain internal resistance and thus test the condition of the cells. They give a pretty definitive and reliable result.

I have a little hand held unit of my own made by topdon i think- it does battery tests, cranking tests for load, and voltage drops and charging etc- think it cost less than £20 well worth it!

 

[GettinBetter]

I also wonder about the advisability of it's use on turboed engines where any reduction in oilflow to the turbo must be detrimental

Good point although unlike the early turbos, they are now water cooled as well, but as you say, stopping the engine with a red hot turbo is just not wanted. I wonder if there's a sensor to stop the S/S if the turbo is too hot?

 

[GettinBetter]

I have a little hand held unit of my own made by topdon i think- it does battery tests, cranking tests for load, and voltage drops and charging etc

I bought one too after all the trouble with my S/S and battery charging issues. Bought the Kingbolen BM580 after watching a guy play with it on YT.

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

But it's a new car so the battery must be A1...

You'd think so wouldn't you, and most likely that will be the case, but it's just remotely possible that the new battery is faulty or may have suffered internal degradation if, perhaps, the car was held in storage for some time before sale. I remember some of the less popular coloured cars showed vin numbers for builds done months before the date of sale. Bright green was almost always one of these and you could sometimes even see early signs of rust inside the likes of bonnet reinforcement members etc. Always tried to sell a Zeibart on them. Any big dealership worth their salt should have a battery condition tester and getting the test done will completely eliminate the battery from the equation?

 

[jrkitching]

But it's a new car so the battery must be A1

Some folks use the term 'new car' to describe a used car which is 'new to them'.

If this is a brand new 2024 registered car, then just take it back to the dealer you bought it from and don't be fobbed off. My S/S worked fine from delivery - no need for any kind of learning period.

If they've let the battery degrade in storage to the point where S/S is no longer working properly, then the battery could well have suffered permanent damage. I'd be wanting a replacement battery if that is the case.

Leaving even a brand new battery in a state of deep discharge can ruin it in a very short period of time.

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

I have a little hand held unit of my own made by topdon i think- it does battery tests, cranking tests for load, and voltage drops and charging etc- think it cost less than £20 well worth it!

I like the look of those too. Their BT200 gets a very good review. Grant at Gendan has been recommending the Foxwell product to me, but it's a bit more money. I've been trying to justify purchasing one to my "Personal Financial Advisor" Aka. Mrs J, - still working on that one.

 

[steveras57]

I like the look of those too. Their BT200 gets a very good review. Grant at Gendan has been recommending the Foxwell product to me, but it's a bit more money. I've been trying to justify purchasing one to my "Personal Financial Advisor" Aka. Mrs J, - still working on that one.

I no longer try to justify anything to the boss! -bearing in mind her default setting is NO to just about anything! i just do it anyway and take the bollocking afterwards! and it makes her feel justified herself in believing im an idiot!

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

If this is a brand new 2024 registered car, then just take it back to the dealer and don't be fobbed off. Mine worked fine from delivery - no need for any kind of learning period.

Good point. I've had the Scala for 5 days now - been meaning to do a bit of a "feature" for you all on it but family health issues have prevented me - anyway, the car is a Pre-registered deal so was actually preregistered by the dealer a number of months ago, for sales figure reasons, and held in their storage compound. until I bought it last week. It had 9 miles on the odometer when I drove it away. For the first day the stop start didn't work but about ten minutes after starting it on the second day it started working and has continued to do so ever since. The battery was obviously just low due to it's being held in storage. I'll be keeping a very close eye on it's charge values over the next few months just in case it's below par. But I'm not expecting problems.

I no longer try to justify anything to the boss! -bearing in mind her default setting is NO to just about anything! i just do it anyway and take the bollocking afterwards! and it makes her feel justified herself in believing im an idiot!

Oh I do like your attitude! Now can I actually be so brave?

