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Technical RECALL: Service Solution for Suspension Springs

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Technical RECALL: Service Solution for Suspension Springs

If anyone is interested I had almost exactly the same thing happen to my recently deceased Tipo.

It didn't have the mechano mod so the spring pierced the tyre :bang:

My Eibachs have arrived and I can spot not sign of taper on the springs (i've not seen those on the mine properly as they're still on the car).
 
"Are you suggesting the springs should be held static within their mounts and that problems occur on some Stilos when the spring slips OR are you suggesting the springs should be free to rotate in their mounts and problem occur when they can’t?"

BOTH!
If the spring was held, unable to rotate at top and bottom then the spring would flex radially when you turn the steering and return to where it was when you straightened up, no problem we would hope




If the spring is allowed to slip (either top or bottom) then it needs to be allowed to slip back again. If it doesn't then you have a wound up spring in need of some rest and relaxation which it takes as soon as it can. That's the creaking noise I reckon when you go over a bump, the spring takes it's chance to straighten back up, often just after the rise when going over a hump as that's when the spring is at least compression

"The notion that creaking suspension could act as an early warning of potential spring failure could certainly prove very useful".

I didn't suggest the amount of creaking is an indication that the spring is imminently going to snap, it isn't the spring itself that's creaking, it's the contact between the spring and the upper support that makes the noise and that's just straightening itself out- so no problem. Some might be noisier than others, it makes no difference. What I'm saying is that I think it's the radial winding up of the spring added to the compression of going over a bump that puts probably twice the extra load on the spring

0900823d8009e21c.gif

It's difficult to see what's actually happening on the road when the spring is under compression because if you jack the car up the spring is relaxed. That's why people had trouble finding the source of the creak when the car was raised but they knew that if they prayed the upper mount liberally the creak would go

Either way, the spring can't take the strain, probably due to a combination of fatigue and stress and eventually snaps.
 
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Deckchair5 said:
"The notion that creaking suspension could act as an early warning of potential spring failure could certainly prove very useful".

I didn't suggest the amount of creaking is an indication that the spring is imminently going to snap, it isn't the spring itself that's creaking, it's the contact between the spring and the upper support that makes the noise and that's just straightening itself out- so no problem. Some might be noisier than others, it makes no difference. What I'm saying is that I think it's the radial winding up of the spring added to the compression of going over a bump that puts probably twice the extra load on the spring
Click to expand...
If the spring is allowed to slip (either top or bottom) then it needs to be allowed to slip back again. If it doesn't then you have a wound up spring in need of some rest and relaxation which it takes as soon as it can. That's the creaking noise I reckon when you go over a bump, the spring takes it's chance to straighten back up, often just after the rise when going over a hump as that's when the spring is at least compression
Click to expand...
OK, I think we need little clarification on this point :chin:

If we assume the creaking noise is the sound of the front suspension returning to an un-stressed state then it must have got into a stressed state in the first place. Does it not follow therefore that a Stilo with creaking front suspension is a Stilo with stressed suspension which may lead to eventual spring failure.

The counter view to this would be that many Stilos, due to reasons yet to be defined, can suffer stressed front suspension whether they're quiet or noisy and therefore the creaking noise has little relevance.

There's a poll running on this at the moment so if there is any correlation then it should become clear :)
 
Yes I don't think the volume of creaking is a factor to failure.
I would think factors that will affect it would be

FATIGUE
age of spring (age of car from new)

LOADING
heavier loading of car
more sports driving style loading the springs more in corners and braking

DRIVING LOADS
frequent bad road surface driving or road humps

OUTSIDE TEMP
near freezing causing more likely brittle fracture of spring

LARGER/HEAVIER WHEELS
causing more mass for the spring to deal with
 
NumanR said:
There seems to have been alot of talk from certain vocal contributors who keep saying that they are going to do this or the other, my question is, if these people are sure that their opinion is correct, then why dont they put there money where there mouth is and get these independent inspections done?
Click to expand...



In reply to your post on this thread and to all the Arthur Daley Dealers on this forum, or any other Stilo owners who has been affected by broken coil springs, I can now say that I have put my money where my mouth is. I have employed the expertise of The Institute of Spring Technology to carry out an analysis on the failure of my third broken spring.
This is exactly what Fiat should have done in November 2006 when they issued this recall and it would appear from my results, that they probably did this and realised the costs involved on 44000 vehicles, so decided to go with the cheap get out, of fitting the crap catcher.
However, due to impending legal action, I cannot post the results of this analysis on the forum, but to confirm or dismiss the many theories on this thread, I can say that the failure of this spring was definitely due to corrosion, however, it is also related to another major factor in the manufacture of these springs.
 
Bombay said:
In reply to your post on this thread and to all the Arthur Daley Dealers on this forum, or any other Stilo owners who has been affected by broken coil springs, I can now say that I have put my money where my mouth is. I have employed the expertise of The Institute of Spring Technology to carry out an analysis on the failure of my third broken spring.
This is exactly what Fiat should have done in November 2006 when they issued this recall and it would appear from my results, that they probably did this and realised the costs involved on 44000 vehicles, so decided to go with the cheap get out, of fitting the crap catcher.
However, due to impending legal action, I cannot post the results of this analysis on the forum, but to confirm or dismiss the many theories on this thread, I can say that the failure of this spring was definitely due to corrosion, however, it is also related to another major factor in the manufacture of these springs.
Click to expand...

;) (y)
 
I will ignore the insult, as this isnt the place for name calling. However, and obviously I realise you are very limited to what you can reveal regarding your results, your results however has shown corrosion to be an issue. However Phil and other people on the forum have said that there was no signs of corrosion on the spring breaks they had, this was why they poopoo'd Fiats report of salt being a contributory factor of the breakages. I eagerly await your further posts after you are able to reveal more of what you have discovered.
Please keep us all informed.
 
NumanR said:
I will ignore the insult, as this isnt the place for name calling. However, and obviously I realise you are very limited to what you can reveal regarding your results, your results however has shown corrosion to be an issue. However Phil and other people on the forum have said that there was no signs of corrosion on the spring breaks they had, this was why they poopoo'd Fiats report of salt being a contributory factor of the breakages. I eagerly await your further posts after you are able to reveal more of what you have discovered.
Please keep us all informed.
Click to expand...

There wasn't any corrosion on my spring brake and the spring mounting plate is clean as a whistle Ask Anthony tutton who is a member on here he has seen the strut and inspected it but I will say this my good friend Bombay has entrusted me with the main cause of the spring brake and as far as corrosion is concerned you lot are miles away from the actual and main cause found during the analysis and whether the springs are old or new their a bloody death trap in waiting :) sorry Bombay for the rant I had to get it of my chest cos as you know this fault is the very thing we ourselves had realised as the main factor in this ..and many including the techs are no where near realising what their driving around on :)
 
Bombay said:
I can say that the failure of this spring was definitely due to corrosion, however, it is also related to another major factor in the manufacture of these springs.
Click to expand...

I am confused now, are you saying Phil that the corrosion was already in the metal during manufacture? Bombay says that corrosion is the cause of the failure, but obviously the cause of the corrosion is due to the manufacturing process itself, or, we wouldnt in Phils words be miles off from the truth. Also from what Phil says the fault is on new springs as well as old, maybe Phil has given more info here than he should.



MOD EDIT - all I did was add quote tags above, and then I thought I would add this note before I get a flood of PMs, usually demanding 'what did you edit?' :spin:
 
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NumanR said:
I will ignore the insult, as this isnt the place for name calling. However, and obviously I realise you are very limited to what you can reveal regarding your results, your results however has shown corrosion to be an issue. However Phil and other people on the forum have said that there was no signs of corrosion on the spring breaks they had, this was why they poopoo'd Fiats report of salt being a contributory factor of the breakages. I eagerly await your further posts after you are able to reveal more of what you have discovered.
Please keep us all informed.
Click to expand...


This was not an insult pal;:D you said “why don’t certain vocal contributors put ((their) correct grammar)) money where ((their) correct grammar)) mouth is. It’s your grammar not me which is insulting you. Now I have insult you! :p and I don’t give a rat’s arse. Every little helps!
As for Dave comments about “Not really worth posting anything at all then is it”. he could have said the same about T14086. (Originally Posted by T14086
“Yes I do have my own theory...and it will stay that way as its 'my' theory.”)
but he chose not to, so it’s not worth you posting these comments either, is it Dave.(n)
I don’t mean to be sarcastic, insulting or anything else, however, I came on this forum to get some intelligent responses to this problem and have sometimes found it to be very useful, on the other hand I don’t suffer fools ;) very gladly, so I will now let the Fools, the Arthur Daley Dealers and the other Theorists carry on this thread, until they disappear up ((their) correct grammar) own arses. :eek:
I have had the intelligence to pay an expert to analyse why these springs are breaking, not keep guessing and I now have the answers, so why don’t some of the above do the same.:bang:
Following my impending court proceedings, I will gladly report back to this forum, for the benefit of those individuals who are concerned for their own and their family’s safety and who are being ripped off by ((their) correct grammar) Dealers and Fiat.
Otherwise, until then, watch your springs, happy and safe motoring to you all.
 
Bombay said:
This was not an insult pal;:D you said “why don’t certain vocal contributors put ((their) correct grammar)) money where ((their) correct grammar)) mouth is. It’s your grammar not me which is insulting you. Now I have insult you! :p and I don’t give a rat’s arse. Every little helps!
As for Dave comments about “Not really worth posting anything at all then is it”. he could have said the same about T14086. (Originally Posted by T14086
“Yes I do have my own theory...and it will stay that way as its 'my' theory.”)
but he chose not to, so it’s not worth you posting these comments either, is it Dave.(n)
I don’t mean to be sarcastic, insulting or anything else, however, I came on this forum to get some intelligent responses to this problem and have sometimes found it to be very useful, on the other hand I don’t suffer fools ;) very gladly, so I will now let the Fools, the Arthur Daley Dealers and the other Theorists carry on this thread, until they disappear up ((their) correct grammar) own arses. :eek:
I have had the intelligence to pay an expert to analyse why these springs are breaking, not keep guessing and I now have the answers, so why don’t some of the above do the same.:bang:
Following my impending court proceedings, I will gladly report back to this forum, for the benefit of those individuals who are concerned for their own and their family’s safety and who are being ripped off by ((their) correct grammar) Dealers and Fiat.
Otherwise, until then, watch your springs, happy and safe motoring to you all.
Click to expand...

Yay Yay for the crusader Bombay :slayer: well done to you.. isnt it nice to get it off your chest and good on you for taking the time and expense doing this on behalf of us members I for one appreciat your effort and concern for us all I hope you have success in your impending court case good luck from me and all the others that support you (y)
 
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