 

[Johnrambo18]

You'd think so wouldn't you, and most likely that will be the case, but it's just remotely possible that the new battery is faulty or may have suffered internal degradation if, perhaps, the car was held in storage for some time before sale. I remember some of the less popular coloured cars showed vin numbers for builds done months before the date of sale. Bright green was almost always one of these and you could sometimes even see early signs of rust inside the likes of bonnet reinforcement members etc. Always tried to sell a Zeibart on them. Any big dealership worth their salt should have a battery condition tester and getting the test done will completely eliminate the battery from the equation?

It's possible, as the car was pre registered so could have been kept in storage as you suggest...

 

[The Panda Nut]

Good point. I've had the Scala for 5 days now - been meaning to do a bit of a "feature" for you all on it but family health issues have prevented me - anyway, the car is a Pre-registered deal so was actually preregistered by the dealer a number of months ago, for sales figure reasons, and held in their storage compound. until I bought it last week. It had 9 miles on the odometer when I drove it away. For the first day the stop start didn't work but about ten minutes after starting it on the second day it started working and has continued to do so ever since. The battery was obviously just low due to it's being held in storage. I'll be keeping a very close eye on it's charge values over the next few months just in case it's below par. But I'm not expecting problems.

Oh I do like your attitude! Now can I actually be so brave?

A brand new car then. Result. When I bought my 1st TA in 2017 it was advertised as pre reg. Priced as well. WHen the log book arrived it was actually new firts registered owner. 10 miles o the clock htough 5 were me test drtiving it. Hope your family issues are resolving.

 

[The Panda Nut]

Luckily for us our old 169 model Panda (2010) doesn't have stop start! but my boy's 2012 Punto does. the car was bought used and the stop star never worked. About 2 years later the car started failing to start when left for a couple of days or when the weather was very cold. Bought a new battery and the stop start has worked ever since - until a few months ago when the Blue and Me failed and is now putting a parasitic overnight drain on the battery.

I really dislike stop start for a number of reasons. Of course, as you mention, it can be caught out but I also feel for the flywheel ring gear and starter pinion. I also wonder about the advisability of it's use on turboed engines where any reduction in oilflow to the turbo must be detrimental. So I always disabled it on the Ibiza and now I'm doing the same with my new Scala. The Scala has given me another one to disable on start up - Lane Assist!

Another gadet hater. Some things like auto lights and wipers I do like but things that interfere with the steering im not keen. Im still unconvinced about CBC but its not caused any major issues yet. Auto dipping mirrors are excellent.

 

[Piccolo Nero e Bella]

But it's a new car so the battery must be A1...

NOT!
I bought my TA in July 2013 but it was built in Oct 2012. It had exactly 4km on the clock so that's ten months sitting uncharged and it's likely the battery had never had a full charge. I had the same issues with S/S for a year, with dealers constantly fobbing me off with the line that I wasn't doing enough distance to recharge the battery or that the phone charger was robbing the car of power (yes, really!). After 12 months I was getting p'd off and, armed with knowledge gleaned from this forum, went back and insisted they fix it. Here's the result;

I wasn't aware at the time but the battery they fitted was an ordinary type, not the correct EFB, nonetheless the S/S worked flawlessly for three years Until I finally found and fitted the EFB which is still in the car today, and the S/S is working to spec.

Having said that the S/S is switched off except for the occasional test - I don't do enough miles for it to make the slightest difference so I prefer to save wear and tear. Yes, the baleful orange 'Eye of Sauron' glows at me reproachfully from the dash but I don't even notice it these days.

 

[chris3234]

It's possible, as the car was pre registered so could have been kept in storage as you suggest...

Well Unless it was a factory customer order it's all most certainly spent weeks or months in storage either in a yard or at the dealer waiting to be bought or even put on sale. Even if not pre registered

 

[Johnrambo18]

Well Unless it was a factory customer order it's all most certainly spent weeks or months in storage either in a yard or at the dealer waiting to be bought or even put on sale. Even if not pre registered

Possibility I suppose. This car was registered in Sept 23 and I got it in Feb with only delivery mileage, so it has been stored 4/5 months. But unless the battery was allowed to go flat, you would expect it to be ok. Just tested voltage and getting 12.5